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Old 3rd June 2005, 12:49   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deepakhon
Just imagine the plight of those 603 people who bought the same product for 250K more...
I agree . But it is only Hyundai being bashed because of such so called (read : un confirmed) discounts?
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Old 3rd June 2005, 13:20   #47
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Default hate game is alrite

But hey..when will the guys stop giving insane discounts..i mean it's daylight robbery to say the least.

I buy a car at 8 Lakhs and the same car someone buys for around 6 lakhs in a couple of months..Dont you care how your customers feel when u give huge discounts...it's not like it's a clearance sale or factory seconds sale .

The Bone of contention is that the makers shud price it prudently the first time and the discounts that the company offer shud not deflate the old customers.. Give some discounts on basis of brand loyalty but not play the vulture game.. No cache in when the heat is ON.

There shud be some regulatory mechanism i feel for fixin prices.

I sound nuts


I have respect for Hyundai as a company as it has given gud products to India and they are doin fine.

Bottomline.. It's pure business and profitablity is all that matters.

Hurry Home
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Old 3rd June 2005, 13:42   #48
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Default Value for money

The problem may be with the interpretation of VFM.

Some auto makers may be making cars with quality glitches .. others may not be giving all features compared to a similar car sold abroad etc etc .. Thats fine if the overall 'Value' perceived by the masses (customers) is acceptable.

To take an example. Would the proposed Tata sub-1 Lakh car have loads of goodies ? No. But for people who would go for it, the biggest value might be that they would own a four wheeler. If the car also has performance within the same price tag, then thats added value. But for the average customer of that car, performance figures would not be top priority. If some of those customers want a bit more 'value', they would try to get hold of some more cash and go for a M-800.

If one wants, say, more quality (that is one of the values) and more performance (another value), then one has to pay more and get it, since it will carry a price. It's another matter that we don't have a choice of quality perfromance cars in all segments. And it's probably because it doesn't yet make business sense.

The costs for building a car also vary from manufacterer to manufacterer. They may not be driven only by the visible features in the car. How is a Superb priced so much more lower than an E ? ACI even ran a comparo between these 2 cars, since they fall in the same bracket. But then, I believe the E still sells more than the Superb. So for those customers, even though its priced way above the Skoda, the Merc is more VFM. They are paying extra for the added benefits in the Merc. For customers who can afford the Merc but are still buying the Skoda, the added benefits of the Merc do not translate into value for them.

Let's face it. We are still essentially a country with limited cash in most peoples hands. Mass market products in this country will always be built to a price and hence features will have to be compromised.
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Old 3rd June 2005, 13:55   #49
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well said shivc. yes, what is important to me might not be important to another person. it all depends on what each person sees as a value for him/herself.
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Old 3rd June 2005, 14:25   #50
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@RX135
firstly you say
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More apt comparison would be Wagon-R and Santro.
and then you go ahead & say
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Really? I think it has better quality than 800, alto.
and then again Maruti cars are much more reliable, FE & low cost of maintainance over Hyundai

Last edited by adya33 : 3rd June 2005 at 14:28.
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Old 3rd June 2005, 14:34   #51
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@Adya33, thanks for pointing it out, but they were said in different context. In first, I just answered to his comparison, and in second, I commented in general about manufacturers.
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Old 3rd June 2005, 21:09   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shuvc
The problem may be with the interpretation of VFM.

Let's face it. We are still essentially a country with limited cash in most peoples hands. Mass market products in this country will always be built to a price and hence features will have to be compromised.
That was extremely well put, shuvc! VFM does mean different things to different people with different amounts of money on hand.

As you so correctly said in your last paragraph about limited cash, the common budget generally available is 4 lakhs. Luckily today, there is an amazing choice available within this range.

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Old 3rd June 2005, 21:16   #53
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Poor Maruti , it is going bankrupt now because of such discounts (?)
Nah the car was overprice in the first place to extract more from the customers.

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If I am not mistaken, I saw your other post which complained about poor brakes on NHC
But the brakes are poor thanx to the poor tyres.

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I would not rubbish it as cheap low grade car
As if i call her a downgrade car but the fact is its just not upto the mark of the Wagon R..

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Some people may still love it, but it is rather outdated car when compared with Santro
Haha.. i would advice you to read jokes on Santro in shifting gear..LOL
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Old 3rd June 2005, 22:35   #54
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but there is a downside of not offering discounts, cars resale values may also fall due to bad performance in sales charts,like that of palio.
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Old 3rd June 2005, 22:48   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montoya

Haha.. i would advice you to read jokes on Santro in shifting gear..LOL

Montoya , those so called Santro jokes you are mentioning are nothing but recycled Skoda jokes in the first place!! Just replace Santor/ Skoda by Ikon/Indica/Petra , and you have a ready set of Ikon jokes, Indiaca jokes, Petra jokes and what not.
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Old 6th June 2005, 11:24   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by man23ish

And i don't think that with their recent desperate moves, hyundai will succeed as a luxury car-maker.. Coz, luxury car buyers are more concerned with the reliability of the brand that they buy.. And luxury car-buyers certainly don't appreciate buying fast-depreciating vehicles.. So i repeat my statement that Hyundai's days are numbered unless they launch their new products at reasonable prices and then stick to their prices..
Hey Manish,

Thats I guess you are being too hard on Hyundai. Their cars do have good reliablilty supported by great A.S.S. It's the Korean image that Hyundai suffers from (not helped by copy paste stuff from their design engineers and their poor marketing stunts). Reliability has never been a problem for Hyundai in India atleast. They fare far more than other car makers here. It's the image that will not allow them to succeed as luxury car makers. I however agree that they can do well only if they stick to their VFM strategies for all categories of their products. People did buy the Sonatas and the Accents as they felt that they were VFM packages compared to the other cars that were available and not because they were superior. I think Hyundai should have stuck with their initial game plan.
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Old 6th June 2005, 12:08   #57
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As if i call her a downgrade car but the fact is its just not upto the mark of the Wagon R..
No offense to Wagon-R owners, but I hardly find anything great about Wagon-R when compared to Santro. May be it is more stable at 80+ speeds, but then both Santro/Wagon-R are meant to be city vehicles and on highways, both will be smoked by Palios, Swifts and may be Getz. The build quality of Wagon-R is average and I would rate it lower than or equal to Santro. And for non-believers, I did hear funny sounds from Wagon-R, which we just took delivery of. I don't see any reason why I should not rate Wagon-R and Santro at same quality level.

May be you can tell me why I should.
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Old 6th June 2005, 12:16   #58
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Elantra is given with 1lac discount and not 2 lacs, we checked with various dealers. Also I did not find anything wrong with the car apart from looks. Its got features which most cars of 15lac range have. Great torque engine, good mileage and cheap service and spares. Why is it bad? Just because its a hyundai? For the petrol engine you have 9lac on road with ABS, traction control, air purification system(trust me it is amazing), trip computer. The diesel is a great performer too rivaling the octavia in performance and beating the rider by a large margin in terms of features. For 10lac on road you get the features of a 14lac octavia with more interior space and better performance.
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Old 6th June 2005, 12:39   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montoya
Play a Bugger game - Elantra.. LOL Well TSK what can i say?? Maruti Zen still lives up to its name. Compare it with a Santro. The zen is faster, pepier, more fuel efficient then the Santro and dead realiable.
Zen is faster yes. Fuel efficient, yes by a little margin. Have owned a santro for 65K kms. Never gave a reliability problem and highway runs used to give 18. I doubt any santro owner will say its not reliable. As for the zen, i cant even sit in the back seat and the front seat is a tight fit too! Santro is a different segment car, more spacious and much more comfortable to sit in.

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I have seen that more people drool on the RS rather then the Accord V6 which does produce 220BhP so thats untrue that people will drool on a 200BHP car..
Accord V6 is something which is more out of reach than the RS. RS is a turbo petrol and much cheaper. And i dont see people saying accord is useless.
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You are talking about the Indica i am sure?? I agree it is Fuel efficient. But what about the refinement and performance. Its even slower then a Zen Peugot or a Esteem peugot. Poor refinement and too noisy.
It is underpowerd for sure but noisy, no ways. Have you sat inside a new indica lately? It handles great and is excellent value for money.
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Who ever said that? Reason for hating hyundai is that they aim to lauch quantity cars and not quality. Elantra is such a cheap car. Looks worst then even a Petra as far as interiors are concerned. Plus ther stupid advertisment which is really pissing people of their mind.
There adverts are stupid. Agreed. But quality. have owned a santro and a getz. None of them gave any major quality problems. Elantra a cheap stupid car. whoa. I found it more comfortable and roomier on the inside than a skoda! Apart from the looks there is nothing bad about that car. 10lac on road for 110bhp crdi engine with Traction control, ABS, Airbags, climate control.... You name it it has it.
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Quality is what people are looking for. NHC produces 77bhp and has a power to weight of 74.xx but it has quality. Well the tata indigo petrol is capable no doubt but what will you do with 100+bhp with such poor handling and poor brakes. In order to reach 100 - 0 you need brakes as well. No wonder i see NHC Vtec being a total failure comapred to OHC vtec since it doesnot have the same dynamics and yeah people prefer to mod Suzukis rather then Tatas..
100-0. I have had to brake hard at 110. A stupid rickshaw guy started crossing the road. I practically sat on the brakes and laid rubber on concrete which inherently offers lesser grip. The car did not budge out of line. I have also done turns at pretty high speeds with tyres screeching. Never has once the indigo let me down. Both indica and indigo have been the best handling cars i have expirienced. Test drive one. and see for yourself. Also check the specs and see the suspension setup. Independent three link rear suspension on a 5 lac car. The indica gave a good show as a zero car in a rally once, with autocar giving it a thumbs up in terms of performance and handling. And this verdict came from one of the most respected names in indian motorsport.


Quote:
Not at all. In fact wagon R beat Santro in sales in some month which led to 5 seater campaign by hyundai.
WagonR and santro are very very similar cars. So you are bound to have ups and downs. Look at the fit and finish of maruti and hyundai. Seen the panel gaps on even the swift. They are uneven. If you dont believe me check out ACI/overdrive or better still go to the showroom.
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Old 6th June 2005, 13:04   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hrag
If it makes you happy, replace Hyundai with Maruti and Getz with Baleno in my original post :-) I recently did the rounds of almost all showrooms and was only trying to reflect the ground situation.

I think the Getz looks better than the Swift. Call me old-fashioned or simply old but the Getz looks better.

hrag
Absolutely right my bro, Getz has a figure and shape that cannot be matched by the Swift...
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