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Old 9th June 2009, 13:15   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Be sure to check the manufactured date though, GMís moving old stock (as for the brandís other cars too).

-
I am pretty sure that date may be old but hopefully year is 2009. Typical GM style to be unable to match production to demand. Then they complain about legacy costs and pension issues. As they joke about GM: Lots of lots on lots of dealer lots.

CRV=0. I am sure it has something to do with supply than demand. Otherwise, CRV cannot just collapse to 0 in 4/09 and 5/09 from 282 in 3/09.
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:20   #17
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M800 Sales are down, May be people are moving to 2nd Hand car with the same price.2nd hand car's price also declining.
Another factor for sale down may be people are waiting for more Model to release.
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:27   #18
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The excel sheet is now on post 7!!!! of this thread.
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:27   #19
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I enjoyed reading this. Great analysis.

A lot of prospective buyers know about the Civic's ground clearance and suspension issues. The Altis is far more practical.

I am not that surprised by Linea's numbers. But still they moved 901 cars which is 901 more than what they did last year in this segment. Fia should just dig its heels in and focus on providing good service. Not sure how stopping Palio production would improve the Fiat brand. They are not advertising the Palio anywhere. Only ones who are buying it are people who have always wanted a Fiat no matter what and people who walked into the showroom to take a look at the Vista. If the GP takes off, then the halo effect would rub off on the Palio as well. Provided there is another price cut.

Maruti appears to have made a good start with the Ritz. Proves that practical reasonably priced cars will sell no matter how ugly. (Ugly in my opinion).
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:32   #20
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Honda did not learn its lessons from its Civic Hybrid debacle, went on to hike CRV's tag thinking it can still make a fool of the Indian consumers. Well, fell flat on the ground & Im expecting Honda doling out big discounts to turn the tide.
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:34   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hrag View Post
Where are the actual numbers please? In the spreadsheet format - would be good to have the complete file in one place.
Quote:
Originally Posted by finneyp View Post
GTO, It will be better to have the numbers in tabular format.
Nice analysis done!
Uploaded to post no.7. Please download and post your comments.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
Reading the newspapers and watching business channels, the spin was entirely different.
You can say that again. Read a TOI report this morning that sales have gone up 9%. Where?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ms001 View Post
Sad to see the sales slide in spite of an excellent product.
Don't be (sad). The Linea has experienced what each new launch does. Normal market behaviour = Higher interest at the time of introduction, only to stabilise at a lower level eventually.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pranava999 View Post
If the M800's sales are diving, which model/brand is ganging from this?
One word = Alto.

Quote:
Originally Posted by evo View Post
Why does the Altis sell so much and the Sonata none at all, eventhough thats a bigger price with more equipment, better warranty at just a slight premium?
A lot to do with the brand. Plus, the Altis will hold its value much better than the Sonata.

Quote:
If the Civic`s sales are hurt by the City, by that logic, shouldn't the Corolla`s sales be hurt by the city too?
Brand cannibalisation.

Quote:
OT: In Kolkata, I have seen only three Outlanders as yet, and one of them is on sale. (3 Months old, 3 Lakhs less it seems). Why couldnt Mitsu price at GV levels and atleast given it an opportunity to flourish.
Yen : Rupee ratio not favourable, and Mitsu has given the Outlander a long list of standard equipment.

Quote:
Safari: Tata is perhaps the only manufacturer whose Flagship(read:most expensive) product (Safari) sells more than its bread and butter ones (extended sumo family).


Quote:
A question. I didnt understand how forex fluctuations affected sales of the CRV.
As per Vids post. All Jap CBU's affected.

Quote:
Originally Posted by diffsoft View Post
How many units did Superb sell?

Cheers,
175. Less than the Accord, despite being a newer car. Should stabilise to 100 - 110 eventually.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
I don't see VW in the list. I'm seeing quite a few Jetta's and Passat's here. Either that or i keep seeing the same few cars over and over again.
Unfortunately, VW doesn't seem keen on sharing numbers. Even Audi is conspicuous by its absence on the list.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
CRV=0. I am sure it has something to do with supply than demand. Otherwise, CRV cannot just collapse to 0 in 4/09 and 5/09 from 282 in 3/09.
Honda stopped importing them - temporarily - due to the forex fluctuation (contributor to the Accord V6s inflated price tag of 28 lakhs).
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:35   #22
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Excellent report
could have been better in a spreadsheet
What about the two-wheeler market?
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:38   #23
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My take on ANHC success:

a. It is not obsession to Honda Brand - It is the reliability that brand offers. That is the reason it worked though it is priced higher with virtually no goodies. Two most important criteria for any prospective buyer would be 1)*** and 2) re-sale value. ANHC is practically quite ahead of FIAT on these both factors. Fiat might be improving on this, but it will take time. At least, i went for ANHC based on these 2 factors.

Also, initial Linea niggles getting reported across internet and other media might be costing Fiat a bit. A prospective buyer would always do though research before investing lacs on cars. Though they are small niggles - it dents confidence of prospective buyer.

At least i have seen 5 to 6 folks reporting Linea niggles here and else where....cc

CRV/Civic Decline - It proves myth of "Honda Brand obsession". Failure is because of the price hike and better options available in that price range. I don't think so any one would pay premium for no reason.
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:42   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
You can say that again. Read a TOI report this morning that sales have gone up 9%. Where?
Actually, that 9% yoy is for entire automotive domestic sales incl. CVs, four wheelers, 3Ws, and 2Ws. This has been driven by a 12.4% yoy increase in 2W sales. CV sales declined 15% yoy in 5/2009. Some comfort is that the rate of decline in CV has moderated from 30-50% yoy in early 2009. Since 2W account for 78% of domestic auto sales by volume, any positive growth here pulls up the entire growth figure. However, by value terms, CV and 4w rule, and here there is no sign of any recovery, only some signs of lower declines.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Honda stopped importing them - temporarily - due to the forex fluctuation (contributor to the Accord V6s inflated price tag of 28 lakhs).
Blame all your price increases on uncontrollable factors, and claim victimhood status. Yen was rising till end-2008, but is now falling against the rupee since 2/09. Even the US$ has fallen since 4/09. Since the pound has appreciated, perhaps Honda is importing Accord and CRV from UK???

One important scam or whatever going on: automakers reported a huge decline in operating profits during Oct-Dec 2008. However, with the excise duty cuts, their operating profits reached near-peak levels in Jan-Mar 09. Given that there was hardly a recovery in Jan-Mar 09, the huge jumps in profits in Jan-Mar 09 was due to (a) sharp collapse in steel prices since sep 08 (b) some sort of pocketing the excise benefits.

Last edited by Technocrat : 9th June 2009 at 14:49.
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:43   #25
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Originally Posted by CarsPG View Post
No wonder the Corolla dealers are not offering any significant discounts! Waiting period is 30 - 45 days!
Actually its not that much. My father in law just got his Corolla delivered yesterday and he did the downpayment/booking on last thursday. THis was in Delhi.
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Old 9th June 2009, 13:58   #26
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nice analysis GTO. I agree on the city eating up civic numbers, for I know of a friend who went to buy civic but bought ANHC instead. the dealer was also quoting that many buyers are doing this.

Surprised to see Omni n Versa still selling - maybe school cab for Omni , Versa - I dont know.

Breakup for Scorpio, Xlyo ? Can we get it ?
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Old 9th June 2009, 14:14   #27
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Actually its not that much. My father in law just got his Corolla delivered yesterday and he did the downpayment/booking on last thursday. THis was in Delhi.
Good to know, thanks! A friend was looking at buying one and the dealers in Bombay told him it will be at least 30 days.
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Old 9th June 2009, 14:31   #28
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901 Lineas! That's pretty bad for a fantastically priced and superbly equipped car with a diesel engine. Compare that to a an overpriced City selling 3638. Its pretty obvious VFM is at the bottom of priorities for a top end C segment buyer.

And Honda got a royal whupping from Toyota in the Civic area! Man - that oughta hurt. I guess its brand cannibalisation like GTO pointed out too - the top end is close to the manual Accord and the bottom is close to City.

Optra & AVeo is not a surprise for me. With the bankruptcy of the parent, people would be hesitating in putting their money on these cars. At least with spark the cost impact is minimal.

Good analysis - Thanks Vasudeva & GTO.
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Old 9th June 2009, 14:36   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
- Honda CRV = 0. The once popular soft-roader is a victim of forex fluctuations.
As I had said earlier, Honda have stopped importing the CRV since April 1, 2009.
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Old 9th June 2009, 14:40   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shrinivasap View Post
My take on ANHC success:

a. It is not obsession to Honda Brand - It is the reliability that brand offers. That is the reason it worked though it is priced higher with virtually no goodies. Two most important criteria for any prospective buyer would be 1)*** and 2) re-sale value. ANHC is practically quite ahead of FIAT on these both factors. Fiat might be improving on this, but it will take time. At least, i went for ANHC based on these 2 factors.
I made a post yesterday, which may be relevant here:

Quote:
As a fellow Honda owner myself, allow me to clarify why some amongst us love the brand:

- Absolutely unmatched reliability. It's only Toyota & Honda at the top.

- Their cars are either class toppers in power or in fuel efficiency.

- Exceedingly low cost of service. Think 1,500 bucks for a 20 lakh rupee Honda Accord. That's lesser than my Indigo's service bills.

- Superb resale value.

- Most of their cars are highly pleasurable to drive (e.g. the Civic from its segment, the CRV from the soft-roaders and the City from the C segment).

I'll be the first to tell you of how they skimp on equipment, and that their after-sales needs improvement. Yet in terms of sheer product engineering precision, it's only Toyota that matches / betters the Honda. Either of these manufacturers charge a premium, no doubt on that. However, that premium is recovered in a low cost of ownership, good fuel efficiency, strong resale and cheap service costs.

There is a reason why Toyota & Honda enjoy such success in most markets where they have a presence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tanwaramit View Post
Surprised to see Omni n Versa still selling - maybe school cab for Omni , Versa - I dont know.
Omni is cheap (real cheap) and probably offers the most sq. ft. of cargo space / rupee this side of a truck!
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