Tata nano fire incidents (UPDATED) (Tatas analysis - pg34)

[supremeBaleno]

Just 6 cars got burnt out of 30-40K cars sold. What's the big deal ? Hota hai...
And guess what? R8s and Mercs have also caught fire - in other threads. So, it's OK.

[aaggoswami]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

Just 6 cars got burnt out of 30-40K cars sold. What's the big deal ? Hota hai...
And guess what? R8s and Mercs have also caught fire - in other threads. So, it's OK.

Merc and Audi are produced in even less number IMO and not as mass produced as Nano is or will be. R8 is a high performance machine where in the car has to undergo lot of stress of high speed. A lot of heat is generated as a result of high rpms and high speed driving. If I am not wrong, Veyron has more than 2 radiators due to initial overheating problems. Even F1 engines have caught fire, but that is due to high performance tuning. That said, if Audi and Merc are catching fire, its bad too.

For cars of mass transportation how many cars have caught fire ? Toyota Corolla ? Alto ? Wagon R ? i10 ? For that matter, even Punto, Linea, Vista, Manza are not catching fire.
ACI mentioned that under warranty the fuel lines were changed during service of their long term Nano. So this is where the twist comes whether there was something wrong or not.

For a mass produced car for masses with a relatively low state of tune, this thing must not happen.

[KMohanan]

When I took my nano for the second service at 5000 kms, the service centre has replaced the fuel line under warranty. The car was not having any problem. When asked, the service centre told that there were some complaints reported on the rupture of the fuel line in a few cars and hence they are replacing the same of all cars with a heavy duty one. So, I think tata is taking action to prevent any such incidents.

I have already purchased a handy fire-extinguisher in my nano !!! It costs less than Rs. 2000. If we are able to put off the fire at the beginning, more damages can be avoided. I have not fixed the extinguisher anywhere. Since the fire is likely to start from the rear (engine side), I feel, installing the extinguisher under the bonnet may be better.

Then regarding this third fire : We have to wait some more time to make a judgement. May be if Team-BHP members of the city meet the owner personally, we may get more information.

Who are the main beneficiaries of these incidents ? Since nano is expected to be purchased by 'New' owners who migrate from two wheelers, such terrifying incidents will force them to turn back from buying a nano and buy the next available option. Since the production of the nano has been boosted up and in many places, nano is readily available without booking, only some such incidents can help other manufacturers in the short-term.

With a two-digit previous ownerships of cars, I still say, "Nano is an excellent car - except for the non-openable dickey and the below-average service experience".

[penpavan]

Originally Posted by shortbread

Even the headlines 'Cheap car, Cheap safety' and the language used by the presenters, you get the feeling there is some kind of agenda here!!

I will say!!
The news channels are entirely driven by corporations. They make the news which make profit to the people supporting the news channel.

There may have been vested interests involved in defaming Tata. I remember Ratan Tata once saying he does not rule out two wheeler companies' involvement in throwing Tata out of Singur.

I dont know if this fire case is genuine. But for one thing I know news channels definitely are not. I wouldn't trust them for anything.

[KMohanan]

The news in Times Of India 28 Aug 2010 reports :
"The sky blue Nano bought by SC advocate Ravinder Narayan in May, had done 34,000km and was serviced once."

I think the figure will be 3,400 km and NOT 34,000 kms. News channels reporting news without even the fundamental checks is unfair.

[anmol2k4]

Supreme Court advocate ? First an insurance agent, now a lawyer. It is not hard to imagine a lawyer to hatch a scheme involving a blockbuster product and huge conglomerate. Especially after first two fires.

But it won't be fair to judge anyone before this matter is investigated.

BTW, I would like to correct fellow BHPians, this is not the 6th incident of fire. First three issues which were reported as fires were not really incidents of fire, but faulty component with bad wiring which led to short circuits. Tata motors replaced that component.

But these fires are doing huge damage to nano, layman doe not how common are such fires in any machinery which deals with controlled combustion-fuel-oxygen-heat-pressure.

Aam Admi believes what the idiot box tells them, right now Tata Group and their media and their PR people need to sit down with Indian Media and tell them how common are such fires.

They should show following pictures, and remind Media people the sales volume and price of following vehicles.

At an unknown place.


Somewhere in US.


In Brooklyn


In Netherlands :-



In Florida, USA.

[blue_pulsar]

Come on guys, posting pics of exotics catching fire does not make nano a safe car. If you want to make a car cheap, you can compromise on engine capacity, seats, plastics etc. But how can one compromise on safety? Never. And I'm not talking about crash safety here. If such incidents happen elsewhere in the world, the manufacturer would be sued for millions and millions. We guys have to accept that Nano's safety is questionable no matter how much some people might try to prove otherwise.

Right now, nano isn't selling too much. What will happen when a nano will sell more than an Alto? Alto is selling more than 2 Lac units per year for the last 5-6 years and in smaller volumes before that. If it caught fire at the rate at which Nano catches fire, we should have heard an incident everyday.

P.S. Please don't mistake me for a Alto fanboy. I have owned that car for a very brief period of time and I hate that car. I'm taking Alto example just because its the largest selling car in the country today.

[.anshuman]

The question is : Would you feel comfortable with your family waiting for you in a Nano parked in parking lot with AC running?

[sanagg1]

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

Come on guys, posting pics of exotics catching fire does not make nano a safe car. If you want to make a car cheap, you can compromise on engine capacity, seats, plastics etc. But how can one compromise on safety? Never. And I'm not talking about crash safety here. If such incidents happen elsewhere in the world, the manufacturer would be sued for millions and millions. We guys have to accept that Nano's safety is questionable no matter how much some people might try to prove otherwise.

But how can one compromise on safety?

Dear how do you get this idea of compromising safety by TATA ?
By seeing three Nano catching fire !
IMHO it is not fair.Please have a relook on the issue in totality.

Cheers

[chncar]

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

Come on guys, posting pics of exotics catching fire does not make nano a safe car. If you want to make a car cheap, you can compromise on engine capacity, seats, plastics etc. But how can one compromise on safety?

What is the evidence that Tata has compromised on safety? We have just seen some stray incidents in dubious circumstances, and Tata is way more reputable and trustworthy than these vested interests and news channels. Considering the intense opposition to the Nano project from the start, including from Maruti, Bajaj, Naxals, Singur folks, left-wing environmentalist nutjobs who are horrified by the thought of more people in Nanos but turn a blind eye to all the polluters from the west or China, western commercial interests etc, there is a good chance of these incidents being either stage-managed or hyped beyond proportion.

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

We guys have to accept that Nano's safety is questionable no matter how much some people might try to prove otherwise.

Why? Just because you say so?

[blue_pulsar]

Originally Posted by sanagg1

But how can one compromise on safety?

Dear how do you get this idea of compromising safety by TATA ?
By seeing three Nano catching fire !
IMHO it is not fair.Please have a relook on the issue in totality.

Cheers

You misunderstood actually. I didn't mean they have done it on purpose. But there is a design flaw for sure right? And this is a result of their "cost-cutting-innovation" only.

Originally Posted by chncar

What is the evidence that Tata has compromised on safety? We have just seen some stray incidents in dubious circumstances, and Tata is way more reputable and trustworthy than these vested interests and news channels. Considering the intense opposition to the Nano project from the start, including from Maruti, Bajaj, Naxals, Singur folks, left-wing environmentalist nutjobs who are horrified by the thought of more people in Nanos but turn a blind eye to all the polluters from the west or China, western commercial interests etc, there is a good chance of these incidents being either stage-managed or hyped beyond proportion.



Why? Just because you say so?

See, I don't care where and what went wrong. The ultimate outcome matters. When the fire burns, it does not distinguish if its a Tata design flaw or the handiwork of Maruti, bajaj, Naxals, Singur etc. It just burns the person within the car. And its definitely tata's responsibility to ensure that the car is delivered to the customer in pristine condition. We do not have to blame Tata if a nano caught fire because of bad ICE installation by the local guy. Hope you got my point.

And its not "just because I'm saying so". You are welcome to turn a blind eye to these incidents. But understand one thing. In the end, the customer suffers. And the sufferer could be anybody, might even be one among us. Think about it!

[Amartya]

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

See, I don't care where and what went wrong. The ultimate outcome matters. When the fire burns, it does not distinguish if its a Tata design flaw or the handiwork of Maruti, bajaj, Naxals, Singur etc. It just burns the person within the car.

True, the fire doesn't care if it's Tata's fault or there is something else to blame. But then, why should Tata be held responsible?

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

And its definitely tata's responsibility to ensure that the car is delivered to the customer in pristine condition. We do not have to blame Tata if a nano caught fire because of bad ICE installation by the local guy. Hope you got my point.

I appreciate it if you could clarify this point, this seems like a contradiction to the point made above. If we do not have to blame Tata for a bad ICE installation leading to a fire, then why do we have to blame them if this is the handiwork of a competitor (or Naxals, Mamata Banerjee and so on)?

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

And its not "just because I'm saying so". You are welcome to turn a blind eye to these incidents. But understand one thing. In the end, the customer suffers. And the sufferer could be anybody, might even be one among us. Think about it!

I don't think anyone wants to turn a blind eye towards this. It's just that the incident reported occurred under questionable circumstances (at least for me). Since I don't trust the media (specially the channel that broadcast-ed the report first), I'd wait for an official Tata response.

[shortbread]

Safety is the last parameter that Tata would try to save money on, their reputation shows this.

The issue is if this is sabotage, how is the company going to prove it? Considering that in all cases the fire has been put out after the car has been fully burnt. It will be difficult to prove a conspiracy and even more so for the company to come out in the open and say this without knowing who, what and why.

With the number of Nanos being sold, the car is just an easy target.

[akhilesh51]

While the comparison with the exotics is totally irrelevant considering totally dissimilar situations which resulted in fire in those vehicles, but at the same time, it is not that mass production vehicles don't catch fire.

Nano was a product idolized by the media all over the world and was a blockbuster much before it put first car on road, once again thanks to media. Now, all these news articles about nano fire is just a sort of repercussion of nano being love child of Indian media for so long.

One thing is for sure, Nano is as good or as bad as any other mass produced vehicle in India as far as fire safety is concerned. It is just a victim of its own celebrity status.


Case 1 :

Every year increasing number of tigers (most protected indian wildlife species) are being shot down by poachers across the nation and culprits are caught, case registered, all normal procedure.

There was one such person by the name of Salman Khan who killed, not for poaching but for game, a black buck (another protected species, not as sensitive as tiger) and what happens is known to the whole wide world.

Case 2 :

Road accidents are single largest cause of death in India and inner pages of all national and regional papers are strewn with news about such accidents every day in small columns.

Then comes along a BMW case. and another BMW case. and yet another BMW case. Difference ? It is on front page if not headline.

BMW's seem to cause a lot of accidents. A bad boy car. Not safe!!!

What happens to Nano is self-explanatory as in above cases. Media build you a superstar. It also plots your downfall.

[CPH]

Originally Posted by blue_pulsar

Come on guys, posting pics of exotics catching fire does not make nano a safe car. If you want to make a car cheap, you can compromise on engine capacity, seats, plastics etc. But how can one compromise on safety? Never. And I'm not talking about crash safety here. If such incidents happen elsewhere in the world, the manufacturer would be sued for millions and millions. We guys have to accept that Nano's safety is questionable no matter how much some people might try to prove otherwise.

Right now, nano isn't selling too much. What will happen when a nano will sell more than an Alto? Alto is selling more than 2 Lac units per year for the last 5-6 years and in smaller volumes before that. If it caught fire at the rate at which Nano catches fire, we should have heard an incident everyday.

P.S. Please don't mistake me for a Alto fanboy. I have owned that car for a very brief period of time and I hate that car. I'm taking Alto example just because its the largest selling car in the country today.

I am sorry, but you are talking nonsense here

The first three incidents were not fires, but a faulty part. Tata went to a different supplier.

The fuel lines are not made by Tata. However, 3 cars on fire with 2 of them with a raptured fuel line is such a low percentage.

What about the by now over 9.5 million cars Toyota has and had to recall? Over 150 people died in them! This is plenty of design flaws!!!

Get real. These 3 incidents are not a design flow. There is someone at the suppliers of Tata who let some units slip that will rapture.

Quality control in mass production is a big problem. Even with the hardest efforts rejects are produced and then despite checking them units will slip. This is the reason why the idea of warranty was invented in the first place.