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Old 7th September 2009, 13:59   #136
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Originally Posted by kpzen View Post
Why do u say so?
CRDi has a very beefed up suspension whereas the Getz P had a very soft suspension.
I remember a few years back I had the keys to Memo's Getz P and we were going to his farm. The getz had a pretty stiff suspension (which later became must softer as the model kept undergoing variant changes) and memo driving my baleno couldn't keep up except for the straights where the baleno's horses would inch it closer. The Getz P had a horrendous engine to match up to its handling capabilities. Comparing that to the one we have now, its a very stark contrasting difference. I have also had the opportunity to see JD Madan race his Getz with Koni's on track (Koni says they have none available) and he was faster than all the esteem's, baleno's, vtec's. Goes to show that the car is good handler. JD was very impressed with the Getz's handling, something coming from a man like him you better not argue. Maybe Akshay has forgotten that incident.
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Old 7th September 2009, 14:18   #137
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I agree with v1p3r on his views. Having owned and driven a 2006 Getz Petrol, I see no stiffness or good handling in that car. Neither do I find anything exciting about the Elantra diesel. Not everyone buys a car to do top speeds or have the best acceleration. Some want cars that look good too. The Elantra is no where close to a good looking car. And for 10L+ it surely wasn't 100% vfm as a package.

Also remember that everyone isn't blessed with a race track on his backyard and neither does everyone consider a track time to be the best judge of a car. Some people can have fun with a '47 Chrysler New Yorker driven at 60 kmph as much as driving a 2007 Hyundai car at 160 kmph on track.

Coming to the point, I find Hyundai cars to be 100% functional. They are made to do a kind of job without bringing any excitement into it. Santro does go from point A to point B without any fuss. There is no non sense electronics on it and it gives 17 kmpl while serving the duty of a horse carriage. I don't see any fun factor in throwing a Santro around corners or accelerating it to 160 kmph. It is a totally functional car with zero excitement, unless you consider toppling a car to be exciting enough. I have two in the family and after 60k+ kms it feels like all four wheels driving in directions of their own. And it isn't cheap to maintain anymore.

The Getz Petrol is spacious, average interiors, good plastics, better built than the Swift. Spares are expensive, there is something or the other that keeps going wrong with it. Has nice cubby holes to store 750 ml liquid bottles around. Handles like a boat, engine is dead. Love the dead pedal, (the one on the extreme left).

Stock v/s stock, the Getz diesel is fast in a straight line but sucks around corners. No matter how much you shout atop rooftops on its handling praise and your driving super skills, it is a boat around corners and nothing better than an Accent. The Swift diesel is more confidence inspiring and probably would hold a speed more tightly around corners.
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Old 7th September 2009, 14:50   #138
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I have also had the opportunity to see JD Madan race his Getz with Koni's on track (Koni says they have none available) and he was faster than all the esteem's, baleno's, vtec's. Goes to show that the car is good handler.
That was bcoz it had a tuned suspension setup and JD behind the wheel.

When i drove Wolf's car, i overtook many Race Esteems. Infact JD was riding shotgun in a race esteem driven by someone and he told me that no matter how much the driver tried, he couldn't keep up with the VTEC.

But this in no way means that the VTEC is a better car on track than a race esteem. It was prob the driver's inexperience that allowed me to pull away.

I've driven the Getz, Verna and the Elantra. They have good handling, but as good as it is made to be.

I rem one of the mags had tested the Fiesta D and Verna D at the Chennai track. While the Verna made minced meat of the Fiesta in a straightline, its track performance wasn't as good as it was expected to be for such a quick car.

Shan2nu

Last edited by Shan2nu : 7th September 2009 at 14:58.
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Old 7th September 2009, 15:05   #139
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this is a long thread and i tried to read as many posts as possible.
but i couldn't find any reference related to the Hyundai's car designs that have been more than "just inspired design copies" (did i get that right?) from the other well established manufacturers (Jaguar, Mercedes).
this is especially true in their bigger cars. though the cars might fare well - they lose the credibility hence the cheap feeling for the brand.

(my personal opinion no offence meant to anybody- do we have an acronym or a smiley for this )
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Old 7th September 2009, 15:07   #140
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Infact JD was riding shotgun in a race esteem driven by someone and he told me that no matter how much the driver tried, he couldn't keep up with the VTEC.
Shan! Vtec has the power to pull ahead on the straighter sections. The Getz didn't have a good engine to begin with, it was purely JD's driving and the setup. Also, like you mentioned maybe the guy driving the esteem's wasn't that great a driver. But when JD was driving, there were some experienced people driving their own track esteems and not someone who rented it out. And JD was able to keep up with them and not lose too much ground while he kept smoking other drivers on track who were less experienced but decent drivers.

I had a personal word with JD after that session about the Getz. He was pretty excited about that car and described that it handles really well (and I would take his word on it). In comparo, I would like to see a Getz with a good suspension setup and then compare how good it would be with the swift. Swift handles well, but you can't carry good speeds into corners because the engine won't let you carry power. The Getz gives you the fun factor into corners, now to see if one can make it handle a bit better. Imagining how much fun that would be.

On highways, I don't think the Getz is as bad as Kiran made it sound like. I have driven the Crdi a lot over the last few weeks, to Nandi, to Yercaud and back. Its not in the league of the swift, but it doesn't come close to the way the Accent handles by miles, period. And having pushed it as hard as the car could have gone, I would say its like the difference between a stock Vtec (not great handling) and a modded Vtec suspension (the difference is quite a lot). I find the Vtec stock suspension rubbish and suicidal for that engine. You might find it to be more than enough. I just said, its not as bad as people make it out to be. If you don't agree, fine!
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Old 7th September 2009, 15:28   #141
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Shan! Vtec has the power to pull ahead on the straighter sections.
What straighter sections? This was on the short loop and the VTEC was faster everywhere.

Thats why im telling you, dont take track day results so seriously. Coz we can't really say who is pushing their cars to what extent.

Race Esteems do 1:14 on the short loop and 2:04 on the long loop. A stock engined Getz with whatever suspension cannot be anywhere close to those times.

Quote:
On highways, I don't think the Getz is as bad as Kiran made it sound like. I have driven the Crdi a lot over the last few weeks, to Nandi, to Yercaud and back. Its not in the league of the swift, but it doesn't come close to the way the Accent handles by miles, period. And having pushed it as hard as the car could have gone, I would say its like the difference between a stock Vtec (not great handling) and a modded Vtec suspension (the difference is quite a lot). I find the Vtec stock suspension rubbish and suicidal for that engine. You might find it to be more than enough. I just said, its not as bad as people make it out to be. If you don't agree, fine!
Theres only one way to settle this. You get an ECU'd getz with performance suspension on track and i'l come with my VTEC which is using stock suspension parts.

We can hook them up to a vbox and see what lap times they put in and how they perform on various sections of the track.

Lets also use the same tyres so that no-one gains an advatage from tyre compound.

Shan2nu
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Old 7th September 2009, 16:02   #142
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Very well said moralfibre.. It could not have come out better.

A car designed to take people from pt A to B, that's it! and it does it's duty very well!

I would personally feel much comfortable pushing a swift round a corner than a getz/santro/accent anyday!! (Saying this from my personal experience)
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Originally Posted by moralfibre View Post
I agree with v1p3r on his views. Having owned and driven a 2006 Getz Petrol, I see no stiffness or good handling in that car. Neither do I find anything exciting about the Elantra diesel. Not everyone buys a car to do top speeds or have the best acceleration. Some want cars that look good too. The Elantra is no where close to a good looking car. And for 10L+ it surely wasn't 100% vfm as a package.

Also remember that everyone isn't blessed with a race track on his backyard and neither does everyone consider a track time to be the best judge of a car. Some people can have fun with a '47 Chrysler New Yorker driven at 60 kmph as much as driving a 2007 Hyundai car at 160 kmph on track.

Coming to the point, I find Hyundai cars to be 100% functional. They are made to do a kind of job without bringing any excitement into it. Santro does go from point A to point B without any fuss. There is no non sense electronics on it and it gives 17 kmpl while serving the duty of a horse carriage. I don't see any fun factor in throwing a Santro around corners or accelerating it to 160 kmph. It is a totally functional car with zero excitement, unless you consider toppling a car to be exciting enough. I have two in the family and after 60k+ kms it feels like all four wheels driving in directions of their own. And it isn't cheap to maintain anymore.

The Getz Petrol is spacious, average interiors, good plastics, better built than the Swift. Spares are expensive, there is something or the other that keeps going wrong with it. Has nice cubby holes to store 750 ml liquid bottles around. Handles like a boat, engine is dead. Love the dead pedal, (the one on the extreme left).

Stock v/s stock, the Getz diesel is fast in a straight line but sucks around corners. No matter how much you shout atop rooftops on its handling praise and your driving super skills, it is a boat around corners and nothing better than an Accent. The Swift diesel is more confidence inspiring and probably would hold a speed more tightly around corners.
Please call me when you guys are planning to do this. It is sounding very very interesting.

I am so interested in this, cuz , 1 I own a vtec and would like to see it in full on action and 2, I am planning on picking up a getz crdi..

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Originally Posted by Shan2nu View Post
What straighter sections? This was on the short loop and the VTEC was faster everywhere.

Thats why im telling you, dont take track day results so seriously. Coz we can't really say who is pushing their cars to what extent.

Race Esteems do 1:14 on the short loop and 2:04 on the long loop. A stock engined Getz with whatever suspension cannot be anywhere close to those times.



Theres only one way to settle this. You get an ECU'd getz with performance suspension on track and i'l come with my VTEC which is using stock suspension parts.

We can hook them up to a vbox and see what lap times they put in and how they perform on various sections of the track.

Lets also use the same tyres so that no-one gains an advatage from tyre compound.

Shan2nu
Cheers
Shrey

Last edited by ssjr0498 : 7th September 2009 at 16:04.
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Old 7th September 2009, 16:12   #143
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Shan, I find it quite funny you want to compare a turbo diesel to India's hottest perfomance enthu car. I would rather compare the Getz to a Swift D. Infact I would do the following:

1. Compare a stock Getz D to a stock swift (both cars with better rubber).
2. Compare a Getz D with better suspension, no ECU to a swift with a Pete's/RD box.
3. Compare a Getz D with suspension, ECU to a swift with ECU.

That would be a fair comparo.

I don't think the Getz would be as quick as Vtec, but you never know (I would love to try it out, once the boys get ready with the car). Infact, when the Elantra clocked a 2:17 on the long loop, I was surprised myself, pleasantly though. You don't expect it to be faster than an RS, but a diesel car doing something like that exceeds all your expectations. I am sure you will agree that not many people even dreamed a front end heavy, diesel car could do a timing like that on a Vbox. The point is, I ain't saying an elantra is more FTD than an RS, but that its not as bad as Akshay makes it out to be. Such are the general perceptions, coming mostly from people who have had little/no experience driving these cars.
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Old 7th September 2009, 16:32   #144
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Shan, I find it quite funny you want to compare a turbo diesel to India's hottest perfomance enthu car. I would rather compare the Getz to a Swift D.
I dont see anything funny.

I mentioned this coz you said that Memo in a Baleno couldn't keep up with you in a stock petrol getz.

The getz d is much quicker than that in stock form itself. Add to that, an upgraded ECU and performance suspension.

All i have with me is India's worst handling fast car (which wont be fast compared to the ECU'd getz) and just 2 sessions worth of track experience.

I'm the one thats at a disadvantage here.

Im sure we can work out something. It'l be nice to try it out. Such tests could create more interest and increase track-day participation.

Shan2nu
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Old 7th September 2009, 16:37   #145
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I mentioned this coz you said that Memo in a Baleno couldn't keep up with you in a stock petrol getz.
Yes, memo was driving my baleno. You have to counter in some mild traffic, bad roads filled with huge potholes, mountain sized speedbreakers on the way to his farm. The Getz suspension was much stiffer compared to its recent siblings but yet it was the perfect compromise for street and enthu driving. I didn't have to slow down for every pothole, speedbreaker like memo had to on my baleno. Yet the Getz was not so bad that I couldn't push it (I would never dare pushing an accent or a Getz Crdi like that).

Quote:
Im sure we can work out something. It'l be nice to try it out. Such tests could create more interest and increase track-day participation.
I agree. I'll keep you informed. We might be doing a track day soon.

Last edited by mclaren1885 : 7th September 2009 at 16:38.
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Old 7th September 2009, 17:04   #146
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Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
I would rather compare the Getz to a Swift D. Infact I would do the following:

1. Compare a stock Getz D to a stock swift (both cars with better rubber).
2. Compare a Getz D with better suspension, no ECU to a swift with a Pete's/RD box.
3. Compare a Getz D with suspension, ECU to a swift with ECU.

That would be a fair comparo.
It doesn't become a fair comparo just because you say so.

There's almost 35bhp / 50Nm difference between the two cars in stock form. However much u modify the Swift the 200cc difference and the VGT factor will still be there.

Rahul.

Take no offence but you are blindly glorifying the brand and creating hatred in the minds of people who are reading it.


As MF has said, Hyundai makes good 100% functional cars for commuting from point A to point B. Their diesels are fast and efficient but that doesn't mean it can set records on a track. After all its a diesel !!

A high revving petrol like the VTEC can set record on the track and can make you grin on a weekend blast but a CRDi is made to munch miles on the highway relentlessly and effortlessly.

Last edited by kpzen : 7th September 2009 at 17:14.
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Old 7th September 2009, 17:15   #147
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There's almost 35bhp / 50Nm difference between the two cars in stock form.
KP, a swift with a box puts out 90bhp, 97 in stage 2 I guess. Swifts superior handling makes up for the difference in bhp now? Anyways, I was just contemplating the difference between the three tunes in both cars. According to your theory no two cars can ever be compared because they will always have a CC difference.


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Take no offence but you are blindly glorifying the brand and creating hatred in the minds of people who are reading it.
And what do you think I am achieving by glorifying the brand? I call the S.drives crappy, you call them brilliant. Does it mean you are blindly glorifying them too?


Quote:
Their diesels are fast and efficient but that doesn't mean it can set records on a track. After all its a diesel !!
KP, thats the exact point I am trying to put across. On the road these cars are nice to own and drive. But its quite sad people just shoot comments like it handles like a boat and end their reasoning with that. Mention of a track was only to put everything on a plain field. Same distance, road surface, no traffic, you can push the car to its limits etc.

Quote:
A high revving petrol like the VTEC can set record on the track and can make you grin on a weekend blast but a CRDi can munch miles on the highway relentlessly and effortlessly.
Tell me about it. My baleno has been parked for nearly 2yrs now and I enjoy taking it out for the occasional spin. But given a long drive, the Crdi's it is.
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Old 7th September 2009, 17:17   #148
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Shan, I find it quite funny you want to compare a turbo diesel to India's hottest perfomance enthu car. I would rather compare the Getz to a Swift D. Infact I would do the following:
Funny.... why??? Getz makes more power and torque compared to the Vtec... I say why not? Elantra no matter what you say isnt a good handler. Look at the front and rear overhangs, the thing rolls around even if going swiftly round a roundabout!

Last edited by extreme_torque : 7th September 2009 at 17:20.
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Old 7th September 2009, 18:03   #149
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I agree with kpzen. I don't think this thread serve any purpose. We all know about the pros and cons of Swift and Getz or for that matter almost everyone is aware that hyundai does build nice cars.

Their diesels the Verna, Accent and Getz are good and have a lot of power but after 50-60K they still have problems. I know this for a fact as friends own Verna CRDi and after 50K -70k everyone's car has lost the grunt. Turbos has been checked and replaced and everything is fine in the car. One of the guy is relative of the owners of the dealership and he's been facing the problem for past 10K km and there is no fix for it. Elantra engine is in different league all together.

I have nothing against Hyundai or the cars they manufacture. As a matter of fact I like the current Santro Xing (not the new improved interiors one), Getz, i20, Accent, Elantra, Tuscon, Sonata. Not a big fan of i10 but it serves the purpose. Verna is a boat so there is a love 'n hate relationship with it.
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Old 7th September 2009, 20:20   #150
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Funny.... why??? Getz makes more power and torque compared to the Vtec... I say why not? Elantra no matter what you say isnt a good handler. Look at the front and rear overhangs, the thing rolls around even if going swiftly round a roundabout!
Sorry - its obvious that ET and Mclaren love each other - I am NOT getting involved...BUT...

Elantra inspired more confidence in me than any car I have driven this side of 15lacs. (Road spec) Vtec unfortunately inspired NO confidence in me for its is a car that had FAILED its crash tests and was banned from being sold in many countries. Please bear in mind that it used to weigh some 965 odd kgs only (kerb wt)

Elantra's composure at high speeds (150 Plus) is brilliant and its brakes are to die for! It is a slightly nose heavy diesel (kerb wt 1350kgs IIRC), hence if you allow for that and adapt your driving style, you can carry more momentum into the turn, brake as late as possible (27 mts for 100-0), and torque your way out accelerating faster than the petrols. (you cant beat it in in gear acceleration).

The biggest problem is to meet someone who knows how to drive their cars.
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