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Old 21st July 2010, 13:03   #316
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It would be interesting to see how the Eurpeans (Jetta, Laura and Linea) react now !!

In one stroke Toyota made it easy for the Linea buyers to upgrade while reducing the "compromize barrier" for Jetta/Laura buyers to downgrade.

I will not be surprized if there is an emergence of a premium taxi service powered by Altis-D. That would be a big volume driver. Toyota was successful with Innova in the past - Altis-D is even more compelling for the taxi companies.

Fuel efficiency, low cost of ownership and road-side support coverage are the three pillars of volume drivers in India. Toyota has it all.
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:11   #317
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cesc View Post
Absolutely agree. Those two are geared towards different kind of customers. I would even go to the extent of saying that they are as different as chalk and cheese for a buyer who has clear cut priorities. What I meant by my comment is that for a buyer with an open mind and general preferences Cruze will be right up there in terms of contention.
Exactly brother both have their own merits and demerits

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Originally Posted by msd63 View Post
The point is however good a body is, it should also have a good heart(engine). A good body with a weak heart is not of much use.
What you say makes sense, but we in india prefer more car per car. And the needs of different people make these cars a desirable one. Why hunt for examples here and there when we ourselves are better examples for my claim, i see you own a getz 1.3 through your signature, i own one as well. Its a beautiful body with a weak heart but it serves the purpose. For me i need a car which feel as spacious and comfortable as a innova but still small enough to drive within city with good boot space as well, for enthusiast swift will be an option

@4x4addict : very clear explanation. well said.

@sid : man you are fast.Was really excited this morning about the launch of the car, was held up in traffic. On my way to office i looked at Harsha Toyota showroom nothing was happening there so thought it will be released in chennai later. came to office and downloaded the brochure but you have already posted it here. hats off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashthedivx View Post
Looking at pricing, for sure bad time for Honda, Skoda and GM is already started !!

I do love competition !!
Starting price at 10.95 is good. I expected Toyota to price is exobirantly high, finally some sensible pricing.I was indeed waiting for the launch of the Etios but at this price its highly tempting.

Last edited by fuhrer : 21st July 2010 at 13:17. Reason: wanted to add another comment
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:11   #318
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rpmx1000 View Post
What's more, Sid (and team-bhp) are the first to cover this in all this detail. Just to
check, I looked at ACI, Zigwheels, BS Motoring, Overdrive and Motoroids(who've gotten pretty good with their scoop stuff of late!). None of them have coverage like this...
Welcome to breaking news from team-bhp. Sid takes(or is it makes?) the ice-cream (since he is the established scoop specialist!).So kudos as in order...
Hi mate, Sid does a good job on these

Burnyourfuel.com is also covering most of its news in first hand.

Corolla Altis Diesel Features, Specifications, Price & Wallpapers Unveiled | Burn Your Fuel
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:19   #319
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Originally Posted by rpmx1000 View Post
Thanks Siddy boy for all the details.
Look at that torque curve. > 19kgm torque between ~1600 - 3500 rpm.
Unbelievable. Really unbelievable.I can tell you beforehand that rivers of praise will flow for this engine.Definitely no slouch on the road. Toyota really knows its stuff.
Yes, the torque curve looks impressive .

Any idea on difference between service intervals and service costs from the petrol version?
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:38   #320
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A first drive of the Corolla-D from ACI.

Corolla Altis diesel Review
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:41   #321
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Originally Posted by Voyager-1 View Post
For the top end version, the 1.8GL is 13.05L ex-Delhi and the top end of 1.4D is 13.75 ex-delhi. For this 70K difference, apart from the diesel engine, Toyota has ripped off some features that are available in the petrol sibling. From the specs in the Toyota site, I can see that Lumbar Support is totally missing (the 1.8GL had Electric Lumbar Support) and the Seat Height Adjustment is manual in the 1.4D (the 1.8GL had Electric Seat Height Adjustment).

Any more features ripped off the 1.4D?
I compared the specs of 1.4D GL and 1.8GL from Toyota site and found two more features missing in the diesel version - Whiplash Injury Lessening Seats (Driver Side) and Rear Sunshade.
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:45   #322
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rpmx1000 View Post
Thanks Siddy boy for all the details.
Look at that torque curve. > 19kgm torque between ~1600 - 3500 rpm.
Unbelievable. Really unbelievable.I can tell you beforehand that rivers of praise will flow for this engine.Definitely no slouch on the road. Toyota really knows its stuff.
If ACI TD is to be believed (and i see no reason not to), the engine is pathetic. here's what ACI says

Quote:
However, what spoils the driving experience even more is massive turbo-lag. Allow the engine speed to fall below 2000rpm and the only way to get this car moving again is a downshift to a lower gear. Else the turbo takes ages to spool up and you are left floundering. There’s no denying that at times this can get quite frustrating. Consider this – the Altis takes 14.85sec from 20-80kph and 20.53sec from 40-100kph, compared to the Jetta, which needs only 6.93sec and 8.65sec respectively.


That surely is going to hurt. My guess is its more of a taxi / chauffeur driven car.
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:47   #323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anb View Post
Unbelievable... . Most modern diesel engines will produce this much of torque. Even the old octavia diesel produces > 19 kgm torque between 1600-3500 rpm.
Visit this page to find of torque versus rpm curve for most the diesel cars
Pete's Automotive Products Pvt Limited
You totally missed my point.I know that too. The point is drivability. How much of useful torque can you have that you will use. And btw, The octavia, though older was a product of a sophisticated TDi technology, at least for its time. And it was a 1.9 litre engine. All these VGT engines like for instance do not produce torque when its needed or usable. This is a fantastic torque curve. Something that will have drivers notice. Something that will give this car a good pace on the highway to keep pace with your Dzires, Manzas and the lot (and protect their owner's pride and investment ).
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:47   #324
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The torque looks constant ~200 Nm between 2K-3K rpm.
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:51   #325
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyWalker View Post
If ACI TD is to be believed (and i see no reason not to), the engine is pathetic. here's what ACI says



That surely is going to hurt. My guess is its more of a taxi / chauffeur driven car.
hmmm.. so ACI beat tbhp to that! Well, the torque curve had me fooled. Maybe they just cooked up something and put it in the brochure ( It is the first brochure that I have seen with a torque curve!!!). I have some reasoning for this. Maybe Toyota thought they could pull it off like the G3HC (77bhp, good mileage) and the Ford Fiesta 1.4TDCi (68bhp, better mileage)..
Keep acquisition costs low and whatever.

@Ampere: The 19kgm torque figure is the highest torque for the 1.3 MJD. Which is quite a good figure considering that the Petrol 1.8 Altis has a peak torque of 17kgm. The torque is never below this between (from what I can extrapolate for that curve) 1600 and 3500 rpm ( a better way to look at what torque the car produces in the daily cycle usable powerband rather than look at how constant it looks at peak torque)

Last edited by rpmx1000 : 21st July 2010 at 13:58.
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Old 21st July 2010, 13:56   #326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager-1 View Post
For the top end version, the 1.8GL is 13.05L ex-Delhi and the top end of 1.4D is 13.75 ex-delhi. For this 70K difference, apart from the diesel engine, Toyota has ripped off some features that are available in the petrol sibling. From the specs in the Toyota site, I can see that Lumbar Support is totally missing (the 1.8GL had Electric Lumbar Support) and the Seat Height Adjustment is manual in the 1.4D (the 1.8GL had Electric Seat Height Adjustment).

Any more features ripped off the 1.4D?
The diesel may be mainly targeted to the premium taxi or chauffeur segment. Who cares if their driver doesn't have lumbar support?

However, I think that the sales of Linea MJD will be on a wobbly track, especially if more people can push their budgets by a couple of lakhs.

Last edited by echo77 : 21st July 2010 at 13:59.
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Old 21st July 2010, 14:08   #327
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After reading the ACI review, looks like turbo-lag is there :(

"However, what spoils the driving experience even more is massive turbo-lag. Allow the engine speed to fall below 2000rpm and the only way to get this car moving again is a downshift to a lower gear. Else the turbo takes ages to spool up and you are left floundering. There’s no denying that at times this can get quite frustrating. Consider this – the Altis takes 14.85sec from 20-80kph and 20.53sec from 40-100kph, compared to the Jetta, which needs only 6.93sec and 8.65sec respectively."

Am I too early relying on pete's box ??

Will for sure tbhp review. GTO - This is indeed a needed one.

Last edited by ashthedivx : 21st July 2010 at 14:10.
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Old 21st July 2010, 14:12   #328
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1) This is a good example of a Manufacturer cheating Indian customers. What a 1364cc diesel engine in a car that is certainly not small ? And then pricing it higher ? Wonder what diesel will we have in Etios. May be the Etios hatch will have a 0.8 ltr. diesel and Etios sedan will have 1.1 ltr. diesel.

Its really a bad move.

2) If ACI numbers are to be believed, A-star, Ritz, Swift, i10 1.2 and even the Swift diesel, Ritz diesel are quicker than Altis diesel, atleast till 100 kmph.
If I am spending Rs. 10 lakh+, definitely a bigger engine will be appreciated. Its not that Toyota is not having engines. In EU or UK, IIRC, the Auris i.e. hatchback version of Altis is available with a 2.0D unit. Even at 120 bhp, the 2.0 would be welcome due to higher torque. Right now even Swift produces around 19+ kgm of torque.

The only reason why Altis would succeed is bad A.S & S. + high cost of spares of Skoda in general. Else no body would buy a 1.4 diesel sedan for Rs. 10 lakh+. The car deserves a 2.0 ltr. unit.
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Old 21st July 2010, 14:12   #329
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i think honda city although petrol and gm optra magnum and cruze will face more competition from this than linea.
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Old 21st July 2010, 14:19   #330
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I also think that Cruze has nothing to worry, it looks and feels better, has a stonker of an engine and is overall a new product. Spec for spec Corolla diesel doesnt stand a chance against Cruze but Indian customer is known to surprise the lot.
And it doesnt bode well when a small hatchback owner can boast that I got more power than you (read the new Punto 90 HP and the i20 Diesel)

Last edited by extreme_torque : 21st July 2010 at 14:30.
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