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Old 12th May 2009, 22:20   #16
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Output specs are very similar to the 1.3 OHC. But the Jazz must be comparatively heavier though with a better torque curve.
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Old 12th May 2009, 22:29   #17
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Well sid does it yet again. Great scoop Sid.

Nothing unexpected from Honda though. Well as we all know it would not be launched less than 7 lakhs OTR.
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Old 12th May 2009, 22:32   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sidindica View Post
Honda Jazz 1.2 i-vtec Indian Version

key details:

varients: only one

Only one variant . Thats surprising .
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Old 12th May 2009, 22:54   #19
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Apart from the Engine, Jazz's specs seems to be lesser than i20. We can very well assume the price will be higher than i20 by a good margin.

One variant also seems to be a statergy and Honda will bring in a lesser priced variant at a later stage seeing the reaction from market.
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Old 12th May 2009, 23:17   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gagan.js View Post
mail4ajo, add alloys to the list

Edit:

Aseem it is about the Indian customer accepting a hatch in the range of 7L. People have certainly not accepted the price on the i20 and with the Jazz being even more expensive makes us think if it will be denied too.

And nothing so great offered anyway, just creature comforts with alloys and electric mirrors left out.

Competitors like the GP will offer that too so it's just space and the engine that is being offered. As for i20 engine, it is enough for the common man like every other engine. Understand what a minority people like bhp'ians and other enthusiasts are. i20 has bombed, even with hyjndai resale and hyundai A.S.S so yea..
Gagan I think you are missing the plot here, Honda isnt aiming for the volume market ala Swift, its aiming at a premium/niche market of premium hatchback. If there arent many in numbers now, trust me with launch of Jazz you can surely expect 3k per month on the sales chart. We can revisit my post in a few months time and see if I hit the nail on its head.

As far as GP is concerned, well the interiors of Linea/Punto are a generation old already. Its a 3 years dated car, unlike Jazz which is a revamped 09 makeover. GP/Linea both suffer from boring petrol and to an extent diesel engine/old interior/bad A.S.S/brand value/lack of head space at rear/less leg room and resale syndrome. It would be priced much lower to the Jazz and after all the hype settles down would compete in Swift segment of entry level hatch. Of course the diesel would be peppier and would do decent numbers, but than with 3 cars already in this segment with the same MJD, I just dont see the USP of buying one from Fiat, who are not exactly famous in India for the right things.

Last edited by aseem : 12th May 2009 at 23:18.
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Old 12th May 2009, 23:21   #21
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Wheel base - 2500 but GC is 160??? Man its in trouble. Atleast in Bangy roads.
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Old 12th May 2009, 23:30   #22
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Great scoop man!

Waiting to know the pricing of the Jazz!

@ Aseem, classic Fiat bash!

But, I never knew that the Swift was an entry level hatch, may be its cheaper than the M800 in that part of our country!

Last edited by anachronix : 12th May 2009 at 23:34.
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Old 13th May 2009, 00:11   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
@ Aseem, classic Fiat bash!

But, I never knew that the Swift was an entry level hatch, may be its cheaper than the M800 in that part of our country!
@anacronix, classic Fiat Fanboyism, comparing a valid critisicm to Fiat bashing.

I have nothing against Fiat, quite like the external look of Linea, perhaps the best in its class. However Fiat needs to do a lot more than the half hearted attempts it keeps pulling off each decade. It started with Uno, which was to pave a new chapter for Fiat India, than came the Palio era, and now its the Punto/Linea era. They dont even have their own dealerships, have always focused on selling a single platform (Petra/Palio and now Punto/Linea). Their A.S.S stories are dreadful. They need to pull up their socks. Launching outdated models at a low price and low spec engines would only do so much, they need to do a lot more to be considered a serious player here.

I dont know whats so funny in calling Swift an entry level hatch. It depends on the strata of society one hails from. One mans luxury is another mans trash. In India we consider Accord a luxury sedan, try telling that to an American
To make it more clear, when comparing i20, Fabia, and Jazz, Swift is indeed entry level mid size hatch.
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Old 13th May 2009, 00:26   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
@anacronix, classic Fiat Fanboyism, comparing a valid critisicm to Fiat bashing.

I have nothing against Fiat, quite like the external look of Linea, perhaps the best in its class. However Fiat needs to do a lot more than the half hearted attempts it keeps pulling off each decade. It started with Uno, which was to pave a new chapter for Fiat India, than came the Palio era, and now its the Punto/Linea era. They dont even have their own dealerships, have always focused on selling a single platform (Petra/Palio and now Punto/Linea). Their A.S.S stories are dreadful. They need to pull up their socks.

Launching outdated models at a low price and low spec engines would only do so much, they need to do a lot more to be considered a serious player here.
Friend,

Its only the non-Fiat owners who are still crying & cribbing about Fiat A.S.S, Fiat attitude, Half heart Fiat & loads of blah blah!

There are many Linea owners review around here & I am yet to find one angry customer! There were delivery woes which were promptly addressed by Fiat top management involvement. Its a good sign & makes sense!

Outdated models... You got any idea about when the Swift was launched internationally? Swift was born in 2004 and the GP in 2005.

Low spec engine... The Swift is sharing the Fiat's 1.3 MJD in the 75bhp configuration. The GP/Linea is featuring a 1.3MJD VGT with 86bhp which is EUROV ready.

Just plain bashing Aseem with "NIL" facts! Well, I dont mind being called a Fiat fanboy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
I dont know whats so funny in calling Swift an entry level hatch. It depends on the strata of society one hails from. One mans luxury is another mans trash. In India we consider Accord a luxury sedan, try telling that to an American
Absolutely funny. Comparing Apples & Pizza buns here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
To make it more clear, when comparing i20, Fabia, and Jazz, Swift is indeed entry level mid size hatch.



BTW! What the heck are we talking about in a Honda Jazz thread. Sorry for going offtopic guys!

Sid, awaiting more scoop from you on the Jazz!
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Old 13th May 2009, 00:56   #25
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@sid,
'One variant' is in italics, so does it mean it is not yet confirmed?

@GTO,
Looking at the number of scoops sidindica has come up with, can we reward him by making him a 'Distinguished Member' of T-BHP? I am not aware of technical requirements for this position like min. no. of post, etc....
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Old 13th May 2009, 01:18   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
Friend,

Its only the non-Fiat owners who are still crying & cribbing about Fiat A.S.S, Fiat attitude, Half heart Fiat & loads of blah blah!
Sour Grapes??? I had mentioned i20's drawbacks too in my post, but I dont see any Hyundai owners lining up and retorting to name calling. Why single out Fiat GP...

Non Fiat owners dont have an agenda, they are not biased one way or the other, and frankly speaking, dont give a damn! If a difference of opinion is a blah blah in your view I dont know how far you'd get with that attitude.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
There are many Linea owners review around here & I am yet to find one angry customer! There were delivery woes which were promptly addressed by Fiat top management involvement. Its a good sign & makes sense!
And I hope they do well, but they need to do a lot more than that to be considered a serious player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
Outdated models... You got any idea about when the Swift was launched internationally? Swift was born in 2004 and the GP in 2005.
Swift was born in 2004 and released in India in 2005. Its showig its age now. Its due for a complete upgrade by 2010 with a minor upgrade already happened.

GP on the contrary was launched in 2005 and is being released in India in mid 2009, the car is due for an upgrade already.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
Low spec engine... The Swift is sharing the Fiat's 1.3 MJD in the 75bhp configuration. The GP/Linea is featuring a 1.3MJD VGT with 86bhp which is EUROV ready.
Pleas read what I wrote again. The deisel engine is barely saving grace to an under powered petrol offering. In case of Linea even the diesel runs out of breath as its under powered for a car of its weight (do you ever take that into consideration???), is not half as exciting as the fixed gemoetry turbo on Swift.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
Just plain bashing Aseem with "NIL" facts! Well, I dont mind being called a Fiat fanboy.

Absolutely funny. Comparing Apples & Pizza buns here.
Just as my views are not a gospel of truth, similarly your views are just that, your views and dont stand for Facts.

Untill next time, lets just agree to disagree. Peace!

OT: Must be painful to see Kimi and Ferrari's form this season...

Last edited by aseem : 13th May 2009 at 01:25.
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Old 13th May 2009, 01:25   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
Features maybe, but specs???

Top that with class leading space/practicality, honda resale, honda snob value, ....

Now features itself dont make a car,

Engine: i20 Sluggish and boring
Engine: Jazz Frugal and peppiest in its segmet. Even puts likes of Linea to waters
I am waiting to buy the honda Jazz for my wife, if the price is right and the features are good, but I am confused on this "honda snob value" never knew that a honda / toyota / hyundai etc. comes in the brands of snob value..strictly personal opinion.

Honda cars are excellent resale in India and long-lasting for sure but a comparision with of Jazz with Linea is rather far fetched, if you are just talking about the engine that too FIRE petrol, I might take that point in right spirit, however the engine to buy in Linea is the MJD which is by far superior technology and frugal as it can get, which Honda cant even think of building, no wonder why they dont have diesel blocks.

If the comparison is on the overall car, well both are in different worlds altogather, feature wise even the ANHC or the Civic are nowhere near to the Linea, and Yes features are important, just as the touted "engine power" / pepp is.
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Old 13th May 2009, 01:37   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -xplora- View Post
I am waiting to buy the honda Jazz for my wife, if the price is right and the features are good, but I am confused on this "honda snob value" never knew that a honda / toyota / hyundai etc. comes in the brands of snob value..strictly personal opinion.

Honda cars are excellent resale in India and long-lasting for sure but a comparision with of Jazz with Linea is rather far fetched, if you are just talking about the engine that too FIRE petrol, I might take that point in right spirit, however the engine to buy in Linea is the MJD which is by far superior technology and frugal as it can get, which Honda cant even think of building, no wonder why they dont have diesel blocks.

If the comparison is on the overall car, well both are in different worlds altogather, feature wise even the ANHC or the Civic are nowhere near to the Linea, and Yes features are important, just as the touted "engine power" / pepp is.
I realize that they are in two different segments, I had made a similar observation about SX4 not having vtech head in India, which is being offered in Jazz. As far as Linea MJD is concerned, its definitely frugal, but a 85 ps engine for a car of its weight, is far from ideal.

As far as Linea being better than Civic and ANHC, lets just say to each his own. End of the day everyone is guided by their own factors and are entitled to their own views.

I truly believe features are not as important as the basic package. If features are as important, than perhaps Dezire offers the same features as Linea at a lower price, but that doesnt make it a better car. You might as well see the likes of Wagon R to be equipped with Airbags, ABS, Steering mounted audio control and the likes, doesnt mean it can compare with other cars with better specced engines etc.

ANHC sales do show that Indians do value Honda as a brand. Of course in a country where likes of BMW 3 series sell for close to a 70,000$ the prespective is a bit scewed.

Last edited by aseem : 13th May 2009 at 01:38.
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Old 13th May 2009, 08:25   #29
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another thread turning into a fiat vs honda platform. LOL!! atleast honda fanboys accept that FIAT is in competition. I think thats a worthy praise from "mighty Honda" fans.

Last edited by Comrade : 13th May 2009 at 08:26.
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Old 13th May 2009, 09:41   #30
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Well honda is coming up with an under 5 lacs hatch soon. Todays newspaper state that the entire R&D, sourcing of spare parts etc will be based in India to bring down the costs. This vehicle is specially aimed at the Indian Mass volume market, unlike the city jazz etc. Seems like a great initiative from honda. To get honda quality at under 5 lacs would not be bad idea at all.
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