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Old 14th April 2010, 11:05   #451
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
No, its not the fire. Its about the whole Tata quality issues. There are hundreds of members on this forum who own tata cars. I am one of them. Many of these members own the most expensive vehicle Tata makes(the safari), and I am one of them.Its not a 1 lakh vehicle, it costs 10 times as much.
Agreed, Tata quality is not up to your expectation. But what made you buy the Safari then? You had many choices, why did you choose Safari? Why not a Pajero, Why not a Prado? Why not an X5? Dont tell me you were not aware of the issues when you baught it? With the quality issues, still Safari is a VFM at 10 Lakh, as simple as that...
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Old 14th April 2010, 11:38   #452
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All you guys supporting Tata, I ask you guys one question:
Why was the Tata Nano built?
Because the family of 2-4 people will be safer inside a Nano than on a scooter. If nanos start catching fire, then their scooter was much safer right? Agreed that its a big engineering feat by Tata and all that, but cars just out of showroom catching fire is just unacceptable.

Agreed that its not a design flaw. But whats the guarantee that the other Nanos won't catch fire one day? Life is something which we cannot take a chance with.

All of you defending Tata, please try to place yourselves in the shoes of the man whose car caught fire before reaching home. You will probably understand.
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Old 14th April 2010, 11:59   #453
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Originally Posted by blue_pulsar View Post
All you guys supporting Tata, I ask you guys one question:
Why was the Tata Nano built?
Because the family of 2-4 people will be safer inside a Nano than on a scooter. If nanos start catching fire, then their scooter was much safer right? Agreed that its a big engineering feat by Tata and all that, but cars just out of showroom catching fire is just unacceptable.

Agreed that its not a design flaw. But whats the guarantee that the other Nanos won't catch fire one day? Life is something which we cannot take a chance with.

All of you defending Tata, please try to place yourselves in the shoes of the man whose car caught fire before reaching home. You will probably understand.
Freak accidents caqn happen to any car. This thread is the testimony as many incidents of other cars has been noted. Short circuits or something malfunction can happen on any car. Its just that the Nano took the limelight.

For this reason, do we stop driving other cars too?
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Old 14th April 2010, 12:54   #454
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Originally Posted by blue_pulsar View Post
All you guys supporting Tata, I ask you guys one question:
Why was the Tata Nano built?
Because the family of 2-4 people will be safer inside a Nano than on a scooter. If nanos start catching fire, then their scooter was much safer right? Agreed that its a big engineering feat by Tata and all that, but cars just out of showroom catching fire is just unacceptable.

Agreed that its not a design flaw. But whats the guarantee that the other Nanos won't catch fire one day? Life is something which we cannot take a chance with.

All of you defending Tata, please try to place yourselves in the shoes of the man whose car caught fire before reaching home. You will probably understand.
I have at no point stated that the fires are acceptable. But it is evenly unacceptable to pronounce Tata guilty when it isn't clear what caused the fires.

Regarding the guarantee that other Nanos might not catch fire you will never get. The human error element will never be out of the equation.

This goes for the Nano as much as for Tata in general and all other manufacturers all over the world.

I am trying to put things into the right perspective. Last year the world has seen more recalls than ever before. Toyota had to cal back over 250 times as many cars than Nanos are built to date, because people died. And Toyota only called them back )after four months sweeping things under the carpet and lying in public) because of governmental pressure! The highly praised Toyotas have till date flaws of other kinds than what thje recalls are about.

Mercedes had brake issues that led to deaths recently and had to call back over 20 times as many cars than Nanos built to date. On top of it they have flaws and problems that they are very often in the news. And on top of it they treat the customers over here like dirt. And the list goes on.

The reality in life is that evry company in the world is out there to make as much profit as they can. In thei financial managers eyes lives are dispensable when it is more profitable in the bigger picture, which is why Toyota tried to sweep the recent incidents under the carpet, as Mr Toyoda knows very well that Toyotas future is questionable.

Teamveevee brings it to the point: Why buying a car when you are not convinced? The organisation that manufacturers in the automotive world fear the most is the German auto mobile club ADAC. On behalf of their members they make crash tests and other safety related tests. Because of these tests Toyota had to rework a number of cars, because the results were published and the sales slumped in Germany. And this usually goes through the world press. This is called people power.

A lot of people were jumping on the Nano as it was the worst thing ever designed. One poster said that there were 'so many cases'. 2 out of 30,000 is many? Then it was claimed that the 2 isolated cases had tarnished the Nanos reputation on the world stage. I have nothing heard of this sort anywhere in Europe. In Europe we only hear Honda, Mercedes, Toyota, Ford, Fiat having problems no end.

I can relate to the feelings of people in emergencies. I have been surviving in a storm when we lost our boat. Why I am still alive I don't know. I had an emergency landing in an aircraft. I survived a motorbike crash. I survived as a passenger crashes, I survived a bank robbery (I wasn't the robber) and I survived three cancer treatments. And I had the fiercest arguments with financial managers of vehicle managers over safety issues and terminated my contract because I could not agree to work to such low standards (I wasn't just sitting in an armchair whinging). So I know what it is about.

Still, the question was whether the then one and now two fires is the norm or an isolated case. Now it is 2 isolated cases.
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Old 14th April 2010, 14:24   #455
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More food for thought, Just saw in today's new paper that in Dubai Lamborghini (or Porshe don't remember) are recalling 650 of their units because of seat belt safety issue. Now if nano can create so much fuss then what should be the case for these recalls where customers have paid obscene amount of money, these Manufacturers don't even deserve recalls because for that kind of money there should not be even a single fault. And don't just start jumping with the argument the lives are involved, lives are involved every where. Even in this particular seat belt issue lives are involved, these units are not driven by robots. So as CPH says lets not jump to the conclusions just because Tatas are underdogs here because of whatever their past reputation let the truth be found out and we all know investigation are on. And if it really is a design flaw, it will soon be found out as more cars will go in flames though I have my doubts on that.

Last edited by rajdoll : 14th April 2010 at 14:29.
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Old 14th April 2010, 15:06   #456
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See another, this time Lexus
UPDATE 5-Toyota halts Lexus SUV sales after safety warning | Reuters

So let's not jump in to conclusion without a detailed analysis on Nano issue.
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Old 14th April 2010, 15:25   #457
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Originally Posted by Latheesh View Post
See another, this time Lexus
UPDATE 5-Toyota halts Lexus SUV sales after safety warning | Reuters

So let's not jump in to conclusion without a detailed analysis on Nano issue.
You will find that every week no less than 100 recalls are being issued. BTW I never have heard of a Tata recall in Germany.
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Old 14th April 2010, 17:33   #458
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Default Moselle in France woos Tatas to set up Nano plant - ET

ET has a news that states that the Tatas are being wooed by Moselle province in France to set up plant for Nano (Europa version). The link is as follows:

Moselle in France woos Tatas to set up Nano plant-Automobiles-Auto-News By Industry-News-The Economic Times

Wondering if they have actually considered the barbecue on wheels, poor quality car, etc that our friends & Nano baiters have labelled as. Probably, a Nano manufactured in France or as a matter of fact will sound a better proposition to them.

I think we need to exercise more patience over the issue (Nanos on fire) & let Tata do their work.
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Old 14th April 2010, 20:51   #459
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Originally Posted by teamveevee View Post
Agreed, Tata quality is not up to your expectation. But what made you buy the Safari then? You had many choices, why did you choose Safari? Why not a Pajero, Why not a Prado? Why not an X5? Dont tell me you were not aware of the issues when you baught it? With the quality issues, still Safari is a VFM at 10 Lakh, as simple as that...
Totally agree with you. Some people try to use quality as a silver bullet to bash Tata's. Question to all of them: Why is Tata no 2 or 3 in a market with all international players? Why do 30000 odd people buy tata vehicles every month when the quality is so bad. Answer: Tata quality is not that bad after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blue_pulsar View Post
All you guys supporting Tata, I ask you guys one question:
Why was the Tata Nano built?
Because the family of 2-4 people will be safer inside a Nano than on a scooter. If nanos start catching fire, then their scooter was much safer right? Agreed that its a big engineering feat by Tata and all that, but cars just out of showroom catching fire is just unacceptable.

Agreed that its not a design flaw. But whats the guarantee that the other Nanos won't catch fire one day? Life is something which we cannot take a chance with.

All of you defending Tata, please try to place yourselves in the shoes of the man whose car caught fire before reaching home. You will probably understand.
I am sure you did not read the other posts on the thread. I am sure you didnot go through the links where swifts got fire. Go through the thread first and then I will answer the question.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Latheesh View Post
See another, this time Lexus
UPDATE 5-Toyota halts Lexus SUV sales after safety warning | Reuters

So let's not jump in to conclusion without a detailed analysis on Nano issue.
The safety warning was issued by Consumer Reports not by Toyota. Yet I sure there will be people terming Toyota honest. Maynot be on this thread but on a other thread.

Well guys, I will be on vacation for 2 weeks. Can we lock this thread until I come back(fun intended).

Last edited by airbender : 14th April 2010 at 20:58.
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Old 15th April 2010, 02:45   #460
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For all bashers:

Tatas in firefighting mode on Nano; forms team for solution-Automobiles-Auto-News By Industry-News-The Economic Times

Company chairman Ratan Tata is personally monitoring the case and has told the officials to make the vehicle more robust and sturdy on the road besides resolving the defects that caused fire, said the person requesting anonymity.


The management feels that it has to find the root cause of the problem before venturing into any kind of marketing campaigns, the official quoted earlier said. Once we are clear about the issue, we will do a campaign to reassure the customer.


dealers said the firing incidents have not impacted the demand for the car or caused cancellations.
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Old 15th April 2010, 13:32   #461
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Originally Posted by teamveevee View Post
Agreed, Tata quality is not up to your expectation. But what made you buy the Safari then? You had many choices, why did you choose Safari? Why not a Pajero, Why not a Prado? Why not an X5? Dont tell me you were not aware of the issues when you baught it? With the quality issues, still Safari is a VFM at 10 Lakh, as simple as that...
Well quite correct the definition of Quality as per books is " Quality is meeting customer expectation at a given cost "

If cost factor is fixed then it is all about setting the expectation right
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Old 15th April 2010, 13:42   #462
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teamveevee View Post
Agreed, Tata quality is not up to your expectation. But what made you buy the Safari then? You had many choices, why did you choose Safari? Why not a Pajero, Why not a Prado? Why not an X5? Dont tell me you were not aware of the issues when you baught it? With the quality issues, still Safari is a VFM at 10 Lakh, as simple as that...
So what you are saying is that if there is no other vehicle available at the "said" price point, it is a perfectly okay that the vehicle is of poor quality?
I sincerely hope that we do not have many consumers like you in the market
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Old 15th April 2010, 19:07   #463
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Default Recall by Mazda

Please read the following thread on recalls by Mazda:

NOWnewsi*IsDj۹F3|o@Bl*9U @x7dΰDs (This is a Taiwanese site, please translate the page).

It seems that no company in the Year (2010) of Recalls.

Why single out the Tatas for bad quality. Things can only better from here, especially after they are appearing to be serious in rectifying the flaw that could have caused the fire in two Nanos.

I second TSK1979 that no company despite enjoying a monopoly can sell poor quality product. But, Tatas are not in any sort of monopolistic position, especially when the cheaper Alto is around the corner. That is why they are in the fire-fighting mode.

Last edited by CARDEEP : 15th April 2010 at 19:09. Reason: foreign language site link
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Old 15th April 2010, 19:21   #464
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At a "said" price point, would'nt acceptable quality & poor quality have different connotations? It is of course ok to have acceptable quality, but definitely not poor quality.

That goes for any product.
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Old 15th April 2010, 23:08   #465
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Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
So what you are saying is that if there is no other vehicle available at the "said" price point, it is a perfectly okay that the vehicle is of poor quality?
I sincerely hope that we do not have many consumers like you in the market
It is the otherway around, You are expecting high quality vehicle at a low price. I am sure many Safari owners baught it because it is cheaper when compared to others in SUV category, not because of the extra features. They should be ready to compromise on quality. Again, "Catching fire" is a different thing, but low quality plastic and such should be acceptable...
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