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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:03   #16
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Audi : German build amazing road presence. extremely good-looking cars

BMW : Same as above but on a higher class.

Chevrolet : Down to earth cars. After-sales average. Great VFM products

Fiat : Over-rated cars for speed fanatics.

Ford : Do not know what cars suit Indian conditions. They try to sell combs to bald people.

HM : Utterly directionless company. Typical babu-type image.

Honda : Amazing cars with great fit and finish . Totally ridiculous prices.

Hyundai : Cars made to a price. good after-sales (can be improved). Some products are stonkers but priced like white elephants.

Mahindra: reliable cars with a pathetic fit and finish. great After-sales.

Maini : Can do much much better. Govt needs to give it a supporting hand in terms of subsidies to bring the cost of electric cars down.

Maruti : great cars , over-rated after-sales for that matter pre-sales too.

Mercedes : Classy. Cars made to last a lifetime.

Mitsubishi : fast cars. non-existant after-sales

Nissan : god knows

Skoda : steer clear

Tata : great spacious cars with amazingly poor fit and finish

Toyota : good cars but tad over-priced

VW : need to develop a perception. but skoda is their daughter concern so bit biased

--Vikrant
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:04   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez View Post
GTO, its going to get increasingly hard to see a general trend with posts like those above.
Are you kidding me? The posts offer invaluable reading material. Spaced out the cut-copy-paste text in my opening post for better readability.

Sorry, but the forum doesn't support tabular formats.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:10   #18
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Audi : Quattro, great road grip, sexy looks, high maintenance

BMW : Driving machine, playboy toy, reliable, mean looks

Chevrolet : Korean, boring, mostly VFM

Fiat : Thud closing doors, great engines, handling, chassis, worst A.S.S ever.

Ford : Great fun to drive for the price, slightly below class leading interiors, great diesel engine, inconsistent A.S.S

HM : Please die!

Honda : high revving engine, awesome reliability, re sale, excellent interiors

Hyundai : VFM, boring, middle of the road cars, decent interiors, good A.S.S, good all rounder without being really good at anything

Mahindra : Jeep, rural, thugs

Maini : Toy car

Maruti : VFM, tin cans, reliable, excellent A.S.S

Mercedes : Solidly built, inconsistent electronics, snob value

Mitsubishi : Drivers car, bad A.S.S

Nissan : No opinion yet. Serious.

Skoda : Tank, high speed stability, shoddy A.S.S, VFM in the premium segment

Tata : Niggles, niggles and more niggles. VFM.

Toyota : Rock solid reliability, engineering, quality, re-sale

VW : Build quality, suspect electronics
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:12   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Are you kidding me? The posts offer invaluable reading material. Spaced out the cut-copy-paste text in my opening post for better readability.

Sorry, but the forum doesn't support tabular formats.
If a tabular format is not supported, maybe someone can think of some way to get the data into a format that's easy to understand. I can't think of any other way at the moment but trust me, as this thread grows bigger, it'll be increasingly difficult to get a good idea of the general trend.

When its twenty pages long, if someone asks you what the average TBhpian thinks of, say, Fiat, it'll be pretty hard to go through so many posts and give a conculsive answer. If we cannot understand and process the data, then what is the point of the thread?

Last edited by McLaren Rulez : 3rd November 2009 at 16:15.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:14   #20
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Audi : Why not a Merc/BMW?

BMW : I wish I could afford it. No chauffeur though, strictly.

Chevrolet : Will they be around next year?

Fiat : Great cars, thank God Tata's service backup is there.

Ford : Not VFM in the maintenance department.

HM : Love the Amby, get me a good chauffeur.

Honda : Featherweight Toyota pretender with more brand value than VFM.

Hyundai : Great cars, bad manufacturer with attitude.

Mahindra: The men's car gets velvet gloves over the tough stuff.

Maini : Would buy one if it had a 250 km range.

Maruti : Great VFM, but newer models not as cheap to maintain as reputed.

Mercedes : Mmm... I wish...

Mitsubishi : Fun car, never hand over to a chauffeur.

Nissan : Good stuff without dealer backup.

Skoda : Spare me.

Tata : I don't want to be the company's R&D by default.

Toyota : Never seen one break down. Bulletproof.

VW : Decent car without dealer/service network.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:27   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Yup, these are the three factors that an overwhelming majority of cars sell on (believe it or not). :
@GTO, I really suspect if 'Look' is one of the topmost deciding factors. I think it is 'utility' along with perception and price. Look at the success of Santro (pre Xing) and the Wagon-R to some extent (.. and now Xylo). When I had gone to enquire about Santro and told the sales person that I liked the styling, he told me that I was the first person to have liked the car.
Anyway, here is my list
Audi : Engineering Refinement, minimalistic, graceful and purposeful designs. Makes the presence felt without being loud.

BMW : Sporty, Quirky (in recent times) and unorthodox designs. tries to be a rebel and stands out from the crowd.

Chevrolet : Trapped in identity crisis (korean roots with chevy grill and badge)

Fiat : Solid cars but yet to prove long term reliaility. Confused with design direction

Ford : Rugged and fun to drive but the refinement level not too great.

HM : Market some great cars, but sometime mis-timed and wrongly positioned

Honda : Most optimally (read: no exess) designed cars which also means somewhat vulnerable in harsh conditions. Extremely well engineered. Human-centric approach to design

Hyundai : Great al rounders but not exceptional in anything. Designs are bit overdone

Mahindra:Rugged but un-refined vehicles, not much thought given to ergonomics

Maini : Half hearted efforts, poor design

Maruti :Average products which work without major glitches, focus around cost control, doesn't try to be gear car

Mercedes : Prestigious, but somewhat aging and not so sporty, designed to be Chauffer driven

Mitsubishi : Well built, good drivers cars,

Nissan : well thought out products but do not awalys strike the right chord with buyers

Skoda : Well balanced products with great build.

Tata : Good cars from far but poor detailing and average quality/reliability

Toyota : Flawless engineering, non-flashy designs with focus on funtionality

VW: Makes of excellent cars like Golf and Passat, but neither a luxury brand nor are they affodable

Last edited by Guna : 3rd November 2009 at 16:29.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:38   #22
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Audi : Quatroooooo! 4 wheel bliss, sexy looks

BMW : Driver oriented machine or beast depending on the model

Chevrolet : The underdog, smooth, silent, reliable and can put up a fight with the best

Fiat : Strong build, european mature feel and passionate

Ford : Fun drivers car

HM : Nostalgic

Honda : Very good engines

Hyundai : Yaawn, wannabe's

Mahindra: Got mud reliable SUV and VFM package. Daring to experiment

Maini : Reckless test drivers and the future fun car!

Maruti : You name it they have it, be it A.S.S or models

Mercedes : oh lala at new C and E, you have arrived

Mitsubishi : Evoooooooo and Pajerooooooooo, fun vehicles

Nissan : Godzilla! but typical jap build

Skoda : who? great cars, company gone bonkers

Tata : Consistency Mr Watson, Nano jai ho!

Toyota : Run run run, mile munchers

VW : Car for me, but what about Schodaaaaaa?
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:44   #23
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Audi : Always in 3rd place after BMW & MB, questionable electronic relaibity, aggressive engine offerings. LEDssssssss

BMW : Perfect blend of youth & luxury/class. Tension free ownership thanks to BSI. Always raising the bar in its segments. Great engines. Controversial.

Ford : Built strong, decent on reliability.

HM : Outdated

Honda : Light weight ! Overrated , overpriced.

Hyundai : VFM. Raising the bar

Maini : Who ?

Maruti : Trusted brand like none other.

Mercedes : Luxury ! Electronic problems yet give me nightmares. Not completely VFM in it's segment

Mitsubishi : Loosing battle

Nissan : Need to rethink if they are in India or not, wake up! Great products

Skoda : Debatable reliability. Brilliant VFM. Good FE. Raising the bar.

Tata : Rattles, sqeaks & worest fit & finish

Toyota : Synonyms to reliability. VFM. Best service. Hassle free/cheap ownership

VW : Strong cars, good engines. Teething stages, will come out victorious in the long run. Trusted. Safe. Made good efforts to boost sales, innovative. Boring designs.

Last edited by Sahil : 3rd November 2009 at 16:45.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:49   #24
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Here are my "Top of the Mind" attributes for each car brand:

Audi : Oozes tech, maverick

BMW : I was born to drive

Chevrolet : Gutless, average, discounts galore

Fiat : Great engines, build, ride and handling. But still not complete!

Ford : Last vestiges of the American dream?

Honda : 'Arrived in life' halo at a price

Hyundai : Happiness comes in small packets

Mahindra: King of the (rural) jungle

Maruti : First car has to be a Maruti!

Mercedes : Luxury with dabs of snob value

Mitsubishi : Old school

Nissan : Nice but niche

Skoda : Fickle as a mistress. Just fun to flirt. Marry her and be doomed!

Tata : Innovation, indian-ishtyle

Toyota : Till death do us part - Thy name is reliability

VW : German, solid
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:54   #25
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Audi : Expensive for what it offers in lower product line, good engines and chassis, electricals a problem, A.S & S. not upto the mark.

BMW : Great to drive, not good if you are driven in one, weird looks.

Chevrolet : Koren car seller, recently improved, newer products quite good, trying to improve.

Fiat : Not confident about its products, poor combination of chassis and powertrains, poor A.S & S., unnecessarily trying to be unique in every department, inconsistent quality.

Ford : Not so good A.S & S., poor man's BMW as far as driving pleasure goes, good diesels and petrol cars, well engineered.

Honda : Expensive to own and maintain, manufacturer overconfident, not so good to drive except G1HC i.e. OHC ) as compared to competition, great engines, not so good A.S & S., almost all cars have low GC issues.

Hyundai : Copycat carmaker, newer products expensive, higher on maintenance as compared to its main competitor, good A.S & S., the one manufacturer that is damn lucky.

Mahindra: Trying very hard to improve and coming up with better options, good SUV line up, Bolero very good for rough use, basically maker of reasonably reliable and rugged cars.

Maini : No government support, else good electric car.

Maruti : Very reliable cars, cheap to buy and maintain, highest resale for small cars, best A.S & S. despite the high volumes, cars can take abuse but still be reliable.

Mercedes : Expensive to buy and maintain, not very reliable, excellent comfort, ride quality and sound insulation.

Mitsubishi : Has capable products internationally, but not so interested in Indian car market.

Nissan : Not very serious about India, talks more and forgets to deliver the goods.

Skoda : Good cars, industry worst A.S & S. Never buy Skoda cars just because of unimaginable A.S & S.

Tata : Apparently VFM cars, but quality not good, poor A.S & S., not very reliable. Safari needs to have a special mention as this car has very very good presence, almost as good presence as Prado.

Toyota : Reliable, not very interested in under Rs. 8 lakh segment, good A.S & S., excellent overall packages.

VW : Tries to prove that India is third world, old generation engines, expensive to buy and maintain, not very reliable diesel engines drink engine oil.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 16:56   #26
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Audi : Looks, handling, bit of an all rounder

BMW : Driving dynamics

Chevrolet : Jack of all, master of none

Fiat : Driver oriented, passion, good build, cheapest way to get an european car, poor after sales

Ford : Driver oriented, maintenance issues

HM : Always wakes up late or rather doesn't wake up at all

Honda : Reliability, great engines and brand name

Hyundai : VFM, Copy cat?

Mahindra: Muscular, tough and rugged

Maini : City commute, saves earth

Maruti : VFM, cheap, every man's first car (not anymore nowadays)

Mercedes : Engineering precision, perfection

Mitsubishi : Rally stuff, Cedia sports looks really good, suspect after sales

Nissan : Like someone said, whats the USP, same can be said for Volvo also

Skoda : Solid build quality, suspect reliability, cheating dealers

Tata : Niggles, issues, Taxi image

Toyota : Reliability, brand name

VW : European build, suspect after sales, Indian market seriousness?
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Old 3rd November 2009, 17:02   #27
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this is a good point of view - a general trend analysis would be of great help and frankly the only way this can be made possible is pre-loaded attributes against each brand and then a count of responses. Excel looks like the only way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez View Post
GTO, its going to get increasingly hard to see a general trend with posts like those above. May I suggest you pick a few of the most common make or break perceptions for any brand like A.S.S, quality, reliability, VFM, cool factor, etc. etc. These will be brand parameters. Then we have the brands themselves. They can be arranged into a table as shown below and each poster can rate each brand with respect to each parameter. The average value under each cell can then be displayed. Naturally, it is not necessary for each poster to fill in every cell since we are only taking the average in each cell. Here's what it looks like:

.............. Parameter A Parameter B Parameter C Parameter D
Brand A
Brand B
Brand C

I'm not sure if this can be done with the forum software (I can only think of Microsoft Excel for this sort of thing), so maybe the geeks out there can help?
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Old 3rd November 2009, 17:04   #28
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Wow! fantastic thread, GTO.

Perception is reality.

This thread will be very valuable for the Auto Industry, although I do not know how practically useful it will be at an individual respondants (us posters) level unless it affects their work in any way.

It is exactly a perceptual survey of a market, something companies would normally spend lots to do. In time and with enough posts, if any manufacturer follows this thread, and takes the time to collate results, it will be a goldmine for them.

I agree with McLaren_Rulez' posts on the format though. The forum format is not ideal for this data analysis, but we have very limited choice IMHO.

@McLaren_Rulez - good format suggestions

There's an online version of spreadsheets - Google Docs Spreadsheet - but integrating that or any other online spreadsheet with the forum might not be possible.

Last edited by gomzi : 3rd November 2009 at 17:09. Reason: spelling mistake :o
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Old 3rd November 2009, 17:06   #29
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Audi : love the Quattro

BMW : would love to own one.. Some day Man… some day!

Chevrolet: I have a sofa set at home

Fiat : good cars, JV with TATA was a great step, keep up the good work!

Ford : excellent built, good to drive, VFM….though doubtful reliability.

HM : The Lost Company…rather than gaining something from Mitsubishi, they instead made Mitsubishi lose with their pathetic management.

Honda : Reliable, good after sales, Damn expensive. Half a car per car, me owing a Mitsubishi now understand the power of BRAND.

Hyundai : Copy cats.... but they value people who buy their cars. Cars are reliable and a few of them are also VFM. Good for a normal person who like to travel from point A to point B without trouble.

Mahindra: Tough and VFM.

Maruti : VFM, reliable, excellent after sales. Moreover, best cars for an average Indian.

Mercedes : Good for Executives...

Mitsubishi: Adds the word performance to the Japanese side BUT IN India its awesome engineering, aweful management. Deserves much better but need to work on it

Nissan : good cars, why not have some more dealers, a ckd would work wonders.

Skoda : next pls.

Tata : look at the first Indica that rolled out and then look at the manza, A milestone achieved in a very short span.

Toyota : Largest car manufacturer in the world, Do I need to say more?

VW : I still await the Polo.

Last edited by gaurav_chopra04 : 3rd November 2009 at 17:18.
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Old 3rd November 2009, 17:09   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez View Post
If a tabular format is not supported, maybe someone can think of some way to get the data into a format that's easy to understand. I can't think of any other way at the moment but trust me, as this thread grows bigger, it'll be increasingly difficult to get a good idea of the general trend.

When its twenty pages long, if someone asks you what the average TBhpian thinks of, say, Fiat, it'll be pretty hard to go through so many posts and give a conculsive answer. If we cannot understand and process the data, then what is the point of the thread?
Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
this is a good point of view - a general trend analysis would be of great help and frankly the only way this can be made possible is pre-loaded attributes against each brand and then a count of responses. Excel looks like the only way.
+1 to Shankar & McLaren,

Excel seems to be a good option till anyone from the fellow members comes up with a unique idea, otherwise as this thread grows bigger, it would be very difficult to come to a conclusion only by going through all the posts.

@GTO, very good initiative, it would be very helpful
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