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Old 6th July 2009, 18:00   #241
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Neither do we come here to read posts, expecting any "sarcasm".


Last but not the least, if you care to read up mine & Navin's posts in the Skoda thread, we are NOT here to lower Skoda's sales. We'd only be too happy to see them grow. STRICTLY subject to them improving their aftersales and bringing customer satisfaction up to acceptable levels. Until they continue to cheat, we will continue to spread the awareness.
Thank God we are in India, and not China. However, people who make bad products or give shoddy service would like it to be. OT, consider Akshay Kumar's recent statement that bad reviews prevent people from parting with their hard-earned money on poor films (and consequently, Akshay's films flop, and his future income drops). So typical to blame bad reviews and not bad products. He would like reviewers to wait for 3 days to give a bad review, so that the producers/directors can recoup their money, and fool the public. I would say reviewers should come out 1 day in advance, so that `buyer beware'.

In the same manner, this forum only makes the `buyer beware' and a serious buyer should have the intelligence to make an informed judgment. Nobody here is forcing them to stay away from Skoda. My personal opinion about Skoda (to use a famous phrase: `a fool and his money is often parted'). Perhaps Skoda should get out of its Eastern bloc mentality soon. After all, it is close to 2 decades on.
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Old 6th July 2009, 20:45   #242
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On a lighter note, you don't need no Team-BHP to inform users of Skoda's terrible aftersales. I'd say Skoda and their dealers are doing a fantastic job of the same already.

If one seriously believes that Skoda's after-sales is not costing them a substantial loss of sales, one needs a reality check.

Forget me, even Skoda's own top management will disagree with you here. And yes, I have met with them so consider this statement as being "straight from the horses mouth". They realise that the "what is" 700 cars "could have been" 1,400 cars. If not more.
Last year I wanted to buy Fabia Petrol 1.4 Elegance but was put off by the dealers's idiotic GM and staff and the pathetic engine. I had not heard of Team Bhp till then.

If Skoda's top Management is aware that they could have sold 1400 instead of 700, are they doing anything to improve the situation?

My cousin wants to buy an Accord and wanted my advice. I want to suggest Superb Petrol but am afraid due to SKoda's poor service record.
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Old 6th July 2009, 22:13   #243
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I usually do not recommend or de-recommend any product or brand to anyone but not with Skoda.

I feel I am doing a favor by telling them Harish' experience and have taken pride in having dissuaded 2 close friends from buying an Octavia & Laura respectively.

They have thanked me for it and I feel I have saved them from disaster.
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Old 7th July 2009, 00:28   #244
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Well, facts remain facts , with or without "sarcasm" or "appreciation"

2. May be. But still quite a few people used their own hard earned money to buy these cars in June. May be they saw a +ve which others couldn't
W12, I would be interested in knowing your own personal experience with Skoda, if any.
Last year I was in the market for a car and Skoda's dealer's arrogance turned me off.
A close relative who owns a Skoda Laura hasn't given me good feedback about the service.
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Originally Posted by w 12 (May 2009 : Indian Car Sales & Analysis)
May be Not many TBhpians were able to persuade aam janata not to by skodas this month !!
When I first read this comment, I actually thought you made this remark in jest and that this was an attempt at black humour. Now I am not so sure with your subsequent spirited defense. Well, whatever. . You are certainly entitled to it.
The market dynamics is complex, as is the human mind. It will always be difficult to quantify the influence of any single factor. More so, in a country like India which defeats the predictions of the most sophisticated pollsters.
Right or wrong, and irrespective of it's image in western countries, Skoda has the image of a premium brand in India. Well, kudos to them and no wonder they are milking it.
But you can be rest assured that hubris will lead to downfall ultimately
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3. There are similar threads on horror stories, lemons & shoddy service with most of the major brands here. , including Tata, Honda , Mahindra , Ford., BMW etc
Well, you gotta admit that nothing was as bad as some of the stuff we have read in this forum about Skoda. There were some fundamental issues on integrity which go way beyond just shoddy customer service and which still remain unanswered.
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Old 7th July 2009, 09:48   #245
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1. W12, I would be interested in knowing your own personal experience with Skoda, if any.
2. Last year I was in the market for a car and Skoda's dealer's arrogance turned me off.
3. It will always be difficult to quantify the influence of any single factor. More so, in a country like India which defeats the predictions of the most sophisticated pollsters.
Right or wrong, and irrespective of it's image in western countries, Skoda has the image of a premium brand in India. Well, kudos to them and no wonder they are milking it.

4. But you can be rest assured that hubris will lead to downfall ultimately 5. Well, you gotta admit that nothing was as bad as some of the stuff we have read in this forum about Skoda. There were some fundamental issues on integrity which go way beyond just shoddy customer service and which still remain unanswered.

1. Is personal experience with Skoda a prerequisite for posting in this thread or any others? Do all the posters of that famous " skoda instigating" thread own skodas ? Besides I was commenting on Sales figures of the month not on skodas ownership experience.

2. Fair enough. It is your money & you are free to chose a product you like , from a vendor you like. Some people made the similar choices & still bought skodas, whether we like it or not.

3. Exactly.Skoda has built a image which will take time to dent & damage.All I am saying is It is premature to write their obituary right now. They certainly will die a slow & painful death if they do not improve their A S S,. But the june numbers , if true certainly do not show any major impact of team bhps skoda thread.

4. I disagree. Passing off a damaged car or a confirmed lemon or a last years car as a new one, as has been reported for most manufacturers is also a fundamental issue of integrity., just like stealing parts or padding up repair costs.
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Old 7th July 2009, 10:24   #246
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post

1. Neither do we come here to read posts, expecting any "sarcasm".

2. If one seriously believes that Skoda's after-sales is not costing them a substantial loss of sales, one needs a reality check.

3. Skoda complaints on this forum outnumber that for any other manufacturer. All the more important when you consider their miniscule 1% market share.

1. One of the perils of using a public forum, where not everyone is expected to have the same pov. But scroll wheel on your mouse is your friend !

2. Who said that? All I said was inspite of the shoddy service & Team BHP thread , they claim they have become no.1 in June.

3. The operative word being " on this forum" .Does the forum accurately mirror the actual Indian market ? not necessarily.
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Old 7th July 2009, 10:30   #247
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Guys, lets wait for actual SIAM data and then pass judgement

Till then to quote a saying

"There are statistics and there are lies"
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Old 7th July 2009, 10:35   #248
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Originally Posted by w 12 View Post
3. The operative word being " on this forum" .Does the forum accurately mirror the actual Indian market ? not necessarily.
But it is a true sample of the actual Indian market.

BTW, I am not sure what your whole point it. I dont think we, as a community are blowing our own trumpet for declining SKoda's sales. As far as impact is concerned, yes we made a impact. That's why senior Skoda officials met up with GTO & few others of team-bhp. And until they improve their A.S.S., we will always try to warn others before they commit their hard earned money to Skoda. At least I will. With time, if they dont improve, their reputation will be tarnished. Look how Fiat struggles to sell even a 1000 Lineas (a total VFM product) but Honda sells more than double ANHCs which isn't exactly VFM.

Last edited by asr245 : 7th July 2009 at 10:36.
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Old 7th July 2009, 12:37   #249
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Guys when is the report for the month of june coming?. Just now got a call from concorde chennai. They asked me whether the sales report for june has been put up on team bhp. I guess we members are not only the ones who are looking at this.........
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Old 7th July 2009, 18:53   #250
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Originally Posted by geeash View Post
Guys when is the report for the month of june coming?. Just now got a call from concorde chennai. They asked me whether the sales report for june has been put up on team bhp. I guess we members are not only the ones who are looking at this.........
I actually did a report on June sales and put it in a seperate thread but guess the mods didnt want that even though I was within the rules to create the thread. June sales was supposed to be released in July why are we ranting about May sales still?? Anyway just scroll back and you will see my post with a picture on June sales.

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Originally Posted by autocarcr View Post
It gives me great pleasure to announce partial car sales in June 2009. (I will still wait for Vasudev's XL sheet). But here goes (courtesy: Hindu)






It looks like the company which is REALLY smiling from year on year gains is Fiat - with its new GP and Linea they are soon catching up with their arch rivals Honda- a WHOPPING 349% increase- over last year, clocking more than 50% of Honda car sales in June 2009 with only 3 cars in its portfolio against Honda's 5. The GP has done well in its first month with sales hovering around the 1300 mark (external source) and the Linea with around 1100 units (a slight month on month gain) It also looks to me that Honda's continuous Jazzy advertisements has left City customers sticking to the Jazz hence splitting usual 4000 odd City sales into half. Looks like the City also has finally thrashed the Civic (its own sibling) and CRV has gone out for good- though Accord sales seem to be on par with the rivals (not indicated). Mahindra seems to be enjoying its sales numbers with the runaway hit- Xylo (also advertised extensively). Maruti and Hyundai undoubtedly remain segment kings in the hatchback market with Hyundais i20 doing good numbers as well as the Maruti Ritz with around 8500 units. The Ritz (similar to what the Jazz is doing to the City) is eating away sales from the Swift as it is considered more VFM and styling is better. Tata Motors ended on a flat note with the Indica Vista doing the same as previous month figures and indica sales overall grew as indicated above. Indigo seems to be falling in sales (maybe on accounts for the August release of the Indigo Vista). This month will be interesting to note (July 2009) as there are big fights going on (with respect to previous months launches):

1) The Grande Punto vs i20 vs Ritz vs Jazz
2) The Linea vs Honda City
3) Laura vs Altis vs Civic

Only time can tell what will happen! Will the Jazz sales drop owing to 70% of reports condemning its expensive price tag? Will the Grande Punto and consequently Linea sales increase owing to the new GP ad by Yuvraj Singh (Be different from others- the bold new drive)????

CR :-)
Heres the post you wanted about June sales I have split the fights for you all....

Last edited by Technocrat : 7th July 2009 at 18:59.
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Old 8th July 2009, 12:49   #251
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Originally Posted by w 12 View Post
1. One of the perils of using a public forum, where not everyone is expected to have the same pov. But scroll wheel on your mouse is your friend !
Please read my post again since you've clearly "missed" my pov. I am not talking about a different pov, but the sarcasm. We can do without it. In fact, in extreme cases, this is classified as trolling. Keep the sarcasm to yourself, or for another forum. I don't need to remind you that you've been infracted twice for personal attacks already by other moderators.

Quote:
Who said that? All I said was inspite of the shoddy service & Team BHP thread , they claim they have become no.1 in June.
One month doesn't make a sales champion. It is sales over a longer duration (at the least 12 months) before one makes a judgement on how the product is doing. Do visit the other sales threads to know just how Skoda has been losing marketshare. For the record, and if you want to go by strict categorisation of no.1 for a particular month, SIAM puts the Linea in the exact same segment as the Octavia. And the Linea has outsold the Octavia in June 2009. Thus, its actually the Linea that's no.1! There you go!

Either ways, I hope the boys in Aurangabad aren't celebrating already, based on a single month of sales. And if they are, that just shows the standards that Skoda & its cronies set for themselves. We have a Maruti, Hyundai, Tata, Honda, Toyota etc. who sell MULTIPLES of what Skoda manages, and still don't go around flaunting their supposed "No.1" badge. On the other hand, here we have someone who sells a mere 700 Octavias and starts shouting out from the rooftops.

The fact that their sorry reputation is costing them a substantial loss in numbers cannot be denied. Not even by Skoda themselves. We will wait for official SIAM information to know just how other cars have fared. Also, as I have reiterated earlier, no word on the Fabia yet? If the Fabia is still a sales dud, and being the cheapest Skoda one can buy, it is safe to state that buyer perception of Skoda hasn't gone up in anyway. And Skoda is in doldrums just as it was for the entire of last year.

Quote:
The operative word being " on this forum" .Does the forum accurately mirror the actual Indian market ? not necessarily.
This community provides the BEST - most high quality - research sample on the urban Indian car buyer (not rural or commercial buyers). Hey, don't take my word for it. It's 2 of the three manufacturers who I've met in the last 2 months who state so. Both of them manage volumes that are multiple times of Skoda, and one sells the most cars in the country. Go speak to some of the senior managers at the most reputable research organisations in the country (many of whom are members). They'll tell you of how Team-BHP gives them more valuable data than their own customer surveys on product pros & cons, brand perception, service issues, areas of improvement etc. etc.

While on it, think of just those internet-challenged Skoda customers who have been cheated by Skoda. Either we don't know of those cases, or worst case, they don't know either.

Quote:
Guys, lets wait for actual SIAM data and then pass judgement

Till then to quote a saying

"There are statistics and there are lies"
Good point. I am not seeing the same information anywhere else, including on Skodas own website.
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Old 8th July 2009, 14:22   #252
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Good points GTO. In absence of any speedy legal redressal system in India, customers for too long have been taken for a ride by unscrupulous companies (both manufacturers and dealers of all kind of items). Here is at least a forum which is voicing customers POV and concerns, atleast for one industry and the best part is that Industry has started taking notice of this forum. This would not have happened if the points raised here were baseless.

I find that many people support or hate a particular brand sometimes fanatically. Many members have accused others of bashing a particular brand. There may be few instances of this but accusers should analyse the topic in a fair and objective manner and support it if the point is justified. The protests voiced over such forums will actually sometimes help and sometimes force the industry to improve their products and services. This will be for the betterment for all customers and ultimately will help the errant company also.

I would like to have such forums operational for other industries / segments also. Healthcare and Education are biggest problem areas where customers are looted the most.

Last edited by akj53 : 8th July 2009 at 14:24. Reason: correction
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Old 8th July 2009, 16:04   #253
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Here is at least a forum which is voicing customers POV and concerns, atleast for one industry and the best part is that Industry has started taking notice of this forum. This would not have happened if the points raised here were baseless.
And a Forum that refuses to accept any automotive advertising, and a community member base that is willing to stand up for whats right. This is key to our unbiasedness. Thanks Akj.

Further to all of this No.1 claim business : RUBBISH!. Official data has been received.

The Fabia has had its worst sales ever : A measly 196 cars.

Octavia + Laura sales : 737. NOTE that unlike previous reports, it is a combination of the Octavia + Laura that has managed 737 cars (about 80 units more than in the previous month). The Linea (911 cars) and Toyota Altis (714 cars) have outsold the Octavia as well as the Laura (individually).

Await a full report soon.
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Old 8th July 2009, 17:18   #254
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
...Octavia + Laura sales : 737. NOTE that unlike previous reports, it is a combination of the Octavia + Laura that has managed 737 cars (about 80 units more than in the previous month). The Linea (911 cars) and Toyota Altis (714 cars) have outsold the Octavia as well as the Laura (individually)...
The article w12 pointed out (Skoda Auto India sells 737 units of Octavia & 212 units of Laura in June'09 *-*WheelsUnplugged Automobile Industry News) said Skoda sold 737 Octavia and 212 Laura!

That's incorrect and misleading.

Skoda appears like a joker who's lost his punch line and is desperate to humor.
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Old 8th July 2009, 17:27   #255
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
The Fabia has had its worst sales ever : A measly 196 cars.
Octavia + Laura sales : 737. NOTE that unlike previous reports, it is a combination of the Octavia + Laura that has managed 737 cars (about 80 units more than in the previous month). The Linea (911 cars) and Toyota Altis (714 cars) have outsold the Octavia as well as the Laura (individually).

Await a full report soon.
And add the fact that sales are typically high for a month or two after the a new launch (here, Laura). Lets see what they can manage in next few months.
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