Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 20th July 2009, 00:24   #31
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: On The Net
Posts: 302
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MileCruncher View Post
Anyways coming to the topic on hand, a major component in pricing of an item is something called "Consumer Surplus" meaning why sell something for rs.5 when people are willing to pay Rs.8 which even though will reduce the number of customers but will result in profit maximisation.
That's why some manufacturers are able to price their cars high (and some so high!) and some manufacturers are not only unable to price their cars high, but pack them with features too
pmbabu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th July 2009, 00:33   #32
BHPian
 
d3mon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 469
Thanked: 582 Times
Default

Hey hey hey

It's not just another sad(true) story that has been posted here. These are just the FACTS. Cold hard facts.

And they sure are intriguing enough to warrant a new thread, IMO.
d3mon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th July 2009, 10:18   #33
Senior - BHPian
 
extreme_torque's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3,546
Thanked: 1,317 Times
Default

Well Hyundai is a business and they will price their cars at a price where they think people are ready to buy it... me and you dont have a say in it.
Another interesting point is that i20 is made in India not because they want to sell it for cheap in India, but Europe. They are happy to play the premium tag here which tells me they arent really bothered about the numbers sold in the Indian market.
extreme_torque is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th July 2009, 10:26   #34
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Pune
Posts: 2,499
Thanked: 1,268 Times
Default

I am a little surprised at this premium tag business that is stated all the time, and I am not sure that is the case. I think the Magna compares very well with many competitive cars and in the Asta, for the extra 90k, there is a lot more on offer. My one gripe about the Magna would be its lack of airbags, I consider that more important a safety feature than ABS, to be honest. Does the magna i20 not compare well on price and features with cars such as the Ritz ZXI, or some of the GP versions? And the Asta is not that much of a premium over the GP 1.4 emotion pack.
Sawyer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th July 2009, 10:34   #35
Distinguished - BHPian
 
SS-Traveller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 6,617
Thanked: 10,778 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashwinpak View Post

Version__UK Price___Diff*____India price__Diff*
=========================================
1.2________9625________________5.8 L__________
CRDI______10710____11.3%_____7.2 L_____24.1%
1.4AT_____11020____14.4%_____7.7 L_____32.8%

So looks like Hyundai has heavily overpriced the i20 CRDI and AT compared to the 1.2. The 1.2 looks good value for money. Those who are thinking of getting the CRDI should give a second look at the 1.2 petrol before proceeding.
The perceived savings by the Indian car-buying public when buying a diesel are much higher than in the UK or Europe, because of the larger differential in fuel prices between diesel and petrol. So the manufacturers get away with a bigger price tag on the diesel versions of their cars in India, because they know that the buyer wants a diesel because of its allegedly lower running costs. In the UK/USA/Europe, they wouldn't sell any diesels if the cost difference vis-a-vis its petrol sibling is too much.
SS-Traveller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th July 2009, 10:47   #36
Senior - BHPian
 
extreme_torque's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 3,546
Thanked: 1,317 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sawyer View Post
Does the magna i20 not compare well on price and features with cars such as the Ritz ZXI, or some of the GP versions? And the Asta is not that much of a premium over the GP 1.4 emotion pack.
I quite agree with you here.... just looked the prices again. The i20 1.2 Kappa is indeed well priced compared to the competition.
Punto 1.4 Emotion Pack comes for Rs 5.56 Ex Showroom Delhi while the i20 Kappa Asta is Rs 5.6 Lakhs.
GP gives you Blue & Me, wider tyres and a bigger engine while Asta has electronically folding outside rear view mirrors, glovebox cooling and better quality interiors... close call I must say!

The diesel and the 1.4 automatic in comparsion are terribly overpriced. The diesel 1.4 Magna is a whopping 1.4 Lakhs more than the 1.2 Magna compared to Punto diesel which is only 55k's more than petrol emotion pack.

Last edited by extreme_torque : 20th July 2009 at 10:55.
extreme_torque is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th July 2009, 11:03   #37
BHPian
 
pachchu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 139
Thanked: 37 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by extreme_torque View Post
The diesel and the 1.4 automatic in comparsion are terribly overpriced. The diesel 1.4 Magna is a whopping 1.4 Lakhs more than the 1.2 Magna compared to Punto diesel which is only 55k's more than petrol emotion pack.
I would guess the 1.4 AT's pricing is high for 2 reasons.

Lack of competition in automatic cars. In hatchbacks, there are only 2 automatics, i10 and i20, and both are different segments. Notice how 1.4L AT comes only in Asta and not in Magna.

Secondly 1.4 L engine doesn't get the same (excise duty?) benefit 1.2 L engine gets.
pachchu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th July 2009, 16:27   #38
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Ahmedabad
Posts: 1,457
Thanked: 10 Times
Default

well things rightly said around but just a thought that what hyundai offers for indian customers is the same quality and features offered overseas unlike other players where quality and features differs, so why not the difference that we see, i dont own hyundai but the facts says this,another reason for AT variants is their sole models on offer and so the reason for their enjoying the premium in both the category for i10 and i20.
vijaythacker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th July 2009, 19:51   #39
Team-BHP Support
 
.anshuman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Good-Gaon
Posts: 7,708
Thanked: 8,929 Times
Default

I feel the difference in pricing is due to the fact that both these versions use imported engines compared to the 1.2kappa which is locally manufactured.
.anshuman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st July 2009, 10:35   #40
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 294
Thanked: 14 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pmbabu View Post
If wishes were horses... ;-))

Which variant has tremendous competition? The 1.2 Petrol

....
Is there a connection between this and the pricing?
+1 to this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SS-Traveller View Post
The perceived savings by the Indian car-buying public when buying a diesel are much higher than in the UK or Europe, because of the larger differential in fuel prices between diesel and petrol. So the manufacturers get away with a bigger price tag on the diesel versions of their cars in India, because they know that the buyer wants a diesel because of its allegedly lower running costs. In the UK/USA/Europe, they wouldn't sell any diesels if the cost difference vis-a-vis its petrol sibling is too much.
We should compare the difference of Petrol and Diesel prices between UK and India.

If I am correct Diesel costs more than petrol in UK.

This will imply that comparing the models across the country is not relevant. The thread can be closed.
druva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st July 2009, 14:39   #41
ACM
Distinguished - BHPian
 
ACM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 4,152
Thanked: 2,456 Times
Default

In India the Fuel price are regualated and there is about 25% difference in the price of Diesel (lower) vs Petro. To the best of my knowledge (and I may be wrong) in UK the price of Petrol and Diesel are deregulated and Diesel is hence more costly than even petrol.

So diesel get a premium in UK market only for the higher effeciency vs petrol engines.

Diesel being significantly cheaper along with being more effecient gives Hyundai and all other manufacturers in India the opportunity to price the diesel even higher than they normally would.

Even incase of the new Laura, the 1.8 TSI is about 14 Landed and the similar specked Diesel in is 17.5L Landed.

Diesel engines do cost more to manufacfure due to the presence of Turbo and Intercoolers besides the basic engine block itself needs to be tougher.

The 1.4 AT on the other hand is priced higher due to the missing excise benefit as it is bigger than 1.2L plus the added cost of Auto.

All in all yes 1.2 is a good deal, but if you want Auto or diesel one is out of luck.
ACM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st July 2009, 15:14   #42
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 595
Thanked: 17 Times
Default

Speaking of numbers, I'm a bit intrigued as to what Hyundai's strategy is. Are they serious about selling the i20 here?

I do see Ads in newspapers, but TD cars of the i20 CRDI, 1.4 AT are still not available. I don't even get a proper response from the dealers as to when the vehicles will be available.

Last edited by CBlazer : 21st July 2009 at 15:17.
CBlazer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st July 2009, 15:26   #43
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Aberdeen, UK
Posts: 1,174
Thanked: 953 Times
Default

I think we also have to take into consideration that all the Hyundai petrol powerplants (Santro, i10, Accent, 120) are made in India while the diesel ones are still imported. Therefore the diesels will have to bear the burden of the additional taxes/duties imposed on them when being imported to India alongwith the increased price of a Diesel engine over a petrol one.

On the other hand in the U.K all the variants are fully imported and they do not have any difference in Duty/Tax structure. Therefore the only diff. one sees is the actual price increase of a diesel engine over a petrol one.

Hyundai has to seriously start considering locally producing their Diesel engines, the benefit of increased volumes once the diesel variants price drops goes without saying.
shortbread is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st July 2009, 18:20   #44
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 200
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

hi,

my 2 cents on this issue. i was excited when i read abt the launch of the i20 1.4 A/T, but when i saw the prices, i was flabbergasted. On-road mumbai, i20 1.4 Asta A/T (without sun-roof) costs 8.45 lacs (ex-showroom 7.66 lacs). This is higher than the top end versions of SX4 and Linea.

i wanted to make sense of this ridiculous pricing of this variant, and did some workings

The ex-showroom price of i20 1.2 Asta (non-O) is Rs. 5.87 lacs. So, there is a differnece of Rs. 1.8 lacs between 1.2 M and 1.4 A/T. This differnece is a premium for (i) Auto tranny (ii) 1.4 ltr engine

But is this premium worth it. Let see

Honda city: The difference between the Manual and Auto version of Honda City 1.5 S is Rs. 75K.

Punot: The differnece between the 1.2 and 1.4 ltr engine works out to Rs. 40K (this is a derived number, since punto offers only active variant in 1.2, but not in 1.4. So first, i removed the premium from active to dynamic and then computed the engine difference)

Taking the above, the premium should be just Rs. 1.15 lacs, whereas it is actually 1.8 lacs. One obvious reason could be excise duty, but that should be taken care of in Punto pricing as well, isnt it.

If the above workings provide some sensible indication of the pricing, to me the 1.4 A/T is horribly overpriced and i, for sure, will not buy it. Guess, i will have to settle with 1.2 manual.

Your thoughts guys?

Thanks
Ashish
ashishgandhi_00 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st July 2009, 18:47   #45
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Aberdeen, UK
Posts: 1,174
Thanked: 953 Times
Default

The Punto uses a 1.3 MJD, which is locally sourced therefore much cheaper than an imported Hyundai Diesel. Even then I agree that at 7.66 lacs the i20 auto diesel variant is ridiculously priced.
shortbread is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Team-BHP stands for the TRUTH. But Skoda wants to “instigate” Team-BHP and its users! GTO The Indian Car Scene 2624 21st November 2017 04:27
Ford Figo TDCi v/s Hyundai i20 CRDi v/s Hyundai i20 1.2 v/s Honda Jazz lamborghini Hatchbacks 24 18th December 2010 15:54
Vertical Doors, The Myth and The Truth m4ugr8 Modifications & Accessories 29 21st December 2008 18:43
K&N , Exhaust and other mods through Perf. Auto. Pricing and tthe Should I factor zaphod Modifications & Accessories 24 26th August 2007 14:59


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 04:56.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks