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Old 30th September 2010, 13:28   #421
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I do not understand one thing, Every time a new version of Punto/Linea variant comes out the media goes gaga over how the Interior quality has been improved again. The Punto's interior was upgraded twice(Moved to matte finish soft touch dashboard Jan'10 and Punto 90hp) but still if you check the current batch cars the quality + Fit & Finish still falls short.

Even in current batch Punto's and Linea's i can point out atleast 20 eyesores within the Interiors. Fiat could not fix the console near ignition switch till date. Linea has been around for years, even the Punto shares the same console.
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Old 30th September 2010, 13:31   #422
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Originally Posted by .anshuman View Post
Even in current batch Punto's and Linea's i can point out atleast 20 eyesores within the Interiors. Fiat could not fix the console near ignition switch till date. Linea has been around for years, even the Punto shares the same console.
Fair comment. When I took the test drive of Punto 76hp a while ago, I felt that the interiors of my 2004 Palio are of much better quality than the Punto.
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Old 30th September 2010, 13:35   #423
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Originally Posted by adimicra View Post
He patiently heard all the stuff. At the end, he said that he doesn't want to spend 10L on a FIAT, however good the car might be! I couldn't even convince him to go for a TD. That's it, end of argument!
What do we tell to people with such attitude. I blame it on to Fiat for firstly creating this. Off the cuff, I know several Tata Motors employees who own a Fiat,post the merger, and inspite of the fiat imagery claim its a better car.
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Old 30th September 2010, 13:41   #424
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Originally Posted by sunnyside View Post
@VahanPujari, You, me and most of the BHP'ians are a miniscule minority among the car buying public. Majority of the car customers have a herd mentality thats why MUL cant discontinue M800 & Alto.
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Originally Posted by rajchetan View Post
Rightly put, We Indians believe in the Herd mentality, across every aspect of life. Don't get me wrong. this includes me as well.
Actually this herd mentality is not limited to Indians or to only certain aspect of life. This behaviour is present across the world and across many aspects of life, which was proven by a group of psychologists and analysts while studying the behaviour of traders in financial markets.

Their conclusions were pretty surprising for themselves as they observed that the thought process of even highly educated professionals, like doctors, engineers, lawyers changed drastically when they were alone and when in groups.

The reason was pretty simple. Its an inherent trait that we humans have carried on for long as we evolved. Right or wrong we feel safe in numbers. Now all Fiat should do is try to create that mentality

For those who are into financial markets or just are curious, there is a new theory and study that is gaining popularity in the field of human behaviour, especially related to financial markets, Socionomics.

Here is the link Socionomics Foundation - Advancing the Science of Social Prediction
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Old 30th September 2010, 13:56   #425
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@adimicra - Such comments are generally made by people who haven't driven the FIAT cars. Since most of the janta are used to driving Marutis and Tatas, they are not aware of the driving dynamics of FIAT cars or for that matter even FORD and VW cars. So, its naturally ignored. My friend who is a very good and disciplined driver bought a Ritz blindly since it was a new product from a Maruti stable. Their family have bought nothing but Marutis since 2 decades starting from the good old 800. It was only when he drove my GTX, he could understand what was missing in Maruti cars. Unless people don't give FIAT a chance, I doubt FIAT can do much except whatsoever they are doing now.

But, Kudos to Honda to maintain such a brand name. No matter what, Honda is considered Premium by the Janata and I think for some good reasons as well. In my peer circle, Honda is a status symbol. Wonder how long it'll take FIAT to achieve this type of brand following.

I also agree with Anshuman on the interior quality of Linea and Punto. They do not feel premium at all. Haven't seen the T-Jet interiors but hope they do bring in something refreshing.
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Old 30th September 2010, 14:48   #426
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Guys, Fiat's brand image is bad not just because of the HISTORY! Yes, history plays a significant role but it is not the only thing. Fiat has failed to improve the brand image though having 2 good cars in Linea and Punto, mainly because of 2 issues-
  • Reliability - lots of niggling issues as evident in the various threads in this forum.
  • Interior quality and fit/finish - Does not give any premium feel.

Unless Fiat is able to improve upon the above 2 things, I don't see its fortunes changing in India. Even if they improve, it will take them quite a while to change the Brand image but at least, there is a chance. Otherwise, FIAT does not stand a chance.

I could not argue with my friend because he asked me a blunt question - Will Fiat be as reliable and trouble-free as a Honda? I said that I ca't guarantee that! That's it ... peace of mind and trouble-free ownership experience are the 2 main criteria (driving experience, features etc come much later)for selecting a car for majority of the people. And I can't blame them for that and that's where FIAT loses out.

A.S.S is not the major culprit as the experience varies from dealer to dealer as in the case of all brands.

Last edited by adimicra : 30th September 2010 at 14:49.
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Old 30th September 2010, 14:54   #427
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Originally Posted by adimicra View Post
Guys, Fiat's brand image is bad not just because of the HISTORY!Fiat has failed to improve the brand image though having 2 good cars in Linea and Punto, mainly because of 2 issues-
  • Reliability - lots of niggling issues as evident in the various threads in this forum.
  • Interior quality and fit/finish - Does not give any premium feel.
All these niggling issues are so popularly known only to T-Bhpians! Do you think the normal janta know that the fit and finish of plastics are not good?

This SURELY can't be the reason for the current state of Fiat in India.
The main problem is with the HISTORY of Fiat in India from 1998 till now.
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Old 30th September 2010, 15:26   #428
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All these niggling issues are so popularly known only to T-Bhpians! Do you think the normal janta know that the fit and finish of plastics are not good?
First of all IMO the interior built quality is a sore point in Linea.

Why I say this is not because of the plastic used. If you give me 2-3 samples of plastics, I cannot tell the difference between them. So, I dont know if linea plastic quality is good or bad and i dont care. What puts me off is the huge and uneven, very much noticeable gaps in the console plastics.
I dont understand why a world class manufacturer cant solve this minor issue.

Fiat, in India, is not a well respected brand compared to its competition. Instead of going extra mile in improving that perception, Fiat is making a big mistake by putting together the console like a chinese toy.
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Old 30th September 2010, 15:54   #429
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Quote:
he doesn't want to spend 10L on a FIAT
A part of me agree with the above reasoning, its like spending 10L on Maruti.

Vote it on Which is better:
Spending 10L on Fiat or Spending 10L on Maruti ???
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Old 30th September 2010, 16:10   #430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mxx View Post
First of all IMO the interior built quality is a sore point in Linea.

Why I say this is not because of the plastic used. If you give me 2-3 samples of plastics, I cannot tell the difference between them. So, I dont know if linea plastic quality is good or bad and i dont care. What puts me off is the huge and uneven, very much noticeable gaps in the console plastics.
I dont understand why a world class manufacturer cant solve this minor issue.

Fiat, in India, is not a well respected brand compared to its competition. Instead of going extra mile in improving that perception, Fiat is making a big mistake by putting together the console like a chinese toy.
+1 to that. Don't think aam junta is really that dumb! They may not know all the technicalities, but they can easily make out if the interiors feel premium or not. Ask people who are buying the I20? Main reason is the interiors feel premium apart from the all the gizmos.The level of fit/finish in the interiors of Fiat cars does not help in building a premium feel. This has to be corrected in the T-jet as it has to compete with the ANHC and the Vento and the premium feel is all the more important. Personally, I feel the quality of plastics is not that bad, it is the fit and finish which is the culprit. Sincerely hope Fiat sorts it out in the T-jet!
Eagerly waiting for the TBHP review of the T-Jet.
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Old 30th September 2010, 16:23   #431
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mxx View Post
What puts me off is the huge and uneven, very much noticeable gaps in the console plastics.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JVH View Post
I also agree with Anshuman on the interior quality of Linea and Punto. They do not feel premium at all. Haven't seen the T-Jet interiors but hope they do bring in something refreshing.
I do hope that the T-Jet addresses all the issues regarding interiors.
I would like to discuss something regarding interiors:
The interior fit and finish has been considerably improved in current Punto/Linea even though it is no where able to give that premium feel.
But, how many non-BHPians are able to make out these finish(panel gap) issues near ignition key, glove box lid, below steering?
What a normal person sees first is the quality of plastics used in the dashboard(compare i20/Polo) rather than panel gaps in hard to notice areas.
It is the owners who subsequently notice a few areas after using it daily. But, then one can live with a few panel gaps that are not readily noticeable to you friends/family/guests but what is much more noticeable is the good ride quality offered by Fiats.

What most people look at is the overall quality of the cabin and good leather seats etc make a good overall impression(Check out the cabin pics in Linea thread by Nuts'n'Bolts)
T-Jet with the Italian leather surely looks cool in the pics at least. Lets see how it will look in actual.

Last edited by PaddleShifter : 30th September 2010 at 16:34.
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Old 30th September 2010, 16:43   #432
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A typical case of herd mentality.

We cant do much, but it simply means that Fiat has got great deal of work to do if they want their product to be even considered by customers in the 10L price bracket.

Last edited by anachronix : 30th September 2010 at 16:45.
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Old 30th September 2010, 16:48   #433
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Interior quality, fit and finish and reliability is directly proportional to the price..this is what I think. You can price your product much lower than the competition only by cost cutting in these areas. This is what FIAT has done to keep the cost down. They have killed two wonderful products by compromising on reliability and ***. A global auto giant like FIAT should their own A.S.S. and should give more attention to quality and finish to make the products successful.

Coming back to T-JET it looks very promising on paper and the few test drive reports are also very positive . Hope the reliability and fit/finish is upto the mark
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Old 30th September 2010, 18:30   #434
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Originally Posted by crazyro View Post
Interior quality, fit and finish and reliability is directly proportional to the price..this is what I think. You can price your product much lower than the competition only by cost cutting in these areas. This is what FIAT has done to keep the cost down. They have killed two wonderful products by compromising on reliability and ***. A global auto giant like FIAT should their own A.S.S. and should give more attention to quality and finish to make the products successful.

Coming back to T-JET it looks very promising on paper and the few test drive reports are also very positive . Hope the reliability and fit/finish is upto the mark
Reliability - My Linea D has done up 25k kms and still going strong. I dont see any issues whatsoever with the reliability of my beauty. It has never let me down anywhere anytime.. and touch wood there are no major rattling problems as well...

I had two Maruti's before and I would say the service is at par with what I have got in Maruti Service Stations. Actually I should say I get a better treatment owning a FIAT car than I used to get by owning Maruti cars. Its just hyped that the service is a let down or not in par with any other manufacturer. Also the service costs are low.. example my Swift costed my 7k during my third free service wherein My Linea has costed me close to 4k during my second free service which includes Oil change.. Even that 4 k actually includes interior 3m cleaning of 1k... To be honest I would say I have NO problems with my ownership (in terms of cost, reliability, service or whatever parameter it is)... Its just all hyped.. same "FIAT is bad in Service" mentality that people have developed during the old UNO/Palio days... Actually FIAT is making substancial progress in all aspects... I am selling my car now since I am going abroad and if you ask me what I will buy after I come back to INDIA - I can COMMIT.. ITS ONLY ANOTHER FIAT..NOTHING ELSE.. PROBABLY THE TJET.

Last edited by Sathya_sc : 30th September 2010 at 18:35.
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Old 30th September 2010, 20:12   #435
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saw a linea T-jet (it was golden color) at Hauz Khas, today drove past me. I was in my car so cannot get a pic and it was fast! May be going to the showroom nearby, will check out soon.

Any idea how a xylo would compare to Linea...i am so confused between MJD and t-jet.
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