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Old 21st June 2010, 22:02   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supremeBaleno View Post
Are you suggesting that those who don't take their cars to the track are not enthusiasts ? What about those who don't have access to a track due to their location ? They automatically become non-enthusiasts ? .
All I'm saying is people who "Do it" (of-course given the options) rather than just talk about it.

No offense Biju, you are reading things and twisting things based on your version. That just aint true. A true "driving enthusiast" will love to drive on an open track. That is all I said (Yes this is "MY" though and I know people might not agree, I don't expect all to agree or even 1. I never said "all others" are non-enthusiasts that is your version not mine.)

If you want to make more conclusions please do. If still you want to extrapolate and make more wild conclusions I ain't even gonna try and stop you. I'm not even gonna respond.

A true enthusiast will seize the oppertunity or even create one.
A "not so enthusiastic" guy will find reasons "NOT" to do it.

That is still my statement and it remains...!

EDIT :

Having said that "Track Day" -> Here (MMST Track day on July 11, 2010)

Last edited by yzfrj : 21st June 2010 at 22:03.
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Old 21st June 2010, 22:11   #137
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I dont agree that enthusiast means racer. One can be enthusiast about street driving as well. I used to go ga-ga at the sight of ANY vehicle, in my teens - just like a lot of other boys, but some of us have more love for vehicles.

Remember our first drives? The purely delicious feeling of controlling a vehicle, "being in control", and then perfecting that control to a fine precision - that is what an enthusiast is all about, in my opinion.

A non-enthusiast sees the car as just another appliance like the washing machine in house. He uses it for what it was meant for, has no particular love for it. He cannot identify vehicle models on sight, cannot tell the difference between a Pulsar and a CBZ, or an 800 and an Alto. And he couldnt care less.

There is a lot more to being enthusiast. An enthusiast/bhpian will always wear seat belts. He may drive a bit fast but not rash. He will obey traffic rules and protocols, and take pains to take care of his vehicle. He doesnt necessarily need to be a racer or even aspire to be one. Because "driving" is not synonymous with "racing" - racing is only one type of driving.

In other words: A racer is always an enthusiast, but not necessarily the other way around.

Last edited by rajushank84 : 21st June 2010 at 22:14.
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Old 21st June 2010, 22:43   #138
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Oouch! Can me stick to the topic? No? Then start a new thread pls or

1.2L Madness is not going to end anytime soon. Amen.

P.S: All is not lost for petrol heads. A 1.2L/100 BHP/12 KmpL engine is a tough but possible challenge for the Auto Companies. Who's ready to take the challenge?
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Old 21st June 2010, 22:53   #139
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I wish they give 2% cut for cars that meet 4-5 star Euro ENCAPs, it will lead to market changing innovation in safety features which will be cost effective in developing countries too.
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Old 22nd June 2010, 00:25   #140
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The debate about the meaning of an enthusiast is getting serious now.

I don't take my car to the track or Rallys or OTRs, although I have access to (and information of) these events. I cannot afford to participate in some of them, or rather I would prefer to spend my hard-earned money on other things. Before you mention priorities and responsibilities, let me tell you that I am unmarried, self-dependent and not really a wise spender either.

I enjoy long drives and have 10,000 km of touring alone. Yet, I have never tried any exotic location or tried breaking maximum-kilometre-per-day records.

My car is not scratchless, neither is it very lovingly-maintained, nor loaded to the gills with accessories. Needless to say, most of the car except the tyres are in stock condition.

And yet, I want to drive better, safer, faster (in that order) as well as keep my car in a condition to give me the best performance with maximum reliability.

Now, it is up to you to decide whether I am an enthusiast or not. Let me also tell you (I am repeating myself here) is that I would be happy with a 1.2 L engine with superior performance and F E if I get one. I drive a 1,248 cc diesel anyways.

5 years ago, a sedan with an efficiency of 12 kpl was "okay", even for a someone who did not care about performance. Now the game has been upped. A 90 BHP 1,248 cc Linea is as good as a 90 BHP 1900 cc Octavia of yesteryears.

You cannot call the buyers of these cars non-enthusiasts. Perhaps they're just having a different set of priorities.
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Old 22nd June 2010, 11:23   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by architect View Post
You cannot call the buyers of these cars non-enthusiasts. Perhaps they're just having a different set of priorities.
Perfectly put! The purchase of a car is a balancing act. I simply switch off the AC of my Alto when I switch to my "enthusiast" mode!
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Old 22nd June 2010, 11:33   #142
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From 1.2L madness, we have moved on to what makes an enthusiast.
Anyway, just googled the term and as per Merriam-Webster :

An enthusiast is a person filled with enthusiasm: as a : one who is ardently attached to a cause, object, or pursuit <a sports car enthusiast> b : one who tends to become ardently absorbed in an interest.

Which means almost anyone on this forum is one because they are interested in a cause/object aka cars. The only variable would be the degree of interest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yzfrj
No offense Biju, you are reading things and twisting things based on your version. That just aint true.
No offense taken. @Riju, you are entitled to think differently, but I am sure I did not twist your version. All your points about enthusiast revolve around track-usage. See below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yzfrj
A petrolhead is one who talks about it and does't mind taking his car to track and having a ball. A non-enthusiast is one who talks about it but never does it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yzfrj
All I'm saying is people who "Do it" rather than just talk about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yzfrj
A true "driving enthusiast" will love to drive on an open track. That is all I said.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yzfrj
A true enthusiast will seize the oppertunity or even create one. A "not so enthusiastic" guy will find reasons "NOT" to do it. That is still my statement and it remains...!
Anyway, we are going waaaay OT here. Let's agree to disagree and talk about the 1.2l 'madness'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yzfrj
Having said that "Track Day" -> Here (MMST Track day on July 11, 2010)
Thanks.

Last edited by supremeBaleno : 22nd June 2010 at 11:37.
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Old 22nd June 2010, 13:39   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DWind View Post
If there is a vote to support / not support this 1.2 litre rule I would whole heartedly support it. Now because of this rule every car manufacturer who is serious about volumes in India has come up with an engine either by reducing the stroke (Hyundai Kappa) or removing a cylinder (VW) or developing an all new engine (Honda). This is just Round ONE! Winner: Suzuki 1.2 K series.
I think from these options Round ONE winner should be 1.2 liter engine in Honda Jazz. It provides 90 bhp and is more fuel efficient also. If only Honda would have priced Jazz a bit cheaper, things would have been different.
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Old 22nd June 2010, 16:53   #144
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Actually, when I mentioned the Honda City's engines, I missed mentioning the Jazz. Isn't it appreciable that we get 90bhp out of a 'puny' 1.2l engine ?
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Old 22nd June 2010, 17:19   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gou View Post
I think from these options Round ONE winner should be 1.2 liter engine in Honda Jazz. It provides 90 bhp and is more fuel efficient also.
Not going to argue with you here. But I felt the K Series was more drivable than the iVTEC. Also, it delivers peak torque and power at lower RPM than Honda's. An enthusiast might love the Honda's engine while the K Series might appeal more to the average joe. My reasoning is this! A 1.2 liter is intended for mass market and so should be engineered for mass market.
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Old 22nd June 2010, 20:07   #146
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Originally Posted by Gansan View Post
Perfectly put! The purchase of a car is a balancing act. I simply switch off the AC of my Alto when I switch to my "enthusiast" mode!
Too bad, People are talking about Super charger, Turbo charger, Mobile charger in a 1.2L when we already have the inbuilt, OEM 'Nitro Boost' button for the puny 800 CC Alto.

Man, what a performance when the A/C is switched off
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Old 22nd June 2010, 20:41   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DWind
I felt the K Series was more drivable than the iVTEC. Also, it delivers peak torque and power at lower RPM than Honda's.
Agree. But from what I have read here, that's the case with the bigger Honda engines too in the City and Civic too. So, IMO it would be unfair to take that against the Honda 1.2
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Old 22nd June 2010, 21:32   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mi10 View Post
Too bad, People are talking about Super charger, Turbo charger, Mobile charger in a 1.2L when we already have the inbuilt, OEM 'Nitro Boost' button for the puny 800 CC Alto.

Man, what a performance when the A/C is switched off
Ha ha! It is indeed quite nippy with just two people on board and the AC switched off! I enjoy the highway drive during early mornings when one can manage with just the blower running on fresh air mode and the windows rolled up. Goes like the proverbial hot knife through butter!
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Old 22nd June 2010, 22:22   #149
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supremeBaleno View Post
But from what I have read here, that's the case with the bigger Honda engines too in the City and Civic too.
Let us first do away with the routine detuning for India. With BS3/BS4 Regular Petrol is 91RON, why is the Civic in India tuned for 130 bhp when the European and US versions are 140 bhp? This mindset must go.
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Old 22nd June 2010, 22:29   #150
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I am not sure I understood your query. What does bad drivability have to do with detuning ? Would an increase of 10bhp (130 to 140) make the Civic more drivable ?

Last edited by supremeBaleno : 22nd June 2010 at 22:39.
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