Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP India > The Indian Car Scene


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 9th August 2010, 07:53   #151
Senior - BHPian
 
Amartya's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Evanston
Posts: 1,699
Thanked: 376 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by chevelle View Post
So, its not like a bias against FIAT for not providing powerful engine, it goes for Hondas and Toyotas too. If and when they launch this T-Jet i am sure most of them will stop saying it is underpowered
As much as I'd like to believe what you said, it's not true. You don't have to read through a lot of threads to see how Fiat has been under the hammer. Hundred bucks says that plastic quality and interior fitments would be cited as reasons that the FIAT should fail. If that doesn't work, drag Tata (hence FIAT) A.S.S. into the mud-slinging fest. Just read this thread from start to finish, you'll see that there is less talk of the T-jet than of the Punto and Fiat A.S.S.

As a person who enjoys driving, I have slowly warmed to the Fiats. First drove the Uno, didn't like it (had my eyes on the Zen), then came the Project 178 cars (Siena, Palio), now the Punto and the Linea. Fiat made a hash of things over the years, they failed even with excellent products; but unlike Renault and Peugeot they didn't leave the country. Yes, they are here for business interests, but it might have been easier (but short sighted) for them to just leave the country and earn money from licensing deals with Suzuki.

I like it when they try, and try hard to make a comeback.
Amartya is offline  
Old 9th August 2010, 09:36   #152
BHPian
 
echo77's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: goa
Posts: 325
Thanked: 33 Times
Default

Quote:
If and when they launch this T-Jet i am sure most of them will stop saying it is underpowered
They'll still say it is underpowered because its still the 1.4, whereas other markets have the 1.6 and 1.9 TJet
echo77 is offline  
Old 9th August 2010, 10:56   #153
BHPian
 
sharma_sanjeevi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 570
Thanked: 62 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by echo77 View Post
They'll still say it is underpowered because its still the 1.4, whereas other markets have the 1.6 and 1.9 TJet
+1, as i can see from the starting of this thread, only mud slinging is going on FIAT A.S.S, Punto & Fit & Finish Issues. I think this thread is going off topic, and we should discuss only the Linea T-Jet here.

Every FIAT related thread turns into mud slinging only stop this, and lets have a constructive / informative discussion guys.
sharma_sanjeevi is offline  
Old 9th August 2010, 11:32   #154
CPH
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: London
Posts: 577
Thanked: 33 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by echo77 View Post
They'll still say it is underpowered because its still the 1.4, whereas other markets have the 1.6 and 1.9 TJet
No European market has got a petrol engine bigger than 1.4 in any Fiat anymore.

The 1.6, the 1.9 and the 2.0 are all Diesel engines.
CPH is offline  
Old 9th August 2010, 12:03   #155
BHPian
 
echo77's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: goa
Posts: 325
Thanked: 33 Times
Default

^^
IIRC, the 1.9 used in Brazil is a petrol.

Also thought I saw a youtube advert for 1.6 TJet, but I may have mistaken the 16v for 1.6.
echo77 is offline  
Old 9th August 2010, 13:47   #156
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 34
Thanked: 13 Times
Default

Whats more important for Fiat is to understand and listen to existing customers. As long as Fiat is with Tata, Fiat owners will always be second class citizens at dealerships.

When Tata-FIAT is unable to support its existing users why would one invest in a new model whose spares would be even harder to procure. When I talk about spares I do not mean air filters and such... I am talking about parts you may need 4-5 years down the line which frankly speaking are a nightmare to procure for Fiat cars.

Cheers,
Manoj
vvmanoj is offline  
Old 9th August 2010, 15:43   #157
Senior - BHPian
 
chevelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: sacto
Posts: 1,290
Thanked: 503 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amartya View Post
As much as I'd like to believe what you said, it's not true. You don't have to read through a lot of threads to see how Fiat has been under the hammer. Hundred bucks says that plastic quality and interior fitments would be cited as reasons that the FIAT should fail. If that doesn't work, drag Tata (hence FIAT) A.S.S. into the mud-slinging fest. Just read this thread from start to finish, you'll see that there is less talk of the T-jet than of the Punto and Fiat A.S.S.

As a person who enjoys driving, I have slowly warmed to the Fiats. First drove the Uno, didn't like it (had my eyes on the Zen), then came the Project 178 cars (Siena, Palio), now the Punto and the Linea. Fiat made a hash of things over the years, they failed even with excellent products; but unlike Renault and Peugeot they didn't leave the country. Yes, they are here for business interests, but it might have been easier (but short sighted) for them to just leave the country and earn money from licensing deals with Suzuki.

I like it when they try, and try hard to make a comeback.
I was just talking w.r.t the engines. yes, interior, fit and finish are some issues which everybody loves pointing out in a fiat car, but till now, the 1.4 petrol being underpowered was also mentioned. Hell, when we tested it we felt it was underpowered. So, that's why i was hopeful that it no longer will be mentioned in same breath as interiors and fit and finish and a.s.s.

Just think of it, just as we blame Honda for being overpriced, less features for its price, a wee bit wanting in ride and handling department, similarly we blame Fiat for poor quality interiors, fit and finish and a.s.s. After all we are looking for perfect sedan/hatch that has best of both worlds which we haven't yet got still.


Quote:
Originally Posted by echo77 View Post
They'll still say it is underpowered because its still the 1.4, whereas other markets have the 1.6 and 1.9 TJet
All i have read about is 1.6 and 1.9 MultiJet which are diesel. I didn't knew there is a 1.6 T-Jet too. Could you give some reference links?

On Fiat's Brazil site, it says 1.9 MJD and 1.9 petrol. No where it says its a 1.9 T-Jet
chevelle is offline  
Old 9th August 2010, 16:44   #158
BHPian
 
echo77's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: goa
Posts: 325
Thanked: 33 Times
Default

I just checked. There is no 1.6 petrol - I mistook the 16v for 1.6

Also, the 1.9 is not a TJet. It is Flex (ethanol/petrol)

I retract the 1.6 and TJet from my statement, so it now becomes:

Quote:
They'll still say it is underpowered because its still a 1.4, whereas Brazil has a 1.9
echo77 is offline  
Old 9th August 2010, 19:42   #159
CPH
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: London
Posts: 577
Thanked: 33 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by echo77 View Post
^^
IIRC, the 1.9 used in Brazil is a petrol.

Also thought I saw a youtube advert for 1.6 TJet, but I may have mistaken the 16v for 1.6.
In Brazil they have got the 1747cc lump, which is in Europe currently in Alfas and Lancias. The revised 1747 might end up in -the Fiat Bravo.

Fiat never had a 1.9 petrol.

There was a T-Jet planned to be used in Fiats, but this was at the time before the divorce from GM.

The 1.9 8v M-Jet is now replaced by the 1.6 16v M-Jet and the 1.9 16v by the 2.0 16v.

There are some 1.6 turbos in Greece, but they are all converted to turbos.

However the Linea T-jet can be easily uprated to about 160 bhp with AIR and proper re-map, with a turbo upgrade, some sensor changes, AIR and re-map to about 180 to 190 bhp and with further modifications to anywhere between 200 and 250bhp without changing anything on the engine internals.

I have done a lot of work on the engine in many cars and can tell that it is a very good engine. It is just that the T-Jet is for my liking not quick enough, but than I am spoilt.

And if anyone else thinks it is not quick enough, there is always the possibility to give a tuner a visit.
CPH is offline  
Old 10th August 2010, 10:48   #160
BHPian
 
vikrantj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Pune
Posts: 574
Thanked: 308 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vvmanoj View Post
Whats more important for Fiat is to understand and listen to existing customers. As long as Fiat is with Tata, Fiat owners will always be second class citizens at dealerships.

When Tata-FIAT is unable to support its existing users why would one invest in a new model whose spares would be even harder to procure. When I talk about spares I do not mean air filters and such... I am talking about parts you may need 4-5 years down the line which frankly speaking are a nightmare to procure for Fiat cars.

Cheers,
Manoj
Are you a existing FIAT or Tata car owner ? Since I am not too sure where you have this info from. I do not think we have even one instance where a FIAT part is not available and secondly FIAT owners being treated unfairly at TASS is pure myth.
vikrantj is offline  
Old 10th August 2010, 11:51   #161
BHPian
 
thalavoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Chennai
Posts: 389
Thanked: 62 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikrantj View Post
Are you a existing FIAT or Tata car owner ? Since I am not too sure where you have this info from. I do not think we have even one instance where a FIAT part is not available and secondly FIAT owners being treated unfairly at TASS is pure myth.
I second that. All my dealings with Prerana, no complaints at all and have not seen any differential treatment for Fiat owners.
Not sure about the parts/spares though. I mean, I had to wait for quite some time for a replacement for Adventure rear wiper. But, replacement for side rear view mirror was readily available.
thalavoy is offline  
Old 10th August 2010, 12:10   #162
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Delhi
Posts: 112
Thanked: 17 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vvmanoj View Post
Whats more important for Fiat is to understand and listen to existing customers. As long as Fiat is with Tata, Fiat owners will always be second class citizens at dealerships.

When Tata-FIAT is unable to support its existing users why would one invest in a new model whose spares would be even harder to procure. When I talk about spares I do not mean air filters and such... I am talking about parts you may need 4-5 years down the line which frankly speaking are a nightmare to procure for Fiat cars.

Cheers,
Manoj
EDIT: Just saw you have GTX, so may be in this case the below comments doesn't apply to you as you may have genuinely faced issue, but still I will say please don't generalize the service as there may be some who haven't faced the problems you might have.

Not sure whether you yourself have experience this or heard stories from others, I can tell you my own personal experience. Once my Palio Stile (rarest model in Palio) rear axle bent when an roadside angle came below a tyre and it is obviously not a stored part but I got that in 3 days flat. And it's now close to three and half years and I have no complaints regarding my car parts from TATA / FIAT service network. And in this time period I had to change front bumper, OVRM and manifold too and I didn't face any issues. It would be really appreciated if team-bhp members post genuine experiences and not unverified stories heard from distant friends, relatives, colleagues.

Last edited by humans : 10th August 2010 at 12:14.
humans is offline  
Old 10th August 2010, 16:09   #163
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 34
Thanked: 13 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vikrantj View Post
Are you a existing FIAT or Tata car owner ? Since I am not too sure where you have this info from. I do not think we have even one instance where a FIAT part is not available and secondly FIAT owners being treated unfairly at TASS is pure myth.
I own a 2001 1.6GTX (one of the very first in Hyderabad). Do you own one of the newer cars? Then you might have been lucky on the spares front. On an average for any major part (again on personal experience) it takes not less than 3 weeks (on average) for parts to arrive. I know the pain and frustration when my car had to sit idle waiting for parts for almost 3 months (put together) this past year.

Tell me what kind of a story does that paint for my frineds/colleagues? Its these things that spread and give such a bad publicity for FIAT. How serious is FIAT about tackling these issues? Do I need to run behind company officials each time I need a spare part?!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by humans View Post
It would be really appreciated if team-bhp members post genuine experiences and not unverified stories heard from distant friends, relatives, colleagues.
First to clear things, all what I have said is from personal experience. Apart from some common fast moving parts, most parts takes ages to procure. Take for instance a simple AC switch, its now been more than 45 days and the part is still to be procured! I had to change a few uncommon parts ( like the radiator fan - took close to 3 weeks, Fuel tank - approx 4 weeks).

I have tried different dealers but their ability to procure parts is pretty much the same. Perhaps its a different story in Delhi or Mumbai but here in Hyderabad its a completely different picture.

Please do not assume I am bashing Fiat. There is nothing more that would make me happy than to see them do well in India. Its been close to 10 years since I have owned a Palio and I think I have experienced a lot in those 10 years.

I would love to buy a Linea TJet (to replace my aging GTX) but I think this time I will probably go for another brand. I really dont want to go thru this kind of experience all over again.

Cheers,
Manoj
vvmanoj is offline  
Old 10th August 2010, 19:00   #164
BHPian
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Delhi
Posts: 112
Thanked: 17 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vvmanoj View Post
First to clear things, all what I have said is from personal experience.
Yes, realized this after posting and did edited my post , please check the first part of my post.

I just gave my comments based on my interactions with many people at work and otherwise who all have preconceived notions about TATA / FIAT service without experiencing it first hand.
humans is offline  
Old 10th August 2010, 21:40   #165
BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 269
Thanked: 66 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vvmanoj View Post
On an average for any major part (again on personal experience) it takes not less than 3 weeks (on average) for parts to arrive. Manoj
Hi there,
If you happen to scroll through the Palio Users Group, you'll find mention of a certain Kava Automobiles, based out of Mumbai. Many say their requirement of spare parts for Fiat vehicles was fulfilled by this shop. Though personally I do not have any experience, it is worth trying when you are forced to wait for spares for long periods of time.
lejhoom is online now  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My Terrestrial Fighter Jet : Fiat Linea T-Jet+. EDIT: 3 years, 4th Service completed KarthikK Long-Term Ownership Reviews 220 8th April 2015 00:19
Renaissance of my JET - White FIAT Linea T-Jet+ (27,000 Kms Up) Sathya_sc Test-Drives & Initial Ownership Reports 225 4th August 2014 20:29
The Perfect Gift – Hip Hop Black Fiat Linea T-Jet. EDIT: 1,000 kms up azhar915 Test-Drives & Initial Ownership Reports 39 31st March 2014 21:02
Fuelled FIRE into my (T)JET - The Fiat Linea T-Jet bnzjon Test-Drives & Initial Ownership Reports 123 12th May 2013 00:16


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 12:35.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks