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View Poll Results: Which cheapest car is your choice?
Maruti 800 DX 161 45.48%
Tata Nano LX 193 54.52%
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Old 14th June 2010, 23:17   #136
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World over nano is being studied in business institutes, there was a recent article also when gujrat plant went into production.

Nano as a product has immense capabilities, i feel Nano is far superior to 800 in space, quality, and lets not forgot it's fitness of purpose as a city car is unraveled. it's a unique concept being copied world over, i dont think when 800 came into existence in japan any such thing happened and it was just one of the run of the mills car made according to space restrictions there. although it did revolutionized indian market then but it was because of lack of other competition. remember the hype Nano is getting world over is in a world where there is leaps and bounds advancement in technology then when 800 was launched.

so from global point of view theres no competition between them.

in Indian senerio i feel if a person needs a car exclusive to city use then it's nano, nano and nano but if frequent intercity travel is needed and there is budget restriction then 800 else Alto anyday
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Old 14th June 2010, 23:37   #137
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and how come i forget 60k difference between base version of nano and 800 is a huge amount in relative terms.................for pure VFM factor in base models nano wins hands down. if someone is very vary restricted for budget i think saving 60k will be a big advantage to them and at least petrol for 15-20k kms equivalent to 1-2 yrs of fuel cost.

as some one mentioned second hand options then lets not forget that second hand options in 800 range are then multi fold then 1L range so lets not argue that point because diff of 60 in second hand market will fetch u a car with difference of 1-2 lacs when new new
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Old 14th June 2010, 23:37   #138
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Originally Posted by drsnt View Post
World over nano is being studied in business institutes, there was a recent article also when gujrat plant went into production.

Nano as a product has immense capabilities, i feel Nano is far superior to 800 in space, quality, and lets not forgot it's fitness of purpose as a city car is unraveled. it's a unique concept being copied world over, i dont think when 800 came into existence in japan any such thing happened and it was just one of the run of the mills car made according to space restrictions there. although it did revolutionized indian market then but it was because of lack of other competition. remember the hype Nano is getting world over is in a world where there is leaps and bounds advancement in technology then when 800 was launched.

so from global point of view theres no competition between them.

in Indian senerio i feel if a person needs a car exclusive to city use then it's nano, nano and nano but if frequent intercity travel is needed and there is budget restriction then 800 else Alto anyday
Is it not a rare case! Nano receives world wide attention but brickbats at home. As you said Nano received worldwide attention(M800 received none except in India), but people here crib that the top end version is at 2 lakhs(including all taxes).

These are FE figures posted by a Nano owner:

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...ml#post1934513
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Old 15th June 2010, 00:26   #139
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Originally Posted by aaggoswami View Post

6) This is a proper car. Yes I am sure this comment is going to get me bashed hard, but I think a car has to be a car and not a piece that is bonded with industrial adhesive. Tata nano does use some hydroformed steel but this is not enough. The use of Industrial adhesive is not as per my liking.

IMHO, Maruti 800 is a product that is proven and everyone knows what are the virtues of this car. Nano is just limited to city runabouts, but leave the city and Nano is not a good car.
Well, you are right about the bashing part . Anyway, I respect that this is your opinion, however, you might consider reading a little more about the adhesive they use.

The Nano is indeed designed to be a city runabout, a job that it does better than the 800 (in my opinion), with quicker steering, smaller turning radius, great driveability till 70kmph and higher seating.
It is also much more spacious (other than the boot).

OT: What happened to your Baleno? I recall that Innova Vs. Xylo discussion but couldn't dig up the thread.
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Old 15th June 2010, 00:36   #140
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Originally Posted by airbender View Post
Don't you contradict your self? In this post itself you say Nano is more safer in a crash and you say mine are merely assumptions. There are some pictures of Nano in a accident on the thread I mentioned. In almost all the crashes M800 (even alto) was in, the impact was felt inside the cabin.



Bashers filled the thread for 35 pages asking Tata to respond and finally when Tata did respond expect Supreme Baleno no one even had the courtesy to notice. This itself is enough to say there are enough suzuki's outthere who like to see the product die.

Well said.

I dont think the Premier Padmini and the Ambassador owners would have bashed the M800 when it was launched as much as the Maruti owners are bashing the Nano.

When it was launched i expected people to back the product, it being a "Desi" car with decent looks and limitless practicality compared to a scooter with 4 people on board.

But we being Indians, are so much comfortable with what we have at present, we dont want to see a change from the normal boxy designs we are used to seeing.

Some comparing the engine note to an auto rickshaw's one(not that Ratan Tata promised a Ferrari note, but some of us have to complain).

But cars like Nano in my opinion is going to revolutionarise the market.

Even if it doesnt make the cut and become successful, other manufacturers will try to launch their version of a cheap car making motored transport more affordable for the people to buy.

If Tata were given the perks and backed by the Govt. and other manufacturers denied entry into the market, the Nano would be as successful as the M800 if not better.

The bottom line is, the Nano is good as it is, and given the upgrades that it would eventually get in the future, it will remain at the top of the new car buyer's list.

The M800 had its time and it did shine.
Now its the turn of the new kid, and in my opinion, this kids got character and will shine.

Last edited by Grafin : 15th June 2010 at 00:37.
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Old 15th June 2010, 00:51   #141
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Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
Now its the turn of the new kid, and in my opinion, this kids got character and will shine.
Fantastic. Thanks for such a lucid and beautifully written post. Hats off.
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Old 15th June 2010, 03:45   #142
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I feel that both cars are equally good. The Tata Nano has made it possible for everyone today to afford a car. Likewise, The Maruti 800 when it came out was an affordable car back in the day. One cannot compare the 800 with its trim to the current nano. Times have changed and so have cars. The 800 rose up to become the people's car of the 80's to mid 90's. The Nano is doing it today. Both have achieved a lot of accolades in their respective eras. They are both iconic cars. While Maruti achieved this feat, the Nano is taking it to another level. Thus since the 800 set the benchmark for the "people's" my vote goes to the tiny tin box. It has laid the foundation stone for the Nano to take it one level higher!
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Old 15th June 2010, 06:44   #143
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people tend to exagerate their FE figures.
i see people claiming to get 21 on swift D's 20+ on verna etc and of course the on the nano 22-24kmpl etc.
which is Higher than ARAI figures. In real world situations (i mean driving in Bumper to Bumper,Highway driving with overtaking ,sudden halts etc and not switching off your engine and driving down a slope) Nano will give around 14-16.5 kmpl in the city.

This thread is pointless.
we are comparing products with a age difference of close to 20 years. Compare the nano to the rightful owner of the "800" tag the A star.
too bad maruthi introduced the alto/A star to make more profits (which any company would do(read sales figures))
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Old 15th June 2010, 10:50   #144
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Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
Well said.

I dont think the Premier Padmini and the Ambassador owners would have bashed the M800 when it was launched as much as the Maruti owners are bashing the Nano.
That's because you would have to spend a good amount on making your brand new Ambassador road worthy which was not required for the M800. I still remember people taking their brand new out of showroom Ambys to the nearest garage to get the joints and what not else welded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
When it was launched i expected people to back the product, it being a "Desi" car with decent looks and limitless practicality compared to a scooter with 4 people on board.
Yes its a good upgrade to a two wheeler but cannot be termed as a replacement for the M800 because it is not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
But we being Indians, are so much comfortable with what we have at present, we dont want to see a change from the normal boxy designs we are used to seeing.
I don't agree to that. We all love Ferrari like designs but for the common man function takes precedence over form.

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Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
Some comparing the engine note to an auto rickshaw's one(not that Ratan Tata promised a Ferrari note, but some of us have to complain).
I don't care two hoots even if it sounds like an auto. All I want is practicality and top notch reliability. Unfortunately the Nano comes nowhere near the 800 on both these counts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
But cars like Nano in my opinion is going to revolutionarise the market.

Even if it doesnt make the cut and become successful, other manufacturers will try to launch their version of a cheap car making motored transport more affordable for the people to buy.

If Tata were given the perks and backed by the Govt. and other manufacturers denied entry into the market, the Nano would be as successful as the M800 if not better.

The bottom line is, the Nano is good as it is, and given the upgrades that it would eventually get in the future, it will remain at the top of the new car buyer's list.
The Indian Govt has sold out most of its share in MSIL. SMC is currently the single largest shareholder in MSIL. The Nano is a good product on its own right, but it is not a worthy successor/replacement to the M800 in its current form. I don't think Maruti is currently getting any special treatment from the Indian govt. The only preferential treatment they got was to cut down the red tape on the insistence of the then PM of India.

The other red tape was import duty for vehicles manufactured abroad. This stands true even today and have benefiited all local manufacturers and not only Maruti.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
The M800 had its time and it did shine.
Now its the turn of the new kid, and in my opinion, this kids got character and will shine.
The Nano will surely shine but I don't think it will shine for as long or as brightly as the 800 did shine.

The Tatas deserve applause for what they have done for putting India on the global automotive map. They have brought in an altogether new segment and kudos to them for that. What they need to do is get those niggles fixed and lauch a Nano V2 with an openable rear hatch door and a more powerful engine. That probably, could be seen as a replacement for the M 800

Last edited by longhorn : 15th June 2010 at 11:03.
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Old 15th June 2010, 10:51   #145
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Originally Posted by drsnt View Post
and how come i forget 60k difference between base version of nano and 800 is a huge amount in relative terms.................for pure VFM factor in base models nano wins hands down. if someone is very vary restricted for budget i think saving 60k will be a big advantage to them and at least petrol for 15-20k kms equivalent to 1-2 yrs of fuel cost.

as some one mentioned second hand options then lets not forget that second hand options in 800 range are then multi fold then 1L range so lets not argue that point because diff of 60 in second hand market will fetch u a car with difference of 1-2 lacs when new new

Keep in mind that there are loads of people in India who earn less than 1 lakh a year and for them the 60 k is a huge amount.
A normal person who has a restricted budget will most of the time opt only for a new car (if he can get one within his budget ) than a second hand due to a lot of factors.
1. The satisfaction/pride of owning a new one than using something which is SECOND HAND
2.Warrenty: Almost all the new cars are covered under warrenties atleast for the first one year.

My first car was a second hand M 800 .Even though it was a good car I had to replace the following with in an year of purchase

Battery , Starting motor , Refill AC coolent ,Replace wipers , Change one of the shocks.

All these things on a new car (if occured) would have been covered under warrenty where as in my case I had to shell out money from my pocket.
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Old 15th June 2010, 10:59   #146
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I don't care two hoots even if it sounds like an auto. All I want is practicality and top notch reliability. Unfortunately the Nano comes nowhere near the 800 on both these counts.


Could you elaborate on this?
Why isnt a nano practical?Is it because it top speed is only 105 km and has limited use in highways?I cannot see any reason why its not practical when compared to M 800.

How is a nano not reliable ? Except for 2 incidents where nano caught fire, I have not heard of any other issues .
I also know some people who owns nano and they all are happy with it.
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Old 15th June 2010, 12:13   #147
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Originally Posted by praveen_n View Post
I don't care two hoots even if it sounds like an auto. All I want is practicality and top notch reliability. Unfortunately the Nano comes nowhere near the 800 on both these counts.


Could you elaborate on this?
Why isnt a nano practical?Is it because it top speed is only 105 km and has limited use in highways?I cannot see any reason why its not practical when compared to M 800.

How is a nano not reliable ? Except for 2 incidents where nano caught fire, I have not heard of any other issues .
I also know some people who owns nano and they all are happy with it.
The Nano was designed to be an in city commuter. So in city means shuttling to and from office, purchasing groceries and carrying them home etc. Now where do you expect me to place that 25 kg rice/wheat bag that I purchase month on month. You want me to offload that onto the rear seat? What do I do when I take my wife and kids along for grocery shopping? I need to carry my vehicle regisration papers, D/L, insurance copy etc. Where do I store them? This is what I meant by practicality. For a car with a virtually inacessible boot and an inexistent glove box, I don't think I would call it practical in the typical Indian scenario. Maybe, I could overlook these if it were avilable at 1L ex showroom, but not at current prices. Even for occasional highway trips, I would feel far more comfortable doing it in an 800 than on a Nano.

W.R.T reliability, I'm not talking about the fire issues. What I mean is long term reliablilty, like cranking at the first attempt every time for the next 10 years, not getting stuck on the road due to overheating issues etc. We have too few Nanos on the road right now to say how reliable they are and how reliable they will be in the long run, but going by the other products avilable from the same manufacturer, I don't expect the reliability to come anywhere near the M 800.

Last edited by longhorn : 15th June 2010 at 12:20.
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Old 15th June 2010, 12:22   #148
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Originally Posted by longhorn View Post

Yes its a good upgrade to a two wheeler but cannot be termed as a replacement for the M800 because it is not.


I don't care two hoots even if it sounds like an auto. All I want is practicality and top notch reliability. Unfortunately the Nano comes nowhere near the 800 on both these counts.


The other red tape was import duty for vehicles manufactured abroad. This stands true even today and have benefiited all local manufacturers and not only Maruti.



The Nano will surely shine but I don't think it will shine for as long or as brightly as the 800 did shine.

The Tatas deserve applause for what they have done for putting India on the global automotive map. They have brought in an altogether new segment and kudos to them for that. What they need to do is get those niggles fixed and lauch a Nano V2 with an openable rear hatch door and a more powerful engine. That probably, could be seen as a replacement for the M 800
Well you seemed to have disagreed to almost everything ive written

But il have to disagree with you on the second point. The Nano is a very good replacement to the M800 minus the few glitches it has developed.


I accept the boot is a let down, but comparing the cabin space, i just cant figure out how the Nano is not practical. Its more spacious and the interior quality is good enough for what you pay.

Tata at present is dealing with the problems faced by the few customers and sorting out the mess.
Dint/Isn't Maruti doing the same with the A star and no one is complaining about their reliability.


Dont forget the M800 evolved from the SS80 to become what it is today and if the Nano in its current form is able to stack up to the M800
(which i think it is), one can only imagine how better it will be in its next version.

We must be loyal to the old Girl(M800) but one cant deny the fact the Nano is the new hottie in town.

Last edited by Grafin : 15th June 2010 at 12:26.
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Old 15th June 2010, 12:51   #149
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Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
Well you seemed to have disagreed to almost everything ive written
Well that's my point of view. Yours could be different and you are most welcome to disagree to what I have said.

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Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
I accept the boot is a let down, but comparing the cabin space, i just cant figure out how the Nano is not practical. Its more spacious and the interior quality is good enough for what you pay.
To keep it short, I don't think cabin space can be a substitute for boot space and vice versa. More than the space, its the inacessability that's a big let down.

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Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
Tata at present is dealing with the problems faced by the few customers and sorting out the mess.
Dint/Isn't Maruti doing the same with the A star and no one is complaining about their reliability.
A brand new car catching fire minutes after being driven out of the showroom, IMO, cannot be compared with a recall for fuel pump issues identified and recified by Maruti(without waiting for the owner to come running to them). How you deal with the situation makes a world of difference to the customer.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Grafin View Post
Dont forget the M800 evolved from the SS80 to become what it is today and if the Nano in its current form is able to stack up to the M800
(which i think it is), one can only imagine how better it will be in its next version.

We must be loyal to the old Girl(M800) but one cant deny the fact the Nano is the new hottie in town.
The evolution from the SS80 to the current M 800 platform happened ,IIRC, way back in 1986. Its still a 25 year old design. Even the current Alto BS IV engine is basically the same as that of the SS80. A 25 year old engine design meeting Euro IV norms is no small matter. Yes, the humble M 800 can achieve what your Ford Ikons and Skoda Fabias could not. In that humility and practicality lies its USP.

Last edited by longhorn : 15th June 2010 at 12:54.
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Old 15th June 2010, 12:54   #150
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Originally Posted by longhorn View Post
A brand new car catching fire minutes after being driven out of the showroom, IMO, cannot be compared with a recall for fuel pump issues identified and recified by Maruti(without waiting for the owner to come running to them). How you deal with the situation makes a world of difference to the customer.
AFAIK, in case of the A-star, it was not even the fuel pump. It was the fuel line lid gasket, that leaked fuel in few cases, after being filled to the brim.
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