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Old 10th June 2010, 16:09   #1
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Default When this 1.2L madness will end ?

Every other hatchback is launched with this same engine. We are waiting for 1.6L swift since its launched and now maruti is also changed swift to 1.2L.
Is the market for performance hatchbacks is so low that no one is bothered to launch anything. Maruti with so much market share and sales can't launch a single car with bigger engine. Even the over prices Jazz is 1.2l when city's engine can be easily installed and launched as a new variant. What is it that the manufacturers are so scared to launch anything. I know about tax different with engine lower than 1.2l , but still.
Is the performance hatch segment for India is already over, even before it started ? If a person wants to buy a Hatchback with decent performance there is no options. What do you guys think ? who is going to launch the first car in this segment ?


PS: Please don't bring FIAT in this thread otherwise same fight will start. As Palio is already discontinued and 100bhp from 1.6L should not be considered optimum these days when 1.2L engine develop 90bhp, and i will not say 1.4 from FIAT is performance oriented engine.
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Old 10th June 2010, 16:20   #2
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If government of India removes the excise benefit for 1.2L segment, then the war will come to an end. Until then it seems like a never ending battle.
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Old 10th June 2010, 16:26   #3
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I guess the VW Polo 1.6 can be an option. Sir, I don't understand why bringing in Fiat will cause a fight, but the 90bhp VGT Punto with all that torque can be a fun option too.

However, a true performance hatch offering 125-150bhp would be great.
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Old 10th June 2010, 16:34   #4
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Rahulkool, your prayers will soon be answered by the new Ford Fiesta hatch. 1.6L Duratec. Variable valve timing. 120 BHP. I hope Fiat plonks in the T-Jet into the Punto as well. You cannot expect anyone other than Ford and Fiat to take care of the needs of an enthusiast at an affordable price (read <10 lacs).

Last edited by Gilead : 10th June 2010 at 16:37.
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Old 10th June 2010, 16:35   #5
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1.2 IMHO is the perfect compromise between efficiency and performance. Not to mention the added excise benefit. I am perfectly OK with this engine size for my everyday office and occasional week end jaunt.
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Old 10th June 2010, 16:40   #6
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There is news of VW Polo with 1.6L diesel engine coming to market by Sept.
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Old 10th June 2010, 16:41   #7
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What you are witnessing, my friend, is the consolidation of automotive companies in terms of technology sharing. OEMs no longer make engines for different geographies and markets, they are slowing moving to one engine for all market strategy. Heck, they don't even make their own engines All the 1.3 L diesels you see in India is essentially the 1.3L Fiat world engine rebranded by different OEMs.

We sadly missed the performace car era due to the license raj that was let go in the mid-80s. We will only see smaller and more fuel efficient engines in India in the future.

But cheer up, smaller and efficient doesn't necessarily mean less powerful. Turbochargers are here to stay.
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Old 10th June 2010, 16:42   #8
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Its all the money game !! The manufactures worry about their cost due to govt impositions and benefits !! Not to forget due to the same 1.2L segment, the no. of car owners have increased too !! It's all the part of the same game
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Old 10th June 2010, 17:02   #9
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All these hatches are targeted for big volumes, city driving & economy. With 1.2 L they are getting tax benefit so as to keep prices in control & aoffrdable to common man to gain sales numbers. Also with 1.2 you can get balance of power & economy. Thats the main reason, nothing else
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Old 10th June 2010, 17:08   #10
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Why does govt provide tax benefits for 1.2L cars?

I never understood the reason. Is it due to lower emissions? Is it for fuel efficiency reasons? That doesn't seem plausible, since some of the 1.2 sloths on our roads have measly FEs, including the SRK-endorsed fuglies.

What is the REAL reason?

Last edited by WindRide : 10th June 2010 at 17:10.
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Old 10th June 2010, 17:10   #11
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I do not think there is any end to this "1.2L madness", till the time Indian Govt. resets the small car norms. A small car, say Ritz/Swift with Suzuki's 1.25L engine & i10/i20 with 1.25L engine available in Europe, will be atleast Rs50K costlier only because the of the excise duty benefit forgone because of the bigger engine.

I also agree with SPARKled's view about efficiency & performance.

what needs to be rationalise is the diesel engine norms for small car, as diesel engines these days are far higher on the evolution scale as compared to 10 years ago.
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Old 10th June 2010, 17:13   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WindRide View Post
Why does govt provide tax benefits for 1.2L cars?

I never understood the reason. Is it due to lower emissions? Is it for fuel efficiency reasons? That doesn't seem plausible, since some of the 1.2 sloths on our roads have measly FEs, including the SRK-endorsed fuglies.

What is the REAL reason?
I thought the real reason was obvious. It's MARUTI of course. It's the power of lobbying my friend. I don't blame them. Every company worth anything indulges in it. And the powerful ones usually ensure that the policies are enacted in such a way that it suits them.

Last edited by Gilead : 10th June 2010 at 17:15.
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Old 10th June 2010, 17:14   #13
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I think its not the capacity that really is the issue, Japan has some K cars or something with 800cc engines that would give our Indian cars a good run in the perf dept. doubt we'll be seeing anything like that now though.. I agree with Gooney we missed the proper era of motoring, these days its all about efficency, wild,extravagant etc are out :(
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Old 10th June 2010, 17:19   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilead View Post
I thought the real reason was obvious. It's MARUTI of course. ...
Sorry to sound a dimwit, but what has maruti got to do with this? How do they gain by lobbying for it? Even they have been beaten black and blue in segments where bigger engines are a must (SUVs, sedans,etc). Pls elaborate.

Last edited by WindRide : 10th June 2010 at 17:20.
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Old 10th June 2010, 17:21   #15
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What happens when you stick with the 1.2 ? The i20 M/T = Sir, there is a two-month waiting period.

What happens with you go beyond 1.2 ? The i20 A/T = Sure Sir, ready delivery
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