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Old 29th October 2009, 11:25   #31
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Originally Posted by vikrantj View Post
Totally biased survey.
1. Honda's service is better than Toyota.
2. Hyundai down the table and Tata above Hyundai .
3. The industrial average comes to 754 and not 785. I just added all numbers and divided by 11.
4. Mahindra-renault is number 5 with what non-available spares.

--Vikrant
the industrial average needs to be weighted average as the number of people surveyed will be in the ratio of cars sold..... therefore as maruti has a market share of close to 50% the average will be higher than just dividing it by 11.

Can someone pullout 2008 JD Power CSI rankings as well.
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Old 29th October 2009, 12:08   #32
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
The only part of this survey that I'd really agree with is Maruti at the top and Skoda at the absolute bottom.

Honda on 2nd spot? No ways. Toyota below Mahindra...you really have to be kidding me. And Hyundai at the back! They are definitely a no.2 / no.3 spot contender.

Really a rubbish survey. Where are Hindustan Motors or Mitsubishi? Or the Germans (Merc, BMW, VW?)
+1 to that..

A small note at the end of the 2nd page: Included in the study but not ranked due to small sample size are: Mercedes-Benz and Mitsubishi.

Factors comprising overall satisfaction: from page 4

Service Quality : 43%
Service Initiation : 11%
Service Advisor : 14%
Service Facility : 14%
Vehicle Pickup : 17%

Lost in transit: 1%

Surprising that quality of service is given only 43%, no wonder hyundai and toyota are at the bottom. Me suggests - ignore this report! not worth it.
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Old 29th October 2009, 12:27   #33
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Originally Posted by an_and View Post
Me suggests - ignore this report! not worth it.
LOL: JD power have marketed their survey to such an extent over the past decade in India, Its hardly surprising that they've come out with such a result!

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Old 29th October 2009, 14:23   #34
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i have two very serious questions:
1. how is the industry average calculated? i know a few kinds of averages but generally the number of entries above and below average are same. here we have two companies above average and e7-8 below average.. how?
2. has anyone participated in this survey? does anyone know anyone who has?
3. what is the sample size? i know organizations pay JD power to disclose the entire set of survey and all, but i would appreciate if someone can throw some light on the issue.
regards
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Old 29th October 2009, 16:17   #35
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Originally Posted by MCR View Post
Mahindra at number 3. This shows the improvement achieved over years.
Hyundai down at no.8. This shows that Hyundai has become overconfident, is it?
Fiat at No.10. Not the last,phew.
Tata at No.6 . Interesting. On the way up.
Actually, TATA is No. 5 !

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinod_nookala View Post
Thats a 2006 link, i will paste the latest one. Here it is-
2009 India Customer Service Index (CSI) Study | J.D. Power and Associates

Congratulations M&M on being No3 in CSI after Maruti and Honda. Truly a great achievement. I remember from where M&M was and where it is now, i guess from bottom to the top 3 now! In 2006 it was No.5 or 6 and it was almost sharing seat with TATA in 2003 at the bottom most place. SPeaks volumes about the product and aftersales service.

But the question is , are the sales of vehicles directly proportional to CSI ranking? TATA though performing consistantly bad is doing steady numbers.
With a climb from last position to mid-table, I seriously doubt TATA is doing consistently bad.

Sales of vehicle are not directly proportional to company CSI because of range of vehicles offered. M&M is primarily UV manufacturer which has a lower consumer base and high competition (TATA, Chevrolet, Toyota) whereas Maruti, especially in Alto/800 segment is a free player which translates into brand loyalty resulting in a leadership also in segments of Swift/WagonR.

Head to Head, though, I would expect CSI to play a significant role in retail figures since M&M is leader in UV retail, Maruti in Small Car Retail and Honda in Premium Sedan segment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
The only part of this survey that I'd really agree with is Maruti at the top and Skoda at the absolute bottom.

Honda on 2nd spot? No ways. Toyota below Mahindra...you really have to be kidding me. And Hyundai at the back! They are definitely a no.2 / no.3 spot contender.

Really a rubbish survey. Where are Hindustan Motors or Mitsubishi? Or the Germans (Merc, BMW, VW?)
There has to be a significant survey population for a vehicle to be included in survey. Merc, BMW, VW are not selling enough numbers and workshop load is very minute and reach of these cars is not nationwide. HM and Mitsubishi just don't sell enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikrantj View Post
Totally biased survey.
1. Honda's service is better than Toyota.
2. Hyundai down the table and Tata above Hyundai .
3. The industrial average comes to 754 and not 785. I just added all numbers and divided by 11.
4. Mahindra-renault is number 5 with what non-available spares.
--Vikrant
You just can't divide total score by no. of players. As mentioned in one more post, It is a weighted average.

Secondly, This survey is not a competition. A Toyota owner may or may not be also a Honda owner effectively being unknown to service standards of other companies. Therefore, he gauges his personal experience within the company. Hence, if I was a hyundai customer pissed off that my experience was only 95% of last time would reduce the score of Hyundai as opposed to a Tata customer getting 105% compared to last time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nitrogary View Post
i have two very serious questions:
1. how is the industry average calculated? i know a few kinds of averages but generally the number of entries above and below average are same. here we have two companies above average and e7-8 below average.. how?
2. has anyone participated in this survey? does anyone know anyone who has?
3. what is the sample size? i know organizations pay JD power to disclose the entire set of survey and all, but i would appreciate if someone can throw some light on the issue.
regards
nitro
JD Power syndicate decides upon the survey population based on various factor and will include all cars sold in India during a set period. Then, there is a set survey period of 2-3 months during which if a car sold in survey period visits workshop, it is surveyed and results recorded.

The owner of vehicle would not know that he/she was JDP survey customer but dealership personnal usually know this. Hence, such customers are provided a better experience to garner better results .

Finally, all the survey results of each manufacturer are averaged based on some parameters and a composite score is tabulated which is then compared against all other manufacturers.
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Old 29th October 2009, 20:03   #36
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I would certainly put Ford above Tata and Cheverolet. I have had very good service for the last three years in Pune.
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Old 2nd November 2009, 13:27   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandhi View Post
How can FIAT be considered as an individual entry for Dealer Satisfaction Survey? Shouldn't it be TATA-FIAT together?
The survey takes separate responses from Tata and Fiat owners. Reason behind difference in ratings (though they visit the same workshops)? Expectations. The Tata owner is probably prepared for average (and below) levels of service, while Fiat owners may be expecting better from a brand that's rejuvenating itself. Plus, the Linea is positioned at a higher price point than the Indigo, and hence, expectations are higher.
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Old 2nd November 2009, 13:44   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post

Really a rubbish survey. Where are Hindustan Motors or Mitsubishi? Or the Germans (Merc, BMW, VW?)
There is a clear note that is published on why Merc and Mitsubushi are not listed. The note says that due to small sample size, these details are not listed.

Like any other survey (either in Auto industry or IT industry), they are as good as the personal experience one goes through. And again, a lot depends on the sample data that was polled for the survey.

Can we really call it rubbish? I am not sure.
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Old 2nd November 2009, 13:56   #39
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Why is every survey being called rubbish here? Not many of us would go by the survey to buy our cars. Our preferences might differ.
In each of the above responses, one can see someone criticizing the survey because the company selling their car is not above some other company. At least remove the list of cars you own from your signatures, please! It doesn't add any credibility.
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Old 2nd November 2009, 14:28   #40
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In marketing, we have something called paradigms, which means

each one of us want to live in our own WISH world.
which means we believe that what we know is the truth

but most of the time, it is not true

Statistics or objectivity shifts individual as well as collective paradigms.

that is why independent survey's are used by management to challenge the marketeers to do better.

for sure, i won't rubbish the findings, what was true few years ago may not be true now.

At the end of the day

Satisfaction = meeting the expectations
Delight = exceeding the expectations

what ever the customers have on the brand / company / dealership

A customer would typically say the truth whether his / her expectations have been met or not OR exceeded or not.

all those individual feedbacks = sea of opinions = TRUTH.

Last edited by StarVegabond : 2nd November 2009 at 14:30.
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Old 2nd November 2009, 19:51   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by muralisk View Post
There is a clear note that is published on why Merc and Mitsubushi are not listed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
Why is every survey being called rubbish here? Not many of us would go by the survey to buy our cars. Our preferences might differ.
Quote:
Originally Posted by StarVegabond View Post
for sure, i won't rubbish the findings, what was true few years ago may not be true now.
Let's see why:

1. HM-Mitsubishi is not included because of a small sample size? Well, they sell twice the number of cars that Mahindra-Renault do!! Apply the law of averages and they should have had twice as many respondents. If not, the research methodology is flawed. I am surprised to see a small player on the list, but a larger ignored due to a small sample size.

2. JD is funded by the car manufacturers itself. I'm sorry, but I just don't buy these reviews. We have more Honda & Toyota reviews than JD could (I'm willing to bet). In our reviews, Toyota has performed conclusively better than Honda in dealer satisfaction surveys. I'd like to know exactly how Honda ended up on the no.2 spot and Toyota so low.

3. JD's research methodology? A sample example (My experience with JD Power Quality survey). Or how a Buick is supposedly more dependable than a Toyota (Linky)?

4. There are so many parameters & awards released by JD that somehow, some manufacturer is always happy. I remember a recent survey where Skoda was on top.
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Old 2nd November 2009, 20:43   #42
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Let's see why:


3. JD's research methodology? A sample example (My experience with JD Power Quality survey). Or how a Buick is supposedly more dependable than a Toyota (Linky)?

4. There are so many parameters & awards released by JD that somehow, some manufacturer is always happy. I remember a recent survey where Skoda was on top.
+ million to that one. Go to any car showroom and you will find some J D Power award banner / certificate hanging on the wall. J D Power and car manufacturers are a classic example of "Tu meri khuja, main teri khujata hoon" !!

The survey GTO is talking about is this

Skoda was No.1 in Sales Satisfaction Index in 2008. Need I say anything more about the authenticity of J D Power ?
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Old 19th November 2009, 17:03   #43
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What are we debating here?!! JD Power is an independent agency doing a survey with some particular(mathematically selected) sample size. I think it is childish to rubbish it whatever be the individual opinions and readings. The survey is a pure form of sample feedbacks from selected customers on their last experience of sevice. The methodology is statistical and even a student can say statistical tools can predict the outcome in the mathematical language and is the only way of projecting the collective experiences through sampling.

It may not match with TeamBHP opinions(with all due respect to all our opinions) or individual opinions, thatz how the whole surveys work. It may be nearer to truth. but definitely not rubbish.

Skoda came on top in Sales satisfaction study which need not necessarily match with the service experience, many of us have experienced a delightful showroom experience but night mares in workshop experience.

JDP has been doing it international in all major countries and is supposed to reflect the situations as such based on which the manufacturers work on their operations in workshops or showrooms.

I think we can accept the results with a pinch of salt.(definitely we dont hold ground to ridicule it).
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Old 20th November 2009, 14:40   #44
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Originally Posted by rganeshiyer View Post
I am really surprised to see Hyundai come so low. I always thought Hyundai were the second best after Maruti. What are some of the parameters that are tested in the survey ? can anyone throw some light if they know ?

All these surveys are directly propotional to how the Manufacturer's take care of these people, MSIL takes good care of JD Power and they get good rating. The simple fact is Suzuki, Tatas & Hyundai are the 3 most popular cars of India. Honda, Mahindra, Toyota etc. are not exactly top selling cars in India. That means customers are satisfied with these 3 manufacturers whatever be the report of the survey.
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Old 20th November 2009, 15:27   #45
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I own a Maruti and I am happy with their service, after I bought my wagonR, I received calls from Maruti for around six months enquiring about my dealership experience and the performance of the car and anything I want to suggest for improving the service. The other cars we bought were Amby, Padmini and Matiz. Of these the first two were bought second hand, and serviced at local garage. Daewoo service initially was as good if not better as that of Maruti. Now that also goes to the friendly neighborhood mechanic.

I have visited Maruti, Tata, Hyundai, GM, Honda, Ford and Toyota dealerships for enquiry or test drive and there the experience was best with Toyota followed by Tata and the worst was Hyundai. In my three visits to Hyundai, what I noticed was that they were too busy and didn’t have time to attend us. I had mentioned this in my thread in "What Car" section.

So on sales satisfaction index, for me Hyundai is at the bottom, service the owners know better.

I would not call this as totally biased, though it may not reflect the true picture.

Last edited by Car-Agey : 20th November 2009 at 15:29.
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