Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 5th September 2011, 19:28   #151
Team-BHP Support
 
ampere's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 15,611
Thanked: 8,607 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashis89 View Post
Even the same Fusion launched with a better pricing,lower spare prices and diesel power plant would sell IMHO. It was a good car,good looker too. Its high price coupled with high spare prices and late diesel entry spelled doom for it.
They tried this, but some how it was too late. By then the vibes had already died out. Also some people did not like the boxy looks from the back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
Now the EcoSport is based on the Fusion but is slightly higher and has 4WD. what a lovely vehicle that would be to have here in India. Only thing is that they need to load it with features and keep the price fair - say around 10 lacs on road max. this would simply eat up the top end Bolero, the Scorpio in most of its avatars and the Safari too.
I sincerely hope this becomes a reality. I feel that most players in India have
realized that public requires cheaper and smaller SUVs. Its just that, they don't know where to start this game. (A You-first attitude as its an unexplored market).
ampere is offline  
Old 5th September 2011, 21:45   #152
Senior - BHPian
 
shankar.balan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: BLR
Posts: 8,027
Thanked: 5,326 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

if they had realized there was a market out there for a good little SUV with diesel power and the general bells and whistles then maybe the dunderheads at maruti would have brought their Vitara in around 6-7 years ago. but they didnt which is why we are cribbing now sitting here!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ampere View Post
They tried this, but some how it was too late. By then the vibes had already died out. Also some people did not like the boxy looks from the back.



I sincerely hope this becomes a reality. I feel that most players in India have
realized that public requires cheaper and smaller SUVs. Its just that, they don't know where to start this game. (A You-first attitude as its an unexplored market).
shankar.balan is offline  
Old 6th September 2011, 06:47   #153
BHPian
 
Fusion2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Gurgaon
Posts: 150
Thanked: 23 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan
if they had realized there was a market out there for a good little SUV with diesel power and the general bells and whistles then maybe the dunderheads at maruti would have brought their Vitara in around 6-7 years ago. but they didnt which is why we are cribbing now sitting here!
Don't they already have the Vitara, or am I missing something ?
I was considering it but the price and reported poor interior qualities put me off.
Fusion2006 is offline  
Old 6th September 2011, 09:29   #154
Team-BHP Support
 
suhaas307's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 8,055
Thanked: 6,602 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
if they had realized there was a market out there for a good little SUV with diesel power and the general bells and whistles then maybe the dunderheads at maruti would have brought their Vitara in around 6-7 years ago. but they didnt which is why we are cribbing now sitting here!
I would be more interested in the SX4 Crossover. Also sold as the Fiat Cedici in some markets.

It is basically a SX4 without a boot hanging at the back. When viewed from the side, it has an 'estate-wagon-ish' feel about it. I'm sure the boot would be pretty large, just like the Jazz.

Think about it, a car with a great diesel engine, good GC, AWD, chunky tyres, decent interior space, all coupled with Maruti's super service-backup in India, it would be perfect!

Ford must look at building something on the same, or similar lines.
suhaas307 is offline  
Old 6th September 2011, 11:18   #155
Distinguished - BHPian
 
vb-san's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: S'pore/Thrissur
Posts: 4,701
Thanked: 3,893 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Quote:
Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
I would be more interested in the SX4 Crossover. Also sold as the Fiat Cedici in some markets.

It is basically a SX4 without a boot hanging at the back. When viewed from the side, it has an 'estate-wagon-ish' feel about it. I'm sure the boot would be pretty large, just like the Jazz.

Think about it, a car with a great diesel engine, good GC, AWD, chunky tyres, decent interior space, all coupled with Maruti's super service-backup in India, it would be perfect!

Ford must look at building something on the same, or similar lines.
The SX4 hatch definitely looks good, though its showing the age now. But that’s predominantly a hatch with a bit of beefy looks. I hope Ford is looking at a proper mini-SUV here, with the famed driving dynamics
vb-san is offline  
Old 6th September 2011, 12:10   #156
Senior - BHPian
 
ashis89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 1,314
Thanked: 1,050 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Quote:
Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post

Think about it, a car with a great diesel engine, good GC, AWD, chunky tyres, decent interior space, all coupled with Maruti's super service-backup in India, it would be perfect!

Ford must look at building something on the same, or similar lines.
Think of a 'base' model of the above mentioned without the AWD and other electronics but all basic SAFETY features at a much lower price and it will be like .

Ford and Maruti, are you listening?
ashis89 is offline  
Old 6th September 2011, 12:14   #157
BHPian
 
R.P.M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 179
Thanked: 7 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

@suhaas - its the people who dont own mondeos who think its not reliable. 7 years and 85000 kms later i can tell you that it was one of the most reliable cars that i ever owned. All that was required was regular scheduled service. Infact i spent less on the mondeo than i did on a indica turbo in 5 years.

Im sure most mondeo owners on the forum would agree with me. The cost of spares was a lot higher than the accord at that point of time, but there was away to get around that.

I always thought that Ford would launch the new fully loaded version, waited for the longest time, but since i dont see it happening i settled for a laura.
R.P.M is offline  
Old 6th September 2011, 14:02   #158
Senior - BHPian
 
shankar.balan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: BLR
Posts: 8,027
Thanked: 5,326 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

not the grand vitara. they have another model called the samurai in some markets and vitara in some markets - plain vitara this time.
its like a better appointed gypsy. its a functional utility vehicle which would have been the logical gypsy replacement had they even bothered about that segment over the last 20 years!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fusion2006 View Post
Don't they already have the Vitara, or am I missing something ?
I was considering it but the price and reported poor interior qualities put me off.
shankar.balan is offline  
Old 6th September 2011, 22:07   #159
Team-BHP Support
 
suhaas307's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 8,055
Thanked: 6,602 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Quote:
Originally Posted by vb-san View Post
The SX4 hatch definitely looks good, though its showing the age now. But that’s predominantly a hatch with a bit of beefy looks. I hope Ford is looking at a proper mini-SUV here, with the famed driving dynamics
I think it's more than just a hatch. It's quite a large car, the SX4. The boot just adds length, not to mention, boot space! The GC would be great too, especially for India road conditions. And the diesel would be the icing on the cake. It would be a great car, but it is dynamically flawed, the SX4.

That's where Ford always shines. In terms of driving dynamics, Fords never disappoint. Even the taller, SUVish Fusion was a great handler. Let's hope Ford leaks some of that magic into the new mini-crossover.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashis89 View Post
Think of a 'base' model of the above mentioned without the AWD and other electronics but all basic SAFETY features at a much lower price and it will be like .

Ford and Maruti, are you listening?


Quote:
Originally Posted by R.P.M View Post
@suhaas - its the people who dont own mondeos who think its not reliable. 7 years and 85000 kms later i can tell you that it was one of the most reliable cars that i ever owned. All that was required was regular scheduled service. Infact i spent less on the mondeo than i did on a indica turbo in 5 years.

Im sure most mondeo owners on the forum would agree with me. The cost of spares was a lot higher than the accord at that point of time, but there was away to get around that.

I always thought that Ford would launch the new fully loaded version, waited for the longest time, but since i dont see it happening i settled for a laura.
That's good to know, R.P.M.

I've always loved the Mondeo, It's the perfect entry-level luxury car. It was, and I believe that it could be, if Ford re-launches it, kits it to the brim and prices it competitively.

So it looks like it was the expensive spares that killed it. Also, Fords used to suffer from terrible depreciation. They just couldn't gold their value as well as Hondas could, and still can. I remember our Ikon was eventually sold after 6 years for a price of just 1.8 lakhs! When we bought it, it was 7.5 on the road!

It has improved though, off late.

Last edited by suhaas307 : 6th September 2011 at 22:07. Reason: Deleted extra emoticon
suhaas307 is offline  
Old 7th September 2011, 06:24   #160
Senior - BHPian
 
shankar.balan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: BLR
Posts: 8,027
Thanked: 5,326 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

the SX4 A Pillar can be a pain in terms of visibility in city driving especially when making a right turn on our narrow roads.
the Ford Mondeo when launched was quite an expensive car - close to 20 lacs on road as it was a CBU. If they relaunch it now also, given the way things have evolved, there would be relatively less takers for it I think.

Quote:
Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
I think it's more than just a hatch. It's quite a large car, the SX4. The boot just adds length, not to mention, boot space! The GC would be great too, especially for India road conditions. And the diesel would be the icing on the cake. It would be a great car, but it is dynamically flawed, the SX4.

That's where Ford always shines. In terms of driving dynamics, Fords never disappoint. Even the taller, SUVish Fusion was a great handler. Let's hope Ford leaks some of that magic into the new mini-crossover.



I've always loved the Mondeo, It's the perfect entry-level luxury car. It was, and I believe that it could be, if Ford re-launches it, kits it to the brim and prices it competitively.


It has improved though, off late.
shankar.balan is offline  
Old 7th September 2011, 09:30   #161
Team-BHP Support
 
suhaas307's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 8,055
Thanked: 6,602 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
the SX4 A Pillar can be a pain in terms of visibility in city driving especially when making a right turn on our narrow roads.
That's true.The large A-Pillar creates a blind-spot for the driver and round-abouts are an absolute pain. I see several cars suffer from the same problem. The Jazz, too, has an issue concerning its A-Pillar, but it isn't as bad as the Civic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
the Ford Mondeo when launched was quite an expensive car - close to 20 lacs on road as it was a CBU. If they relaunch it now also, given the way things have evolved, there would be relatively less takers for it I think.
It was indeed a CBU. I believe Ford should assemble the Mondeo in India, if they ever want it to be successful. Localization is the key here. Relaunching it as a CBU would leave Ford in a position where they're going to merely re-live the past.

Localization would not only bring the cost of the car down and make it more affordable, spare parts would be cheaper too. The new Mondeo is a brilliant car, and would be an instant leader in the D-segment. But I'd like to stress on localization again, without which, it would bomb badly, again.
suhaas307 is offline  
Old 7th September 2011, 09:40   #162
Senior - BHPian
 
shankar.balan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: BLR
Posts: 8,027
Thanked: 5,326 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

If all these manufacturers only listened to us, we would have far greater choice and quality available to us by now. And the tendency of the Indian manufacturers to "milk" the consumer would become a thing of the past.

Take Hyundai Tucson - the top spec used to cost around 9 lacs equivalent, brand new, in SE Asia in 2005-2006. That spec had a few things that the Indian one didnt have - side airbags and so on.

The Indian spec was slightly watered down and came to consumers here at an on road price of nearly 20 lacs - on account of it being a CBU and because of the 120% import duty.

Now, 5 years later, one can buy one of these around 9 lacs - which was the price for a brand new one 5 years ago in S E Asia! To top it off that one had a better spec. Isnt this ridiculous?

Hyundai could easily have leveraged their huge facilities and built this brilliant vehicle in India with a high percentage of localisation. This could have been a brilliant entry level SUV for the masses.

If Hyundai had bothered to do this, then M&M and Tata would have risen to competition and kept the prices of Scorpio and Safari etc under control while loading it with lots of goodies. Nothing like a bit of competition to get these fellows to re-calibrate.

As it stands both M&M and Tata are guilty of milking the Indian consumer by over-pricing their products and charging unreasonably for features which are considered mandatory and basic when applying International Standards - we Indians are only buying these vehicles on account of lack of choice!

Quote:
Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
if they ever want it to be successful. Localization is the key here. But I'd like to stress on localization again, without which, it would bomb badly, again.
shankar.balan is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 7th September 2011, 09:52   #163
Team-BHP Support
 
suhaas307's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 8,055
Thanked: 6,602 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
If all these manufacturers only listened to us, we would have far greater choice and quality available to us by now. And the tendency of the Indian manufacturers to "milk" the consumer would become a thing of the past.

Take Hyundai Tucson - the top spec used to cost around 9 lacs equivalent, brand new, in SE Asia in 2005-2006. That spec had a few things that the Indian one didnt have - side airbags and so on.

The Indian spec was slightly watered down and came to consumers here at an on road price of nearly 20 lacs - on account of it being a CBU and because of the 120% import duty.

Now, 5 years later, one can buy one of these around 9 lacs - which was the price for a brand new one 5 years ago in S E Asia! To top it off that one had a better spec. Isnt this ridiculous?

Hyundai could easily have leveraged their huge facilities and built this brilliant vehicle in India with a high percentage of localisation. This could have been a brilliant entry level SUV for the masses.

If Hyundai had bothered to do this, then M&M and Tata would have risen to competition and kept the prices of Scorpio and Safari etc under control while loading it with lots of goodies. Nothing like a bit of competition to get these fellows to re-calibrate.

As it stands both M&M and Tata are guilty of milking the Indian consumer by over-pricing their products and charging unreasonably for features which are considered mandatory and basic when applying International Standards - we Indians are only buying these vehicles on account of lack of choice!
I couldn't agree with you more Shankar.

There is one query though. If the Tucson was a CBU, then isn't it supposed to be pretty much the same car sold abroad? How was it watered down for our market? As far as I know, a car gets watered down for our market only if it is localized, a la, the Polo, the Swift, etc.

I don't think localization would have brought the price down to the same prices quoted in other markets. Ours is a different sort of market. It would probably be much cheaper, but still a lot more than the other markets. Eg, the Civic.

Anyway, we're going terribly off-topic now. Back to Ford's latest.

So what's Ford's 5-year plan? What do they hope to roll out onto our shores in the near future? The mini-crossover is on the cards, as discussed. Then there is the much talked about Focus sedan that should have been here in 2005. The new Fiesta is said to be available in hatch-mold soon enough. How precise is the information on the hatch?
suhaas307 is offline  
Old 7th September 2011, 10:26   #164
Senior - BHPian
 
shankar.balan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: BLR
Posts: 8,027
Thanked: 5,326 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Yes it is and it isnt. The India Tuc spec came with only 2 front airbags and no side curtain airbags. I think the International one had ESP which the Indian one doesnt have. However the Indian one has 2 airbags, 4 disc brakes, ABS, TCS and 4WD.

About Ford I have heard absolutely nothing yet - on new crossover or anything else. I dislike this extreme secrecy on the part of the mannufacturers!

Quote:
Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
There is one query though. If the Tucson was a CBU, then isn't it supposed to be pretty much the same car sold abroad? How was it watered down for our market? As far as I know, a car gets watered down for our market only if it is localized, a la, the Polo, the Swift, etc.
The mini-crossover is on the cards, as discussed. Then there is the much talked about Focus sedan that should have been here in 2005. The new Fiesta is said to be available in hatch-mold soon enough. How precise is the information on the hatch?
shankar.balan is offline  
Old 7th September 2011, 11:10   #165
Distinguished - BHPian
 
vb-san's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: S'pore/Thrissur
Posts: 4,701
Thanked: 3,893 Times
Default Re: Ford India's future line up

Quote:
Originally Posted by suhaas307 View Post
I think it's more than just a hatch. It's quite a large car, the SX4. The boot just adds length, not to mention, boot space! The GC would be great too, especially for India road conditions. And the diesel would be the icing on the cake. It would be a great car, but it is dynamically flawed, the SX4.

That's where Ford always shines. In terms of driving dynamics, Fords never disappoint. Even the taller, SUVish Fusion was a great handler. Let's hope Ford leaks some of that magic into the new mini-crossover.
I have sat in one of those, and almost same as a Swift (actually same wheelbase as of Jazz). Better leg space than the Swift, but narrower.

What I meant to say was, I hope the offering from Ford is better than an SX4 hatch kind of a car. Actually they have so many samples available internationally, which they can tweak and get to India. It’s quite time for manufacturers to treat India as a matured market.

And if they get the car before the launch of Duster, quite possible that Duster will bite the dust!


Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
I dislike this extreme secrecy on the part of the manufacturers!
Oh yes, completely agree. And even worse is, after all those secrecy, they come up with a compromised product – e.g.; Fluence, New Fiesta.
vb-san is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
6 month old Ford Figo DCT: Battery dead 7 times! An ordeal with Bhagat Ford & Ford India Night Raven Technical Stuff 27 20th September 2016 16:25
The future of GM, Ford & FIAT in India... prateekswarup The Indian Car Scene 17 18th July 2013 15:48
Ford petrol product line gap. WindRide The Indian Car Scene 12 6th May 2010 14:31
Ford India introduces new Fiesta line-up with ABS, DRIVER AIRBAG, 1.6 ZXI and more sidindica The Indian Car Scene 37 14th February 2008 17:30


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 15:46.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks