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Old 9th October 2009, 00:01   #211
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I think thats why some of us got quite involved in the Polo thread. Those of us who were expecting a true hot-hatch with the quality and finish to match will ultimately be disappointed. In the end, not only do you get what you pay for, but you also get what sells.
That's why you should never expect too much in India.Atleast from a European manufacturer in the small car segment.Blame it on the tax system.The maximum they can do is load a hatch with some nice features,but never a spirited engine. Even the Swift here comes with the Esteem 1.3 unit(not that it is bad) and does away with the international 1.5.

Even the Figo's a generation old.We have to live with this.

Last edited by AyAn! : 9th October 2009 at 00:06.
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Old 9th October 2009, 00:25   #212
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That's why you should never expect too much in India.Atleast from a European manufacturer in the small car segment.Blame it on the tax system.The maximum they can do is load a hatch with some nice features,but never a spirited engine. Even the Swift here comes with the Esteem 1.3 unit(not that it is bad) and does away with the international 1.5.

Even the Figo's a generation old.We have to live with this.
You can't entirely blame the tax system or the Government. People in India want exactly this and they're getting it. The feeling of being shortchanged never strikes them. They never analyze the European market and compare it to the Indian market (which is a wrong thing to do in the first place)

The Indian market is totally different and brands like VW and Honda cater to the people accordingly. People want it and they get it. Its we, the minority, who end up feeling shortchanged at the end of it.
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Old 9th October 2009, 00:40   #213
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You can't entirely blame the tax system or the Government. People in India want exactly this and they're getting it. The feeling of being shortchanged never strikes them. They never analyze the European market and compare it to the Indian market (which is a wrong thing to do in the first place)
Yes! As a market.we are obviously not matured enough as Europe.There's no room for real hot-hatches and lifestyle vehicles here.

That's why good cars like the Fusion and Forester failed here.Thats why Merc doesn't and won't launch the A Class here.

Mostly the tax system,the value of the Indian currency,budget constraints and partly due to the sheer ignorance of the car buying majority are to blame.
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Old 12th October 2009, 12:39   #214
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I completely agree with chncar and is a point that I make in most of the forums. Cars that are common ones are branded premium and we pay a premium price for the saem. Corolla is just a college goers car in western world, but a premium car in India. Civic sells for around 7.5 L in US, but is sold around 13 L here. Is the tax regime is the one to blame for this?

However manufacturing/assembling in India is much cheaper and we are not seeing that get reflected in the price.
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Old 12th October 2009, 12:47   #215
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I completely agree with chncar and is a point that I make in most of the forums. Cars that are common ones are branded premium and we pay a premium price for the saem. Corolla is just a college goers car in western world, but a premium car in India. Civic sells for around 7.5 L in US, but is sold around 13 L here. Is the tax regime is the one to blame for this?

However manufacturing/assembling in India is much cheaper and we are not seeing that get reflected in the price.
yeah but what happens is that in the USA. they have everything safety as standard and every other features as options.

look into details and you will find that AC is not standard in the base trim models of civic. as you move up to the ladder on the trim levels the price goes up!! but its still like 3 lacs cheaper than in india. even if we get the comparitive speced trim right between the both indian and US civic.

i also hate the fact that they always skip on side and curtain airbags and TCS and ESP in india. you should have an option to get it!! if not standard.

Last edited by Caramelo : 12th October 2009 at 12:54.
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Old 12th October 2009, 14:26   #216
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i also hate the fact that they always skip on side and curtain airbags and TCS and ESP in india. you should have an option to get it!! if not standard.
I guess the culprit here is incredible low demand of optional safety equipments. They cannot even make up for the manufacturing/import costs!

I would love to do/read a survey of 1 day customers visiting in 5-6 top auto sellers (maruti, hyundai, tata, honda, toyota, ford etc) showroom(in any metro city), and ask whether they would opt for front airbags, side airbags,curtain airbags, ABS + EBD, TCS, ESP etc. if offered at additional price.

I guess (but do not hope) the outcome to be 95% negative!

Last edited by blackasta : 12th October 2009 at 14:27.
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Old 12th October 2009, 21:35   #217
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I guess (but do not hope) the outcome to be 95% negative!
The irony is that India is where you need it the most. In most developed countries, the odds of getting into an accident are far lower.
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Old 12th October 2009, 22:17   #218
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The irony is that India is where you need it the most. In most developed countries, the odds of getting into an accident are far lower.
Well, I have seen horrific accidents in US (head on collisions, pileups) and have also seen people walk out of those collisions! All due to safety measures in the cars.
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Old 13th October 2009, 12:31   #219
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Well, I have seen horrific accidents in US (head on collisions, pileups) and have also seen people walk out of those collisions! All due to safety measures in the cars.
I'm not saying there are no accidents abroad. But the odds of one happening are much higher in India. And yet, even though we are at a greater statistical risk, we still don't always emphasize safety features.
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Old 13th October 2009, 14:16   #220
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This is because for the first time buyer, car is more safer than bike, so he feels that Airbags and ABS are not of much use for him. Only for second or Third time buyer it feels Airbags and ABS are important.so there are more first time buyer than the later.
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Old 13th October 2009, 16:51   #221
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This is because for the first time buyer, car is more safer than bike, so he feels that Airbags and ABS are not of much use for him. Only for second or Third time buyer it feels Airbags and ABS are important.so there are more first time buyer than the later.
Spot on.

Also, a major factor is the attitude of car companies in pricing positioning the ABS/Airbags. Typically on sub-10L cars (recent Honda being the exception) those are available only on the top variant. I understand that maybe the manufacturers need to offer variants without Airbags, but why position it out of the reach of average buyers who might want safety but might not want to pay for body colored bumpers, stereo system and other frills.

Govt can help by:
1> Providing tax breaks for ABS/Airbags
2> Mandating pedestrian safety measures on vehicles as in Europe.
3> Mandating that every variant of a car should have the option of ABS/Airbags that the customer can choose if desired.
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Old 13th October 2009, 16:58   #222
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3> Mandating that every variant of a car should have the option of ABS/Airbags that the customer can choose if desired.

This is exactly what we need. Airbag+ABS marketed as a 'safety pack' for every variant. If companies can launch 'limited editions' with chrome handles + body graphics + rear spoiler, they can do this very easily. The car companies are just feeding off the ignorance that is widespread in the general public.
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Old 15th October 2009, 18:41   #223
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What I really want to know is how VW or even Skoda can justify their premium pricing and lack of features when a Tata seems to be doing so much better.

Anyone taken a look at this thread?:
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...ve-report.html

Look at the climate control, the center console, the steering mounted controls, heck even the beige interiors. Plus it has a boot, and looks like it comes for the same price a Fabia does!

It might make more sense to buy this rather than a badly watered down Polo!
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Old 15th October 2009, 18:48   #224
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It might make more sense to buy this rather than a badly watered down Polo!
I dunno about that. A Polo would excel in things that Tata are traditionally bad at like ride and handling, build quality, refinement etc. Tata cars are always VFM but still outsold because although equipment is important, the final product matters more.

And beige interiors are NOT a feature
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Old 15th October 2009, 20:52   #225
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Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez View Post
I dunno about that. A Polo would excel in things that Tata are traditionally bad at like ride and handling, build quality, refinement etc. Tata cars are always VFM but still outsold because although equipment is important, the final product matters more.

And beige interiors are NOT a feature
Only refinement is something which was lacking in earlier one. However as per recent Test reports Manza has addressed that as well.

And beige interiors is considered by many as feature in India

This makes me believe now Polo will be priced competitive too.
Customer is the King at last
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