Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 4th December 2009, 11:51   #1
BHPian
 
aroop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 125
Thanked: 19 Times
Smile Maruti's new small car

Just read this report on Economic times.

NEW DELHI: In order to hold on to its 50% share of the car market, Maruti Suzuki is developing a brand new small car. The new car, based on an
existing small car platform, is being developed by Indian engineers and will be showcased at the Auto Expo next month as a concept car. Speaking to ET , Maruti MD Shinzo Nakanishi said: "We are working on a new small car concept which we will showcase next month and depending on the reaction of the consumers we will put it to commercial production."

Although Maruti officials refused to give any further details of the project, people in the vendor circuit say the company is already working on two small car projects using existing platforms. The first is likely to be the next-generation WagonR and is reportedly codenamed YR9. It is being developed for likely launch next year. Both will use Suzukiís new, mileage happy KB series of engines.

The other is codenamed YE3 and it expected to plug the gap that will be left in Marutiís stable when the M800 gets phased out for not meeting Bharat 4 emission norms. "Our engineers have the capability to upgrade the M800 engine for Bharat 4 but the corporate decision is that its too expensive and time-consuming to make business sense," Mr Nakanishi said. "So the M800 will not be available in those 11 cities where Bharat 4 will come in effect next year," he added.

When it rolls out, the new small car will be the eighth small car in Maruti's stable after M800, Alto, WagonR, Estilo, A-Star, Ritz and Swift. With so many models in its hatchback bouquet, the company is also looking to consolidate its platforms Ė a common architecture for multiple car models that covers design, engineering, production and major components.

Currently Marutiís platforms include the best-selling WagonR/Estilo/Alto platform, the Swift/Dzire platform, the A-Star, the Ritz and the SX4 apart from the older M800, Omni and Gypsy. ďRight now we have eight platforms and we would want to bring that down to three in the future with the Alto/WagonR/Estilo line contuining as our mainstay as it is now,Ē Mr Nakanishi said.

According to auto analysts, the platform consolidation would include phasing out some products that donít meet emission norms like the M800, replacing others with new generation versions like the new MPV lined up to replace the phased out Versa and upgrading other models using common design and components.

Maruti sold 429,291 small cars (including the M800) in the April-November period this year compared to 356,320 units sold in the same period last fiscal, up 20.5%. Small cars comprise over 65% of Marutiís total sales including exports.


The link is here -> Maruti's new small car to debut at Auto Expo next month- Automobiles-Auto-News By Industry-News-The Economic Times


So this means we will have more choices. Maruti has been launching new cars/models in quick succession. It was the A-star, Ritz, new Estilo, new SX4 and now some more. Looks like their engineers and marketing people never take a break!
aroop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 12:00   #2
BHPian
 
harishnair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Quilon/ Sharjah
Posts: 512
Thanked: 5 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aroop View Post

Although Maruti officials refused to give any further details of the project, people in the vendor circuit say the company is already working on two small car projects using existing platforms. The first is likely to be the next-generation WagonR and is reportedly codenamed YR9. It is being developed for likely launch next year. Both will use Suzuki’s new, mileage happy KB series of engines.
Wow,this comes as a surprice.That means Maruti will be showcasing 3 new cars at the Auto expo.
1) M800 replacement.
2) WagonR replacement. (just hope its the Suzuki Cervo)
3) Versa replacement.

@Sidindica- Got any scoops on this?

Last edited by harishnair : 4th December 2009 at 12:09.
harishnair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 12:04   #3
gpa
Senior - BHPian
 
gpa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,772
Thanked: 273 Times
Default

The humble M800, will finally be phased out from 11 cities. It's high time MUL brought in a new small car to replace it. Will be interesting to see how these 3 new models fare in the market. All eyes on the Auto Expo!
gpa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 12:17   #4
Senior - BHPian
 
longhorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Chennai
Posts: 1,154
Thanked: 290 Times
Default

If the Maruti 800 is on its way out, so is the Omni. No two ways about it. In which case the Alto will end up with the K series unit since they are going to phase out the F8D motor. Then its makes no sense for the WagonR to continue with the F10D motor. So the WagonR should also be getting the K series unit from the AStar/Estilo. All this will be happening between now and April 2010! The cars they are going to showcase is a concept. Hence I guess it will be at least another year before it rolls out from the factory, that is, if they decide to put it into production. Anyways we get to see how good Maruti engineers are in designing a car at the Auto Expo!
longhorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 12:36   #5
Senior - BHPian
 
McLaren Rulez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Mysore
Posts: 2,375
Thanked: 474 Times
Default

Another small car from Maruti? Honestly, we've got more than enough choice there. The Alto is the 800's replacement and Maruti needn't worry about replacing the 800.
McLaren Rulez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 12:56   #6
Senior - BHPian
 
longhorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Chennai
Posts: 1,154
Thanked: 290 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez View Post
Another small car from Maruti? Honestly, we've got more than enough choice there. The Alto is the 800's replacement and Maruti needn't worry about replacing the 800.
I think what they are trying to do is to launch a vehicle as close as possible to the Maruti 800's price point. This is why they are designing it in India and not in Japan. Moreover the platform is the same as that of the current Alto/WagonR which helps in keeping costs down. The new car will be priced below the Alto. Who knows Maruti might launch it with a 660cc 50 bhp engine!

Last edited by longhorn : 4th December 2009 at 12:58.
longhorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 13:20   #7
Distinguished - BHPian
 
jkdas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Thiruvananthapu
Posts: 9,661
Thanked: 1,389 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by longhorn View Post
I think what they are trying to do is to launch a vehicle as close as possible to the Maruti 800's price point. This is why they are designing it in India and not in Japan. Moreover the platform is the same as that of the current Alto/WagonR which helps in keeping costs down. The new car will be priced below the Alto. Who knows Maruti might launch it with a 660cc 50 bhp engine!
They competition is the Nano for the 800 now. Nano is more spacious than 800/Alto and more FE ! .

Also read it AC is more efficient in the Nano.

660cc 50bhp? Who will buy the Alto at 2.75 lac then ?
jkdas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 13:54   #8
BHPian
 
harishnair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Quilon/ Sharjah
Posts: 512
Thanked: 5 Times
Default

The 800cc engine itself runs out of breath when A/C is on, wonder how the 660cc will fare. IMO the 660cc engine will only be useful in the Japanese cities which have well laid flat roads.
harishnair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 14:27   #9
Senior - BHPian
 
longhorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Chennai
Posts: 1,154
Thanked: 290 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkdas View Post
660cc 50bhp? Who will buy the Alto at 2.75 lac then ?
The Alto is most likely going to be upgraded with the 1 litre K series engine from the AStar. You can expect a price hike here.


Quote:
Originally Posted by harishnair View Post
The 800cc engine itself runs out of breath when A/C is on, wonder how the 660cc will fare. IMO the 660cc engine will only be useful in the Japanese cities which have well laid flat roads.
If they can produce and sell the 621cc 33bhp Nano here, there should not be any issues with a 660cc Maruti producing around 50 bhp.

The 50 bhp figure would probably come down to around 47bhp due to Indian fuel conditions. I'm pretty sure they can't sell the Alto at the Maruti 800's price point penny for penny. Hence the only option that seems feasible for Maruti in the present scenario, keeping in mind the fact that the F8D motor is going to be discontinued, is to get the 660cc engine from Suzuki to our shores. Unless they want to chop off one more cylinder from the 1 litre 3 cylinder AStar engine and plonk it in the new car.
longhorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 15:10   #10
BHPian
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 81
Thanked: 13 Times
Default

Whoa! another small car from Maruti... and now with some engines needing a phaseout, I wonder how much difference we would be able to distinguish between each of their models.

So far I thought the following would happen:


1) M800 would slowly phased out and Alto would be slotted in its place by reducing the price difference between them from 50K to say 20K or so.
- Then which engine should it use??? the KB10?
- The KB10 would them be used by the A-Star, Estilo and the Alto.
- In the same platform would be - Alto, Estilo & WagonR
- Again, if they have to get the KB10 engine into the Alto the cost goes up due to higher royalty to Suzuki.

2) A Star could possibly come down a bit on price (very unlikely) to take the Alto's position

3) A Done up WagonR
- But with what engine is the big question. The WagonR might loose its positioning. If they want to keep the same engines tuned to Euro4 Norms, it would be the only model with that engine.
- KB10 would not be enough. KB12 would eat into the Ritz & Swift.

4) The Swift & DZire get the KB12 engines.
- Would love to see the DZire get something like a 1.4L engine though!
- The following cars would share the same platform: Swift, DZire, Ritz, New Versa

5) New Versa
- A new Versa possibly on the Swift platform and to get KB12 engine
- Would be amazing to see the 1.3 DDIS engine into this Van

6) Not sure about the Omni. It, along with the M800 would continue to be made.

May be the new small car would be on the same platform as the 800 & Omni. Another option is the A-Star platform (but that can escalate the cost). And then, what engine? Are they getting a new small engine to be used in the 800's replacement, Alto and possibly the Omni???


Let us now see the platform. Maruti wants to get into 3 platforms.

1) M800, M800's replacement, Omni
2) Alto, WagonR, Estilo
3) Swift, DZire, Ritz & SX4 (that they said is an extended Swift's chassis)
4) A-Star??? (I'm a little unclear about this!)

And the Engines
1) KB10: A-Star, Estilo, WagorR (possibly)
2) KB12: Swift, Ritz, New Versa, DZire
3) 1.3 DDIS: Swift, Ritz, DZire
4) replacement for 800: new car, Alto, Omni (possibly)
5) F8D: M800, Omni for non-Euro IV locations.
(ignoring the SX4. No confusion there)

Well, that was all guess work. And there can be mistakes in the information I have put across about current facts. If found, please correct me.

BTW, Maruti engineers did a great job with A-Star concept but drowned the whole thing when it came to production. Yes, the car still looks cure... but not anywhere near to the concept. Hope they don't do that again.

Also, I hope Maruti won't delay the new car like what they did to WagonR. WagonR was showcased in the 1998 AutoExpo where a lot of interest was expressed but they got it into the market pretty late letting the Santro and Indica have a gala time.

Last edited by Aditya : 4th December 2009 at 16:26.
MotoKris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 17:35   #11
Senior - BHPian
 
aaggoswami's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Vadodara
Posts: 4,675
Thanked: 1,426 Times
Default

I had mentioned about both YR9 and YE3 here :
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/1407816-post11.html

1) Maruti is now getting into confused mode. Already sales of Ritz are suffering due to overlap, what will happen when new small cars arrive. Assuming that one of them is updated Wagon R, they will have one more small car in a segment that is already overcrowded by Suzuki itself.

2) Maruti had earlier mentioned that they are planning to use the K series motor widely. Now from what I have read, the 1.2ltr+ K series motors will debut in new Swift, till then the max capacity is 1242cc ( 1242cc = K12B, here we have 1198cc K12M ).

So what will they give Dzire ? Its high time they come up with M13 and M15. Recently updated M16A for E-5 norms in EU give out around 120 bhp. But atleast we can have VVT equipped M13 and M15 to cover Dzire. This will give a big advantage to Dzire.
aaggoswami is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 20:56   #12
BHPian
 
NutsNBolts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Kochi
Posts: 796
Thanked: 20 Times
Default

Another small car? Is the market not already crowded? Rather than providing refinements on existing products e.g. air bags, ABS they are gonna get a new small car? Winner's syndrome? Surely in a confused mode.
NutsNBolts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 21:05   #13
BHPian
 
Deep Blue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Udupi
Posts: 594
Thanked: 231 Times
Default

Designed in India? I hope the Maruti engineers are able go beyond grill and taillight jobs to produce something more dzireable!
Deep Blue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 21:36   #14
Senior - BHPian
 
Gansan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Chennai
Posts: 3,427
Thanked: 875 Times
Default

Suzuki's forte is inexpensive small cars. I don't think they will ever succeed big time in large cars. The moment one contemplates the bigger segment, he is spoilt for choice with better brands in the fray. And I suppose that beyond a price point, it will be infra-dig to be seen in a Maruti Suzuki due to the brand perception.
Gansan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th December 2009, 21:53   #15
BHPian
 
hpzone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: COK/LON
Posts: 137
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

Maruthi has been milking Indian customers with outdated products for long time. Now all the iternational carmakers are eyeing India and the entire market will change in next 5 years.

They don't bring any innovation or safety feature unless a competitor force them. Its high time for Maruthi to change their strategy or else they will be like Ambys and Premier of yester years!
hpzone is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
SCOOP Renault's new small car *Modus* caught testing. EDIT : New pics on Page 6 JRAJE The Indian Car Scene 126 4th March 2015 15:22
Maruti's new small car between the A-Star and the Estilo? romeomidhun The Indian Car Scene 3 28th December 2012 14:07
Maruti to introduce new small car jacksons The Indian Car Scene 35 10th June 2010 10:48
A real dilemma New Big Sedan + Old SUV or New SUV + new small sedan adithyav What Car? 32 5th August 2009 07:32


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 17:33.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks