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Old 1st September 2009, 09:18   #16
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Originally Posted by bhp1 View Post
What Toyota needs to spruce up is their design philosophy, its increasingly becoming very generic(boring).
The Altis and the Fortuner are not bad.

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Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
If you want design and get more adventure out of life, then there is always the Octavia, Laura, and Superb.
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Old 1st September 2009, 09:54   #17
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Fortuner looks cool on the outside, but still follows the family looks in the interiors. - logical thing to do.

The added dealerships will ensure monopoy of the existing ones goes.

They could also be getting the Camry in CKD here,
Hope they get the City alternatives as well.
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Old 1st September 2009, 17:34   #18
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They will need to improve their network if they have any plans on launching a smaller, high volume car.
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I hope this means what I think it means. Tha Yaris or an equivalent is coming.
Hahaha, you guys took the word right out of my mouth. The Innova is the only vehicle that brings Toyota decent volumes today. This is probably paving the way for a volume sedan or hatchback.

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Delhi is perhaps amongst the largest market for Toyota,
Delhi, or rather North India, is the largest market for most car makers, especially the more expensive ones (10+ lakhs). I remember a Mercedes exec telling me that Mumbai is a "tiny" market for Mercs, compared to the numbers they do up North

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They are not big or even close to that in these markets.
If only Toyota had moved earlier, and quicker, in India. The largest car maker of the world has only a miniscule 3% market share, after a decade of presence in India. They need to get cracking ASAP.

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how about making the lc200 a CKD. you can save a lot then. Definitely will sell much more then what it is doing right now.
You bet! Locally building the LC would prolly get the onroad price down to 55 - 60 lakhs.

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Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
If you want design and get more adventure out of life, then there is always the Octavia, Laura, and Superb.
Good one. On a serious note though, I agree with BHP1. Toyota's products are perceived as bland by the masses, they have been concerned of the older average age of their brand clientelle (vis a vis say Honda). It really wouldn't take too much to pack a little more appeal into the design & drive.
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Old 1st September 2009, 17:45   #19
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Given that Toyota does not have a long and sustained history of making losses, you can bet that they will manufacture cars in India only if it is profitable to do so over an investment horizon (ie initial gestation losses but profits later). Perhaps, they will move down and those profits could be used to finance losses (if any) in the premium segments.

Honda does manufacture the Accord, but Toyota is slower and definitely more conservative.

As to the older age, true for most, but not all. Going by his nature (extremely austere and conservative), my closest colleague in my company would be the last person to buy a Honda, but he did buy a Honda Civic just 3 months back.

As to the Mercs and Camry, please do visit the rich towns of Punjab (Jalandhar, Ludhiana, Amritsar etc) to find out what they dig. My wife's home is in Jalandhar.

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Old 1st September 2009, 19:59   #20
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If you want design and get more adventure out of life, then there is always the Octavia, Laura, and Superb.
You have mentioned all the Skodas, did you want ot get one instead of your Corolla? I don't see Skoda's high on design, they are rather conservatively styled. Nothing contemporary in their design element.

"Adventure", do you mean the A.S.S debacle!

What more does Toyota have than others, its a competitive world, one can't afford to lack in anything. There are no bad products in the market.

Luxury cars are more than just "reliability", they need style & looks, in which Toyota's are seriously lacking. I can't see a car more boring than the earlier gen. Corolla, even the Altis is high on features & thus the sales. Otherwise the Civic had it beat on most fronts.

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Originally Posted by prince_pervez View Post
The Altis and the Fortuner are not bad.

Being "not bad" is not enough, its a highly competitive scene out there, one has to be the best!

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Originally Posted by vasudeva View Post
As to the Mercs and Camry, please do visit the rich towns of Punjab (Jalandhar, Ludhiana, Amritsar etc) to find out what they dig. My wife's home is in Jalandhar.

Not the Camry's, they are a rare sight in these towns, Accord rules the roost.


In the future, one would see Toyota adopting a better design philosophy because this is not the time to be conservative. Everyone has everything, the margin for "error" is very thin.
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Old 1st September 2009, 20:06   #21
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You have mentioned all the Skodas, did you want ot get one instead of your Corolla? I don't see Skoda's high on design, they are rather conservatively styled. Nothing contemporary in their design element.
This is OT, but when I bought my Corolla, I also wanted to consider an Octavia to at least want to take a TD. However, got totally turned off by their take it or leave it Govt. organisation attitude, total indifference, and also the problems that were there even then. Result: did not want even a TD of Octavia as their customer attitude pre-sale was so pathetic. So far, I have had not any regrets with my eventual buy.
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Old 1st September 2009, 20:20   #22
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This is OT, but when I bought my Corolla, I also wanted to consider an Octavia to at least want to take a TD. However, got totally turned off by their take it or leave it Govt. organisation attitude, total indifference, and also the problems that were there even then. Result: did not want even a TD of Octavia as their customer attitude pre-sale was so pathetic. So far, I have had not any regrets with my eventual buy.
So that's natural to leave some scars! Is that the psyche behind you suggesting Skoda's for design & adventure because Im no Skoda fanboy & just consider them to be average. As far as Octy. goes, its design is a complete box, appeals to many but I like modern designs. Still, I find Octy's design more appealing than the older gen. Corolla(personal choice).

In terms of cutting edge design & products bristling with technology, Honda is the numero uno.
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Old 2nd September 2009, 15:40   #23
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At last they are waking up. Lets see how far it is going to be meteralize. I believe that the network will help to get a confident of the owner to take them any where in India Which MSIL got.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 18:19   #24
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Looks like 3 new dealerships have been added since the time that this thread was opened.

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TKM Crosses 4 Lakh Unit Retail Sales

• A milestone in TKM’s 11 years of existence
• TKM on an expansion drive with dealer network to touch the 150 mark by 2011
• Consistent demand for the Innova and Corolla Altis, market leaders in their respective segments
• Fortuner well-accepted with record bookings

Bangalore, November 3rd, 2009 - Toyota Kirloskar Motor Pvt. Ltd. (TKM) today announced that it has crossed 4 lakh unit retails sales in India since its inception. The company also announced a 50 per cent jump in total sales at 5,650 units in October 2009, when compared to the same period last year.

The rise in sales figures can be attributed to the excellent response for the Corolla Altis and Innova, and introduction of the Fortuner in August this year, all of which are market leaders in their respective segments.

Mr. Hiroshi Nakagawa, MD, TKM said, “We are looking at introducing new models in India to enhance our presence in the market, besides providing technologically advanced and environmentally friendly cars for Indian customers.”

Commenting on the sales milestone, Mr. Sandeep Singh, Deputy Managing Director, (Marketing) TKM said, “This is a big step towards establishing Toyota as one of the major players in the Indian automobile market. This in fact could not have come at a better time for us, with the launch of the compact car in the Indian market next year.”

In line with its growth, Toyota continues with its aggressive expansion plan in India by adding to its existing network of dealerships across the country, and by tying up with nationalized banks making car loans more accessible. Currently, Toyota has 93 dealerships at present and has firmed up plans to enhance its dealer network to 150 outlets before the launch of its much awaited compact car in 2011.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 18:43   #25
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Can't wait for 2011 with Toyota being Toyota bullet proof reliability matching / exceeding Honda is given and that they have tried to be market leader in all segments is given fn will be how they will take on City features , diesel engine , space , ride quality ? and let us not forget Nissan which is also coming out with its sedan and again Japanese reliablity and to bring up the rear will be Linea with 1.6 MJD as per current plans .
Wow can't wait for Jan ' 11 .
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Old 3rd November 2009, 20:35   #26
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The numbers are perhaps look low given the price point at which Toyota sells its vehicles today. They have to increase their dealer/service network if they are to launch their mid-sizer which is coming in 2011. But I'm sure this giant has done it's homework well.

When launched, I'm sure it will be one hell of a VFM car with the quality one expects of a Toyota. I was recently comparing OE accessories' prices of the City and Altis (yes, they are in two different segments). I was shocked to see the price differences. If someone can take the fight up to the Marutis and Hyundais in terms of pricing and yet retain its bullet proof reliability/quality, it is Toyota.

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Old 3rd November 2009, 23:35   #27
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Are Toyota products that technologically advanced as mentioned by Mr. Hiroshi Nakagawa, MD? Sure they are built to last but how can their stock products compare to the best of the lot? (Camry vs Superb); (Altis vs Laura 1.8). e.g. One one hand their 3 liter engines cough up 170 BHP and 343 NM torque, new diesels from Hyundai (R Series 2.2) are leagues ahead!

As someone mentioned before, Innova is the real savior for Toyota. Their SUV's enjoy big Toyota heritage; Barring "Built to Last" and "Reliability" thing, generally Innova, Altis and Camry are very boring to drive and all of them have bland interiors.

As of now, I do not see anything from Toyota as technologically advanced as their smarter and more hungry counterparts. In all honesty, I can't see Toyota challenging Hyundai or Suzuki in Hatch segment (which Toyota wants to excel in) or even small car segment anytime soon.
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Old 4th November 2009, 01:30   #28
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Originally Posted by 1-Testosterone View Post
Are Toyota products that technologically advanced as mentioned by Mr. Hiroshi Nakagawa, MD? Sure they are built to last but how can their stock products compare to the best of the lot? (Camry vs Superb); (Altis vs Laura 1.8). e.g. One one hand their 3 liter engines cough up 170 BHP and 343 NM torque, new diesels from Hyundai (R Series 2.2) are leagues ahead!

As someone mentioned before, Innova is the real savior for Toyota. Their SUV's enjoy big Toyota heritage; Barring "Built to Last" and "Reliability" thing, generally Innova, Altis and Camry are very boring to drive and all of them have bland interiors.

As of now, I do not see anything from Toyota as technologically advanced as their smarter and more hungry counterparts. In all honesty, I can't see Toyota challenging Hyundai or Suzuki in Hatch segment (which Toyota wants to excel in) or even small car segment anytime soon.
But if the toyota machines are as reliable as they are, then their technology is obviously 'right'. Just because the engine puts out less hp or is less involving to drive doesn't mean it's not equally if not more advanced.

Their focus and priorities are completely different. Skoda can never build an innova, and toyota can never build a laura.

Btw, your forgetting toyota was one of the earlier researchers in hybrid technology and sells one of the most popular hybrids, Prius. Isn't that advanced technology?

I feel you are comparing two completely different topics.
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Old 4th November 2009, 07:53   #29
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I'm not questioning their ability to manufacture technologically advanced vehicles. They do it worldwide but when it comes to India, they bring in their 'Bread and Butter" models with minimal equipment where as others (Skoda, Honda, Hyundai etc.) bring in one of their better technologically advanced vehicles and they keep on upgrading them regularly for good. Honda was the one who took the initiative by bringing in their Civic Hybrid way ahead of any other manufacturer. Accord 3.0 (which automatically shuts down cylinders as per as driving conditions) is still overall a better and technically advanced car than Camry.
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Old 4th November 2009, 11:14   #30
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But if the toyota machines are as reliable as they are, then their technology is obviously 'right'. Just because the engine puts out less hp or is less involving to drive doesn't mean it's not equally if not more advanced.
+1.. If the cars are so reliable then the technology has to be right, atleast in the condition they operate. I own a Corolla since 2005, 70 k in ODO and not even once I had reliability issues( touchwood ). I go to bed with the assurance that when I put in that key and ignite, the car will take off and make me mobile. Will I trade that for a DSG Tranny that may not give me that assurance, but a few seconds thrill of ripping? No way. Toyota, Honda ( and Hyundai Accent GLX that I owned nine years back )win hands down in that. I keep hearing horror stories about Skoda, and will not even bother to touch them with a barge pole how much ever VFM their products are.

May be I will get branded as "Old", but hey, a car designed beautifully which may not functionally take you from Point A to Point B, reliably every time you want it to, is useless.That is the basic thing to expect from a car.

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