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Old 7th September 2010, 16:48   #91
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Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
yzfrj,

Your logic is impeccable except when you come to park your car at MY place, inconveniencing my life. But life's not rosy.

So - I completely disagree with you.

I know it sounds gross, but your arguments sound awesome till you're at the recieving end of them.


I think I understand.
Anyway I park my car on the street. The place where I stay now road is wide enough for a lorry and 5 ft space is there on either side of the road.
It is also a dead-end street and there are not many houses, cars, bikes going through the street.

I've seen places where parking is simply impossible but still people park there.
My "cribbing" as this -> aby gentleman put it, is very simple.

Making a law in our country is easy, enforcing them is not.
We are not in America, UK or Japan we are in India.

For me its really difficult to leave my home town and work in an Alien land.
But the so called know it all ego maniacs (yes even on the forum) deems it fit to tell me what to do. This so called know it all does't even know what I'm in. I'm only saying to be a bit compasionate to the fellow staying next door, not love him. Live and let live.

Will the law make any difference ?
I don't think so.

It will be like all the other laws out there.
Some can be bent and some can be broken (Yes The Matrix...! )

Which one I leave it up to you (err.. and the cops in the area.)
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Old 7th September 2010, 21:17   #92
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This "law" in Mizoram is a classic example of "good" intention and "poor" research. I agree to a many who have commented that implemention is the biggest problem in India; but more than that, the law should have been more fundamental in nature - while residential properties are built, there should be a law enforcing mandatory car parking provision, within the residential area and not on public space, if the owner intends to buy car(s) or have tenents with car(s). I know, there is a law for co-operative apartments and builder apartments, but this should extend to all residential properties.
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Old 8th September 2010, 10:32   #93
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Originally Posted by Gooney View Post
This "law" in Mizoram is a classic example of "good" intention and "poor" research. I agree to a many who have commented that implemention is the biggest problem in India; but more than that, the law should have been more fundamental in nature - while residential properties are built, there should be a law enforcing mandatory car parking provision, within the residential area and not on public space, if the owner intends to buy car(s) or have tenents with car(s). I know, there is a law for co-operative apartments and builder apartments, but this should extend to all residential properties.
Delhi has started by insisting on parking space in new construction. But all good laws and intentions would come to naught if there is no public transport to augment private vehicles.

As far as Hong Kong and London are concerned, the situation there in past, was same as in Indian Metros today. They faced the same problems in past. The only saving grace is the public transport system, which gives you a better alternative to congested stop-and-go traffic in the CBD.

Take the case of Delhi, what good is a metro if
- It is not operational at night
- There are few feeder services to and from the stations
- The service is deficient in most of the city

Do you expect me to go to a party in Metro and return in cab at night? I would rather face the problems of driving to the party, than the hassles and cost of a cab at night, and if I have a driver, I would not even consider public transport until and unless there was a compelling financial downside to it.
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Old 8th September 2010, 22:03   #94
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@srishiva: No you are missing the point. I am essentially saying that if the Mizoram law is implemented as it is intended, one side benefit will be that the congestion even in residential areas (like seen in south delhi) will reduce.

but because in India, laws are made for making & not implementing, its a pie in sky wish.

My real wish is for a city center congestion tax!

Last edited by phamilyman : 8th September 2010 at 22:05.
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Old 9th September 2010, 19:46   #95
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Originally Posted by Gooney View Post
This "law" in Mizoram is a classic example of "good" intention and "poor" research. I agree to a many who have commented that implemention is the biggest problem in India; but more than that, the law should have been more fundamental in nature - while residential properties are built, there should be a law enforcing mandatory car parking provision, within the residential area and not on public space, if the owner intends to buy car(s) or have tenents with car(s). I know, there is a law for co-operative apartments and builder apartments, but this should extend to all residential properties.
I strongly second "Gooney"'s thoughts. After living in Bangalore for 7 years, I understand the need for such a law. If such a small state like Mizoram can do it why not Karnataka which is supposed to be an innovator and role model in many other cases and causes.

Last edited by AstonMartin : 9th September 2010 at 19:59.
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Old 16th September 2010, 20:01   #96
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Hi

Resurrected some of my photos taken in 2005, in Mizoram. They should explain why of the issue.
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Old 17th September 2010, 00:54   #97
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Thia is the most absurd law in the history of making laws. Who is the government to decide who should or should not own cars? They have NO RIGHT to make that decision. If a person wants to buy a car let him/her do it as long as they can afford it. As for parking, when half the cars are parked on public roads, its ok. Some one said public roads are not for parking. Hello, then why is it called public? Get a few buddies, buy the road and call it private! Its a useless law and god forbid, it should not be implemented (I am sure it will not get passed). We all crib at cars being parked on road side. We are country of more than 1 billion people of which 1 in 500 or so own cars. Put a cap on population growth and then start limiting car ownership. Thats top most priority.
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Old 17th September 2010, 02:06   #98
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Some one said public roads are not for parking. Hello, then why is it called public?
Public roads are meant to get people and vehicles from point a to point b. Not to park and block vehicular movement. That said, more than home residents, people who build small shops in front of their homes are not building enough basement parking spots.

As responsible citizens what we can do is not go to shops where there is no parking. If parking in front of a store blocks smooth flow of traffic, do not go to that store. No matter how cheap the products are. I once met a senior person from Food world who was complaining about govt wanting to widen the road. I asked him how many parking spots they have on an average per store. He was offended and said, Govt should take care of it. Excuse me - when you decided to lease a building (in what used to be a residential area), did not insist on basement parking for greed of store space, why should Govt fix your problem? Sometimes I feel, we get the govt. we deserve.
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Old 17th September 2010, 10:23   #99
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Originally Posted by rjalihal View Post
Thia is the most absurd law in the history of making laws. Who is the government to decide who should or should not own cars? They have NO RIGHT to make that decision.
The Government is who you have authorised to make your life safe. The Government is who discourages thieves, cheats and murderers; who should have all the right to carry out their profession; because it is for the good of the majority.

Actually the proposed law only restricts you if you do not have the infrastructure to maintain a vehicle. You may not be willing to pay for all the aspects of the ownership, but then it is your shortcoming and the public at large should not be penalised for that. Cost of parking is a part and parcel of vehicle ownership. So is safe driving. Would you encourage reckless driving, just because some one wants to?

We have to take a rational view of the situation, and not be swayed by personal conveniences.

Personal vehicle has evolved from being a rich man's recreation, to a transportation requirement. Those who do not have a vehicle still have to pay for reduced road space, congested traffic and a lot of pollution. Untill and unless you desire a perenial traffic jam the number of vehicles has to be controlled along with introduction of efficient and affordable public transport system. As parking on the roads, both residential as well as commercial reduces the usable road space, the first step in decongesting roads is to ensure adequate parking space exists before adding more vehicles to the system.
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Old 17th September 2010, 10:42   #100
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Resurrected some of my photos taken in 2005, in Mizoram. They should explain why of the issue.
It really really explains why such law is required. With more and more people moving to urban areas, it is only expected to get worse.

Btw, what were you doing clicking such snaps? Seems you gauged the problem way back in 2005.
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Old 17th September 2010, 16:35   #101
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@ Aroy: The government is OBLIGATED to provide such necessities. But living in a democracy, I sincerely feel that the consumer demand should not be directed by government decision. Sure, the overall plan of no garage no car sounds like they want to do something and is a good initiative. Its like in Singapore where people have to obtain a COE before buying a car. But in a country where we have 'not so good' public transport and relatively expensive taxis, people have little or no choce but to go for individual modes of transport.
So what I am trying to say is that, if the government wants to limit car ownership, there are more effective ways of doing it. Increase tax for instance. That is justified. But this 'no garage, no car' rule is not the best one to limit ownership. Even in western countries one will find cars parked on road sides. Of course they have wider roads. There is no point complaining that our roads are narrow. If only the concerned authorities realize this and going forward they have better planning by taking all this into account.
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Old 17th September 2010, 17:29   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjalihal View Post
@ Aroy: The government is OBLIGATED to provide such necessities. But living in a democracy, I sincerely feel that the consumer demand should not be directed by government decision. Sure, the overall plan of no garage no car sounds like they want to do something and is a good initiative. Its like in Singapore where people have to obtain a COE before buying a car. But in a country where we have 'not so good' public transport and relatively expensive taxis, people have little or no choce but to go for individual modes of transport..
Excuse me... since when did govt. get OBLIGATED to provide everyone a parking spot. I thought car in India is still a luxury for 80% of the population. So Govt. is obligated to take care of them.

Sorry the argument is as hollow as it gets. Your argument is analogous to someone buying a piece of furniture which will not fit inside his house and then putting it on the road telling the Govt has obligation to provide the space.

As regards implementation, unlike other laws this one is easier to do. Possibly the letter of the Mizoram law is not exactly needed but if you think rationally it can be achieved through much easier means.

All they need to do is make all residential areas no parking zone between 10 pm to morning and give the local beat constables power to lock the wheels of cars which are parked on the roads in the night. Yes someone might get away bribing the thulla, but ultimately it will add to his/her cost of owning the car. Similarly install meters in commercial areas which penalize long (> 5hr) parking. With some arrangements for visitors coming to city from outside in cars (like temporary tickets at a cost) , this can be implemented without the law itself.

In short make parking on road a really expensive affair. It will have multiple benefits of getting much needed revenue to cash starved municipalities as well as reducing the rate at which cars are being added to an already clogged roads.

IMO buying a car without provisioning for parking is irresponsible as you are expecting others to take care of it.

Last edited by aby : 17th September 2010 at 17:32.
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Old 17th September 2010, 18:17   #103
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Originally Posted by aby View Post
getting much needed revenue to cash starved municipalities as well as reducing the rate at which cars are being added to an already clogged roads.
Since you are blaming everyone else but the "Government"
Kindly be advised its not the common man who made the "cash starves municipalities" its the same Government.

The sad part is, its the common man who voted and elected the goons who "rule" us.

Instead of preventing illegal constructions/encroachments and not to forget idiotic and in some cases "cave man" style planning, Slapping on a new "no parking" law is utter stupidity and at best can be described a "quick and cheap fix"

Its sad you are not trying to see the entire picture and just cheering for years and even decades of stupidity by some morons (read : the average politician) who has not even seen the gate of a school.

Quote:
IMO buying a car without provisioning for parking is irresponsible as you are expecting others to take care of it.
Its even more sad that you still believe its the "citizen's" responsibility to provide the basic infrastructure.
We vote and elect the so called "leaders" and pay income tax, road tax and what not tax so that the "Government" will provide the basic infrastructure.

Badly planned residential areas, roads, city centers, streets, roads.
Who do you think payed for it ?
Who do you think is responsible for this mess ?

You would still like to cheer ?
Please go ahead then.
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Old 17th September 2010, 22:59   #104
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Let me try to explain a couple of things here. I hail from a middle class family and married and have a 4 year old son. I have a 2 wheeler to commute. There are instances when I have to go out for reasons like weddings, birthdays etc. By the time these ceremonies end it will be late in the night. Fortunately I have a bike and can manage to get home safe with my family. Here are my questions.
1) During rainy season, I think i will take public transportation to these social gatherings as my family will get wet if i use my bike, but does anybody here on this forum (especially people against parking on the road) guarantee my family's safety? coz there is absolutely no buses plying to the place where I live. Now who's responsibility is it to provide public transportation?
2) lets say I took my bike for these kind of ceremonies thinking there won't be any public transportation, it starts raining, do you expect me to get my family wet and get sick? or stand under a tree to avoid getting wet and get struck by a lightning or get mugged or something?

These are just 2 instances what I gave you, I have a huge list like this. Now all those people who are against parking on the road, haven't you guys parked on roads until now or Do you guys have garages built everywhere you take your car?
If government can't assure me and other citizens of their safety and if they can't provide adequate public transport, then it has not right to ban people from parking their cars on street.
Thank god I'm an INDIAN CITIZEN and not a Talibani or born in a Communist country!

P.S - Considering the two reasons and many more I have bought a car just for the safety of my FAMILY. and yes I park on the street and make sure it doesn't inconvenience others.

Cheers!
-Z
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Old 18th September 2010, 09:07   #105
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This is a must have for city like pune. There should also be a rule not to have any shop/office/ anything apart from parking at the ground floor / Road level in dense city area where FSI is above 2.

Else people will take parking rent it / use for business & cars/bikes will be still outside.
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