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Old 2nd March 2010, 14:16   #31
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Just going by the pics, it looks like more of a softroader with improved GC then a offroader like current Pajero. Add me to the list of guys who like the current Pajero over this

Any idea about pricing??
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Old 2nd March 2010, 15:18   #32
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The Pajero is absurdly price OTR at 25L in mum and the Fortuner a bit less absurdly but still not at all farily priced at 22L OTR mum.

The fortuner sells due to the absence of competion, we can't blame Toyota from pricing it very high due the absence of competetion, but the competetion needs to realize that Toyota managed to do the impossible due to the brand image of reliablity coupled with resale value.

Pajero Sport will be found wanting if it tries to do the same, it needs a Rs. 2L discount on the fortuner with some added features to take the competetion to Toyota else it will be another product that does not sell.
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Old 2nd March 2010, 21:05   #33
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I got some questions...some very pertinent questions:

How's the Montero as a product? You will agree its a fantastic SUV.

How's the Cedia as a sedan? Again, you will agree that its a rather competent car.

How about the Outlander then? Superbly built, moves like a sedan and is loaded to the gills. Petrol SUVs can sell, as the Honda CRV had proven.

Question : Are either of these three very competent automobiles selling in the market? NOPE! Time for some retrospection then, HM? Fact is : You've never had a product problem since the time of the Lancer's launch. Your problem is your management, your marketing, your dealerships (or lack of), your vision and your philosophy.

HM would do well in addressing the real issues first, before launching yet another car with promise, yet bombs anyways. Big time! If you leg hurts, you don't apply balm on the arm, do you?
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Old 2nd March 2010, 21:53   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
I got some questions...some very pertinent questions:

How's the Montero as a product? You will agree its a fantastic SUV.

Engine spec for india enemic at best, although priced in no mans land it lacks grunt and some relevant pricing (read low). A better output engine may fix it = volumes and no amount of marketing can fix a 40 plus lac SUV that goes to 100km in 15+ sec

How's the Cedia as a sedan? Again, you will agree that its a rather competent car.

Outdated and over priced

How about the Outlander then? Superbly built, moves like a sedan and is loaded to the gills. Petrol SUVs can sell, as the Honda CRV had proven.

Mitsubishi has a heritage in Diesel brand and hangover/recall is diesel in India and 99% of the other markets I have seen it sold in, so like fortuner should have been launched in Diesel, unlike Honda = a brand that simply says we don't make diesel engines and don't understand them a fact brainwashed into all since 1980's so different set of buyers altogether buys them (yes there may be some overlap but core volume buyers are different), also "we are the best japanese petrol engine makers" so lets not dilute that. Core Honda buyers in India are folks who don't do as high mileages as diesel car owners and mostly metro folks using it from a to b (short distance)

Question : Are either of these three very competent automobiles selling in the market? NOPE! Time for some retrospection then, HM? Fact is : You've never had a product problem since the time of the Lancer's launch. Your problem is your management, your marketing, your dealerships (or lack of), your vision and your philosophy.

HM would do well in addressing the real issues first, before launching yet another car with promise, yet bombs anyways. Big time! If you leg hurts, you don't apply balm on the arm, do you?
They need to slot themselves below honda on price and spec cars like toyota at least that is my experience when I shopped for cars in US & Asia

Last edited by canonball : 2nd March 2010 at 21:59.
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Old 2nd March 2010, 22:21   #35
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The new Pajero looks to me like it has been made from all leftover parts all all suv's under toyota,the side resembles a Montero,the height resembles the fortuner,the front resembles the prado.The old Pajero to me still looks the best!
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Old 2nd March 2010, 22:35   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
I got some questions...some very pertinent questions:

How's the Montero as a product? You will agree its a fantastic SUV.

How's the Cedia as a sedan? Again, you will agree that its a rather competent car.

How about the Outlander then? Superbly built, moves like a sedan and is loaded to the gills. Petrol SUVs can sell, as the Honda CRV had proven.

Question : Are either of these three very competent automobiles selling in the market? NOPE! Time for some retrospection then, HM? Fact is : You've never had a product problem since the time of the Lancer's launch. Your problem is your management, your marketing, your dealerships (or lack of), your vision and your philosophy.

HM would do well in addressing the real issues first, before launching yet another car with promise, yet bombs anyways. Big time! If you leg hurts, you don't apply balm on the arm, do you?
Well said GTO. The sooner 3-diamonds ( Mitsubishi ) parts company with HM, the better. Mitsu and HM make strange bedfellows. It's like Brad Pitt sleeping with Rakhi Sawant. Beats me why Mitsu can't go it alone in India. When virtually unknown Skoda can start from a scratch and make it big, when Renault, the maker of bland Logan, can part company with M&M and start on its own, what is stopping Mitsu from doing it. Mitsu certainly has more brand value than these two brands.
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Old 2nd March 2010, 23:14   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Time for some retrospection then, HM? Fact is : You've never had a product problem since the time of the Lancer's launch. Your problem is your management, your marketing, your dealerships (or lack of), your vision and your philosophy.


Their web site was down for more than 2 weeks recently for upgradation. HM seem to be living in a different age altogether. This when the world around them has moved on.

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I asked them about the website being down for too long and wanted to check on some product etc, first reaction from the sales person was, "so what"?; amazing!!.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 05:51   #38
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ACM & GTO hit the nail on the head with their posts above. HM has a generation of managers who grew up selling Ambassadors (from Mark I to Mark V) in a socialist economy where the only competition was fiat. They world has since changed but HM Management or (what every they call it there) is stuck in a time wrap. They are still scratching their heads almost six months after Toyota checkmated them with the Fortuner. Alteast Ford and Chevy had made some bold moves.

Some how these these bozos think just the Mitsu tag is enough to sell the vehicle and nothing else needs to be done. They are taking a free ride on the hard work Mitsubishi did years back to develop great products. They will destroy the Mitsu name in India. Enough damage has been done, Mitsu should send them packing to make HM Ambassadors and Trekkers and strike out on their own..
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Old 3rd March 2010, 06:14   #39
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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
The Pajero sport is completely different vehicle though it shares the Pajero name. Its based in Triton pick-up truck just like its direct competition Endy and Fortuner which are based on Ranger and HI-Lux respectively. All these truck derived SUV's look and feel like much more expensive SUV's like Landcruiser and Montero but they have lacklusture dynamics. Please do not expect the current Pajero's Ride and Handling finesse here.
(Only) You got it right! This is based on Triton pick up. Nativa is nowhere close to the stance and the look of Pajero original alteast previous gen. The current one lacks that tough feel and look IMHO.

Esp the rear of Nativa is higher, it does not give aesthetical comfort. Front/grill I dont want to even discuss. Simply un-digestable! Copy & pasted from Triton, which looks ok for a pick up but not for a SUV!
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Old 3rd March 2010, 06:41   #40
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The vehicle looks dated before being launched but when you see the pajero this sure is modern just hooping for a sensible price tag.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 14:04   #41
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Quote:
Engine spec for india enemic at best, although priced in no mans land it lacks grunt
I can tell you that the Montero does NOT lack grunt. It's an immensely torquey unit. And before the facelift came out with an additional 150 kilos of equipment, the pre-facelift managed a 0 - 100 in 13.xx seconds. That's far from lacking grunt for a 2,000 kilo SUV. The Montero also has excellent urban driveability.

Quote:
A better output engine may fix it = volumes and no amount of marketing can fix a 40 plus lac SUV that goes to 100km in 15+ sec
Fat chance, the sales problem doesn't lie in the engine at all. And for the record, it didn't sell well even when it was priced at 33 lakhs and was quicker by 2.xx seconds to the 100. Fact is, the brand now has zero value in India, dealerships are rare, company support paltry and marketing zero.

Quote:
Mitsubishi has a heritage in Diesel brand
What heritage? The original Lancer was also sold in petrol, and did pretty alright for itself.

Quote:
Core Honda buyers in India are folks who don't do as high mileages as diesel car owners and mostly metro folks using it from a to b (short distance)
The Outlander's positioning was exactly this = The urban yuppie.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 14:10   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbraj View Post
Their web site was down for more than 2 weeks recently for upgradation.
So the website is up it seems. And I really can't make out what has changed !
Even the Mitsubishi Outlander and Cedia Sports sites do not indicate the new variants.

Why take it down for such a long time then? Infrastructure mods?
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Old 3rd March 2010, 15:01   #43
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@Gaurav - Thanks for putting up the OD review

Going by the details mentioned in the article and considering the goodies that this brute carries i think it's certainly one step ahead of Fortuner and better value for money. Especially the brakes did behave normally when SC tested it. All would now depend on the HM marketing guys. I hope they do not bring the less powerful engine as mentioned (these guys can do anything).

If they are able to price it at 20 lakhs I'm sure it will carve out a market quickly and would also be helped by the long waiting time/closed bookings on Fortuner since many people wouldn't want to wait for so long and could go in for this one looking at VFM.

On the looks front I wouldn't call it fabulous but not bad either so overall acceptable.

Off road capabilities seem to be at par with the Fortuner if not better so overall when jusged as a package the Pajero Sport should be able to find quite a number of homes across the nation provided HM doesn't use their brains too much.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 15:03   #44
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Guys this model is available here in Philippines and is topping the sales charts for more than a year now. Fortuner or any other SUV in this category are nowhere near it. I have driven it and loved it. It surely is Fortuner killer if it gets launched in India given that Toyota has kind of fooled India market by passing Innova dashboard, gear stick and manual gearbox in a 2 million rupees car.

Mitsubishi is huge in Philippines. On the overall sales , they are second to Toyota and way above Honda, Mazda, Hyundai, GM, Nissan, Ford, Subaru, Volvo, VW etc etc Toyota Corolla rules the taxi segment and hence they are number 1 here.

Mitsubishi's range in Philippines is:
Cars: Lancer (Cedia in India), Lancer EX, Lancer EVO X, Galant SE, Grandis and Eclipse.
SUVs: Pajero (Montero in India), Outlander and Montero Sports (one posted here). There are couple of MPVs like Adventure, Fuzion that cater to lower segment.
Pick up trucks: Strada; every second pick up truck sold here is Strada.

I drive new Galant SE here and I preferred it over Camry, Accord, Teana, Mazda 6, Subaru Legacy and Hyundai Azera. It is loaded with gizmos, gadgets and features that none of the cars in the segment provide.

I just hope Mitsubishi makes this kind of effort with India market as they truly have a great products in its line. They are very sluggish in India and have let the competetion go ahead of them.
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Old 3rd March 2010, 17:56   #45
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Assuming the Price of this new Pajero is around 25 Lakhs. And we know that the price of Fortuner is 22 Lakhs.

1. Keeping the brand image aside for a while is the new Pajero worth the 3 (or 5) Lakhs extra?

2. What all do you get for that extra?

3. BTW, is it right to compare Pajero with Fortuner or the other way around?
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