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Old 13th November 2009, 10:57   #61
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Knowing Maruti, I don't think they will bring out the M13A in the Swift as this would entail a higher cost (huge increase from current retail price) for bringing in a new engine line. On the other hand, there is high probability of the K series 1.2 unit finding it's way to the Swift from January onwards(read ecomomies of scale) . There is an annual shutdown of the plant during the last two weeks of December for maintenance. During this time they would probably make the necessary changes in the assembly line to bring on the K series engine.
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Old 13th November 2009, 13:22   #62
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If the 1.2KB series engine is plonked in Swift, the sales of Ritz Petrol may be affected. So, Maruti may not - and should not - do it.

Swift has many USPs like style, character, performance, etc but Ritz don't have that much. Maruti knows it very well, and they may not like to kill Ritz before its time. Let Ritz sell well with its a efficient engine, and Swift with a 'perform'ing engine.
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Old 13th November 2009, 14:04   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by romeomidhun View Post
If the 1.2KB series engine is plonked in Swift, the sales of Ritz Petrol may be affected. So, Maruti may not - and should not - do it.
Manufacturers think differently when compared to us enthusiasts. For them, what matters most is how much of profits they can extract from the sale of a vehicle. This can be done in two ways -
1. Increase the price of the product
2. Reduce the manufacturing cost of the product.

Option 1 may not be recommended in today's cut throat competitive environment. Hence the sensible way to go would be option 2. Remember that both options would lead to an increased profit for the company. What I am trying to do here is to read the minds of the maruti boffins. As much as I wish I could see the M16 VVT make its way into the Swift's hood, I feel it may not make it at present going by Maruti's conservative approach. Hopefully we could get to see it in the next gen Swift. Again, going by recent the Swift ads, if at all anything's cooking, IMO it could be a different state of tune(read better bhp and torque figures) from the K12B. ( Maruti can we have VVT . )
That would not lead to a much higer tooling cost, but at the same time it would help in product differentiation from the Ritz. (Remember M800 5 Speed that had 4 valves per cylinder instead of the two we get now). May be something on these lines could be expected at most. I really hope I'm proven wrong here and Maruti plonk in an M13A and do justice to the character of the Swift.
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Old 13th November 2009, 14:23   #64
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Kinda advt MSIL showing these days for swift, I expect a bigger engine to come in it. No less than 1.3. Could be K or M series.
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Old 17th November 2009, 13:27   #65
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The 1.6VVT in Swift will only be a dream. If that happens, theoretically, the same engine should go to DZire also. That will not happen by any means, as it will take DZire in direct competition with SX4. So at most, we can expect a 1.3L M-series engine in Swift. So it can be a scaled-down version of SX4 engine as Sid once mentioned.
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Old 19th November 2009, 07:18   #66
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If Maruti is going to deploy the same K12M engine in Swift, they would enjoy tax benefit given by our government.

So, does it mean that we'll get the benefit of price reduction on new Swift?
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Old 19th November 2009, 08:27   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradox View Post
If Maruti is going to deploy the same K12M engine in Swift, they would enjoy tax benefit given by our government.

So, does it mean that we'll get the benefit of price reduction on new Swift?
I think Maruti will pass on the tax benefit to customers. Maruti cannot afford to keep the price at similar levels considering increased competition. Mostly they will pass on the benefits.
This means that days will be tough for Ritz. Same engine as Ritz, so people will prefer Swift over Ritz any day. This is happening in case of Diesel models of Swift and Ritz. Once Swift with K12M appears, the customer will end up confused, and evnetually end up buying swift even if he planned to go for Ritz. Swift looks better, is proven in the market.

For the first time, Maruti is facing this problem due to multiple models leading to massive overlapping. But as Maurti had earlier clarified, they are looking at overall sales and not just individual sales of models.

Sincerely I hope they come out with 1242 cc version i.e. K12B. That motor puts out 87-89 bhp. But reality crashes through this.
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Old 19th November 2009, 09:07   #68
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The Ritz ZXi costs 5.67L on road bangalore whereas the Swift ZXi costs Rs. 6.2L on road. That 50K premium is to differentiate between the 2 cars. When the swift comes out I'm sure it will be priced a little more premium than the outgoing one. They may add some extra features to increase the price point and maintain the difference between the Ritz and Swift. The Swift ZXi has climate control whereas the Ritz does not.
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Old 19th November 2009, 09:34   #69
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Well, if there is a premium over the current cost of on Swift ZXi then it would put serious doubts in the minds of people who want to buy a hatchback. It would put swift in the league of Jazz & Fabia. Some one who is a non-member of TBHp would surely end up buying fabia instead of Swift ZXi.

I would personally dump my present car and get a Swift Vxi when it comes with a K12B or M13 (or what-ever) engine.
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Old 19th November 2009, 09:40   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MutantX View Post
Well, if there is a premium over the current cost of on Swift ZXi then it would put serious doubts in the minds of people who want to buy a hatchback. It would put swift in the league of Jazz & Fabia. Some one who is a non-member of TBHp would surely end up buying fabia instead of Swift ZXi.

I would personally dump my present car and get a Swift Vxi when it comes with a K12B or M13 (or what-ever) engine.
The fabia is a 3cylinder 1.2L engine and is not in the league of the Swift when it comes to performance.

If they price the Swift at 6.25L for the ZXi they are still lesser than the i20 1.2L petrol by 40K and will still be lesser than the Jazz by 2.2L.

It's better if they reduce since they will get tax benefits but I don't think they will as swift has gained that reputation and can command the premium.

Hopefully if they do bring it with a slightly increased tag they will improve the plastic quality and look into the rattles.
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Old 19th November 2009, 09:58   #71
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IMO they wont be putting the K12B in the Swift as this will hit the Ritz sales real bad. Even when you consider economies of scale while deciding a new engine, there is the Dzire sedan which will also be sharing the engine with the Swift. So bringing in the M13A will prove advantageous for Suzuki.

Now after the release of Tata Manza, Suzuki wont dare to put the K12B in the Dzire. As this will create a feeling that the Dzire engine has been downgraded, they wouldn't want to jeopardize the Dzire sales.

The Swift is atleast similar in size to the Grande Punto.So with the new engine, we could expect an increase in Zxi's price to a level similar to Punto's Emotion Pk. This will help to differentiate the Ritz and the Swift even further.

Last edited by harishnair : 19th November 2009 at 10:06.
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Old 19th November 2009, 10:14   #72
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I don't think Maruti would be investing crores of rupees to bring in a new engine for a difference of 100 odd cc (1.2 to 1.3). If the present G13 motor could be tuned to meet the Euro IV norms, they may do so and continue with the same motor. IMO it's highly unlikely that that would be bringing in a new engine line for the Swift at this time unless they have no intention of bringing in the next gen Swift which id due in 2010-2011..

Last edited by longhorn : 19th November 2009 at 10:15. Reason: spelling correction
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Old 19th November 2009, 10:28   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vid6639 View Post
It's better if they reduce since they will get tax benefits but I don't think they will as swift has gained that reputation and can command the premium.

Hopefully if they do bring it with a slightly increased tag they will improve the plastic quality and look into the rattles.
I agree they should reduce rattles, add more features. But reduce the price tag. Or atleast maintain it.
Swift is not a new car any more. Maruti has sold enough numbers to offset their R&D.

If Swift falls in Fabia or Jazz category, people will go for Jazz because, firstly its a Honda and secondly its has acres of space inside.
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Old 19th November 2009, 14:22   #74
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Wonder if the aam-admi understands the J-K-L-M we are discussing here. His parameters are fixed no matter what you plonk under the hood.
1. Price
2. Mileage
3. Space
4. Looks

In that order i guess. Seriously, of all the cars that Maruti sells, how many people make their decision based on anything to do with the engine? At max, the only technical parameters considered for making the decision maybe bhp & torque.

For most outside of this forum, as long as maruti maintains the key parameters, they will buy any new swift avtaar. My take.
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Old 19th November 2009, 14:38   #75
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When did maruti offer engine options? They never did - so decision was never based on the engine. Recently, the market changed Marutis opinion on engines (SX4).

SWIFT has been bad experience for me. It is unmovable with A/C on.
Extremely Harsh suspension. Rattling glass windows. Unrefined and rough 1.3 G13B engine.

I will never buy a Maruti again, even if i am tempted to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nilesh5417 View Post
Wonder if the aam-admi understands the J-K-L-M we are discussing here. His parameters are fixed no matter what you plonk under the hood.
1. Price
2. Mileage
3. Space
4. Looks

In that order i guess. Seriously, of all the cars that Maruti sells, how many people make their decision based on anything to do with the engine?

Last edited by aerohit : 19th November 2009 at 14:40.
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