Help needed regarding filing a case against Daimlerchrysler

[omaragra]

Hi guys,

My father is thinking about filing a case against Daimlerchrysler India.

We own a 2004 Mercedes Benz E 270. Our problems started from the car's 3rd year and they have become worse since the past 1 year.

Earlier the problems were regarding tyres, once the tyre used to get puncture it used to immediately get flat and become useless. We had to change 10 of them in total.

Now recently the things became worse, here is a summary of problems.

1. The lock of the boot stopped working, charges us almost around 35K. The car came to Agra and we realised that the frame surrounding the number plate was not fitted properly, the car went back all the way to Delhi to get it done properly !!

2. The headlights got dis-coloured, the company refused to change them saying that the warranty was over, so we paid 70K for their replacement.

3. The brake pads got spoiled before their usual change time, they gave us an estimate of 3.5L, but after my fathers negotiations they came down to 1.25L. The brakes were fixed the car came back, but after a few days the same brake pad error came on the screen, the car went back and the system was reset.

4. Once the A/C stopped working, the part was ordered came from Germany the car was in the workshop for around 5 days.

5. On another occasion, the car while being driven from Agra to Delhi stopped and failed to re-start. The car had to be towed away to Delhi workshop. The whole exercise was more than 6 hours starting from 10 in the night till 4 in the morning. The repair/replacement was done, of course with huge amount of expenses.

6. Just last week on it's way back from Delhi the car gave us another shock when the exhaust/silencer started ejecting smoke which was so thick and black that the person driving the car could not see even one foot at the rear and similarly the cars behind our car felt as as they the whole car was burning. It was a disgrace for the proud owner of a mercedes car. The car to be dumped at home. Subsequently we got in touch with T&T motors, who sent their mechanic to repair the fault but once again Rs. 5000/- had to be paid !!

7. Today there was a free checkup camp at Agra and the car was sent for just a normal checkup and we were informed that some pipes were broken or something and the coolant and engine oil had got mixed up. The guy advised not to drive the car and get it towed away to Delhi, so T&T got a crane and asked us to pay 18K. !!!!

So once again the car is useless and needs to be taken to the workshop and we don't even know yet what is in store for us !!

This is just a small summary of problems, I am sure you can understand how shocking and hurting it is for my father to spend a fortune on a such an expensive car and have all these problems !!

We got in touch with Daimlerchrysler India and they simply told us that our car is out of warranty and forwarded our mail to T&T motors the dealer in Delhi !!!

Now please advise what to do guys !! At the moment my father is planning to file a case !!

Regards

Omar

[vijaythacker]

you seems to have paid already the price of a new diesel hatchback till now.Sorry to hear about your experience.One thing couldnt understand why does your car's tyre gets flat for so many times?

[omaragra]

Originally Posted by vijaythacker

you seems to have paid already the price of a new diesel hatchback till now.Sorry to hear about your experience.One thing couldnt understand why does your car's tyre gets flat for so many times?

Puzzle for us too !!! Stopped happening one day !!

[Sahil]

Welcome to my "past" world ! Trust me, these are "common" problems in Mercs. You haven't had it allllll that bad already, I have had worse experiences so have many others. So consider yourself fortunate !
On a more serious note, dont waste time, get rid of her ASAP. I am sure this experience has taught you a lesson and hopefully you have opted for the BSI package on your 7 series.

[jesal]

well they dont build them like they used to. first things first we all know anything after 2000 everything mercs made broke faster than marutis did. sell the car instead of spending money over and over. you are not the only one with these kind of issues. the trouble is you were patient for so long and kept spending and suddenly realized you want to sue them. i hope you got the bmw package for the new car so its maintainence free. sell the car and sleep peacefully. lesson learnt. do not buy MERCS in india at all.

[ajmat]

Things are a lot better now but you seem to have suffered the brunt of Mercedes's distraction with Chrysler

1. The lock of the boot stopped working, charges us almost around 35K. The car came to Agra and we realised that the frame surrounding the number plate was not fitted properly, the car went back all the way to Delhi to get it done properly !!

My bet is that is was a vacuum issue

2. The headlights got dis-coloured, the company refused to change them saying that the warranty was over, so we paid 70K for their replacement.

My neighbours BMW 7 has same problem - very little one can do

3. The brake pads got spoiled before their usual change time, they gave us an estimate of 3.5L, but after my fathers negotiations they came down to 1.25L. The brakes were fixed the car came back, but after a few days the same brake pad error came on the screen, the car went back and the system was reset.

This was a major design issue - mercedes had major warrantly recalls. THe new S class onwards reverts to conventional braling systems

4. Once the A/C stopped working, the part was ordered came from Germany the car was in the workshop for around 5 days.

Another weak link - GTO also had a similar problem

6. Just last week on it's way back from Delhi the car gave us another shock when the exhaust/silencer started ejecting smoke which was so thick and black that the person driving the car could not see even one foot at the rear and similarly the cars behind our car felt as as they the whole car was burning. It was a disgrace for the proud owner of a mercedes car. The car to be dumped at home. Subsequently we got in touch with T&T motors, who sent their mechanic to repair the fault but once again Rs. 5000/- had to be paid !!

Sounds like injector timing issues

7. Today there was a free checkup camp at Agra and the car was sent for just a normal checkup and we were informed that some pipes were broken or something and the coolant and engine oil had got mixed up. The guy advised not to drive the car and get it towed away to Delhi, so T&T got a crane and asked us to pay 18K. !!!!

I knew it was in some other Mercs - the oil cooler is locatd in the radiator so corrosion leads to leaks. Worse still are in some Mercs - the tramissin cooler is similarly integrated making things fatal

[GTO]

Hi Omaragra,

Firstly, your car is 5 years old and 3 years out of warranty. You stand a very slim chance in the consumer court. Best to sell off the car.

Originally Posted by omaragra

Our problems started from the car's 3rd year and they have become worse since the past 1 year.

Unfortunately the problem with most Mercs. The durability of yesteryears simply isn't there.

Earlier the problems were regarding tyres, once the tyre used to get puncture it used to immediately get flat and become useless. We had to change 10 of them in total.

To Mercs credit, this is not their fault as much as it is the tyre manufacturers.

1. The lock of the boot stopped working, charges us almost around 35K. The car came to Agra and we realised that the frame surrounding the number plate was not fitted properly, the car went back all the way to Delhi to get it done properly !!

As Ajmat posted, it's probably the vacuum.

2. The headlights got dis-coloured, the company refused to change them saying that the warranty was over, so we paid 70K for their replacement.

Example of poor quality + cost cutting. You should start sourcing parts from the aftermarket. Would have cost a fraction of the 70 grand you paid.

3. The brake pads got spoiled before their usual change time, they gave us an estimate of 3.5L, but after my fathers negotiations they came down to 1.25L. The brakes were fixed the car came back, but after a few days the same brake pad error came on the screen, the car went back and the system was reset.

As per Ajmats post.

4. Once the A/C stopped working, the part was ordered came from Germany the car was in the workshop for around 5 days.

Bet it was the evaporator? Again, lack of quality + cost cutting. Expect an evaporator replacement every 2 - 3 years in the C and the E Class.

5. On another occasion, the car while being driven from Agra to Delhi stopped and failed to re-start. The car had to be towed away to Delhi workshop. The whole exercise was more than 6 hours starting from 10 in the night till 4 in the morning. The repair/replacement was done, of course with huge amount of expenses.

What was the problem?

6. Just last week on it's way back from Delhi the car gave us another shock when the exhaust/silencer started ejecting smoke which was so thick and black that the person driving the car could not see even one foot at the rear and similarly the cars behind our car felt as as they the whole car was burning. It was a disgrace for the proud owner of a mercedes car. The car to be dumped at home. Subsequently we got in touch with T&T motors, who sent their mechanic to repair the fault but once again Rs. 5000/- had to be paid !!

Adulterated diesel is the first suspect.

This is just a small summary of problems, I am sure you can understand how shocking and hurting it is for my father to spend a fortune on a such an expensive car and have all these problems !!

I feel your pain and can say "been there, done that".

My suggestions to you:

1. Don't file a case. Slim chances of victory.

2. If you decide to retain the car, look out for a good independent. Owning a german car is far easier on the pocket with an after-market expert. Example : Cost of replacing engine mounts at Auto Hangar : 30,000+. Same parts + install by an after-market specialist : Less than 7,000.

3. Sell the car. Accord = More luxury than E Class or 5 series at half the price. German badge = BMW. Their 5 year service packages ensure a good nights sleep.

[omaragra]

Thanks guys for the in depth posts.

GTO I understand that the car is out of warranty, but here we are not pissed of because of that but because when you buy a so called Mercedes Benz for 50L, you expect a more refined vehicle than a Maruti.

Of course this a car and it can break down like any other car but every month !! Every month a new problem, that is unacceptable !!

I am sure everyone will agree with that.

Regarding the black smoke, I forgot to mention, the cover at the top of the engine was loose, so the vibration has been suspected to break some kind of pipe (I'll find out tomorrow exactly what pipe) which had caused the smoke. So it was not our fault that the cover of the engine was not properly fitted.

Also I believe the same issue might have lead to cracking/breaking of the coolant pipe/container whatever it was to break and mix with the engine oil !!

The car has just been towed away in a mini truck to the workshop. Lets hope things are not too bad !!

Oh by the way T&T motors are here in Agra for display of their cars, and my father was pissed off and planning to go and stand there and tell people not to buy a Mercedes !! LOL !! Haha!! My father standing next to the salesman and asking people not to buy a Mercedes !!

My father says he will spend another 5-10L but want T&T to burn in hell !! LOL !!


Omar

[tanwaramit]

Sorry to hear your experiences with the so called luxury car.

Japanese cars are anyday reliable, no wonder why they are top sellers worldwide. Be it Suzuki, toyota OR honda.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by omaragra

Hi guys,

1) My father is thinking about filing a case against Daimlerchrysler India.

2) Earlier the problems were regarding tyres, once the tyre used to get puncture it used to immediately get flat and become useless. We had to change 10 of them in total.

3) The headlights got dis-coloured, the company refused to change them saying that the warranty was over, so we paid 70K for their replacement.

4) The brake pads got spoiled before their usual change time, they gave us an estimate of 3.5L, but after my fathers negotiations they came down to 1.25L. The brakes were fixed the car came back, but after a few days the same brake pad error came on the screen, the car went back and the system was reset.

5) On another occasion, the car while being driven from Agra to Delhi stopped and failed to re-start. The car had to be towed away to Delhi workshop.

6) Today there was a free checkup camp at Agra ... sent for just a normal checkup and we were informed that some pipes were broken or something and the coolant and engine oil had got mixed up.

Now please advise what to do guys !! At the moment my father is planning to file a case !!

1) Harishv is fighting with Skoda since long. You know what he is getting, brand new timings i.e. dates. Sort of " Tareekh Pe Tareekh ". IMHO, just get rid of this car as its not reliable any more. Filing a case will not only eat money, it will consume your peace of mind and time too.

2) The original tyres that come OE fitted are generally not good, either in quality or they are not sufficient for the chassis capabilities. Here I think nobody can fault manufacturer, neither is this a good point in case of legal procedures.

3) These cars have designs for developed markets IMHO. But Indian operating conditions are very extreme as compared to the prime target market for these cars. Hence the problem.

4) I think your car has some Merc technology that they had put in S class too and this one thing managed to tarnish MB's image by a huge margin. Was it that it was system error in first place, but still due to faulty diagnosis brake pads were changed ?

5) What was the reason for breakdown ?

6) I am not expert, but IMHO, if the car does not have air cooler, i.e. external pipes for both oil and coolant, how come they got mixed up ? Can anybody elaborate on this ?


In general filing a case will lead to huge consumption of money, time and mental peace.

One more thing. Here Maruti is brought into discussion, but I think Maruti is one manufacturer that sells some of the most reliable cars in our country. They are not the best, but certainly a brand one can put trust on.

[omaragra]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

1) Harishv is fighting with Skoda since long. You know what he is getting, brand new timings i.e. dates. Sort of " Tareekh Pe Tareekh ". IMHO, just get rid of this car as its not reliable any more. Filing a case will not only eat money, it will consume your peace of mind and time too.

I think you are right !! My father has sent mails to DC India and lets see what the reply is .

By the way it would be real kind if any one can dig up the email address for DC Germany

Regards

Omar

[Screwdriva]

If you did your research, you'd realize that the W211, W220 and the W202/ W203 are probably the worst Mercedes car models ever built in the companys lineage. Don't touch them, even if they're free. While they make significant breakthroughs technologically speaking, MB has not been able to maintain quality control over these models AT ALL.

The W221 is better, but not by much. Just saw a car with just 30K kms on the odo with a failed submersible fuel pump. Total cost for the just the unit = Rs. 38,000/-. For comparison, I just saw a W126 S Class Fuel pump changed after 10 years at Rs 7000/-

Benz isnt what it used to be. Hopefully, time will change this but till then, I'd invest in a good W124, W126 or even a W140. IMO, Pinnacles of their engineering!

[McLaren Rulez]

Like many said, a court victory is unlikely. But do contact every Merc official, both here and in Germany. I'm quite sure Merc will be honorable enough to do something for you.

[canonball]

If not the court some really bad press should help MB get of its arrogant perch! I think we need to get a complete exposure of MB and their dealer practices via the press. Omaragra there have been few cases in Mumbai where the MR coffee guy sued & made a lot of press noise till they gave him a brand new car of a new model (the case went on for couple of years by when new & more expensive model came in). He used his old car till the day of replacement. Another car rolled on the expressay and that guy also got a new C class replacement for the old 124!.

Hormaz of Autocar told me 3 years ago he was going to do an expose on this I suppose there were political compulsions. If I were you I would round up few more owners like you and get the press involved you will for sure benefit in the meduim term. Also helps to convinve the press that if they do a proper expose all sorts of owners will tumble out of that closet with horror stories But as the rest said here is it worthwhile? If it happened to me I would take them and squeeze the dalights out of them and also do some much needed consumer public service and awarness around this it is high time. I must remind you though that after using an MB for one year I suspect most problems in India are related to how we use/operate the car and whom we let drive it! I suspect in many cases people almost abuse the car I may be wrong

Every one in my family is so dead agianst german cars/MB's just for this reason and therefore I am not able get one so if this episode helps improve things as a consumer I will help you in anyway possible

[Mpower]

What can I say..Lexus are you listening?? Anyway good that you are doing this. Most Merc owners suffer in silience thinking that this is the price to pay for luxury motoring.

Originally Posted by ajmat

Things are a lot better now but you seem to have suffered the brunt of Mercedes's distraction with Chrysler

Thats just a lame excuse given by Merc to cover up their own incompetencies. I can tell you first hand that after they took a financial stake, they had very little involvement with Chrysler and very little in the way of providing resources. Their fall from grace had started in the mid to late 90s (before the merger) when they launched the W124 replacement and the disastrous 1gen M-Class. The C class that followed was a bigger disaster.