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Old 10th September 2010, 23:28   #16
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I totally agree on Fiat having no 'differentiation' from Tata products. Fiat have to plonk in more powerful engines so the average customer feels good about spending the extra money on a Fiat product.

I disagree on selling the Vista to the taxi market. A taxi image to the Vista will do more harm than anything else. The taxi market will buy the Indica anyway, so why give them the Vista.
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Old 10th September 2010, 23:35   #17
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Great analysis Sid! Most of us have at least thought of some of this at some point in time, but you have organized all your thoughts and put it across very ably. I wish Tata-Fiat are reading this. Maybe the Mods or a member with Tata links can send this to Tata-Fiat? Being a huge Tata fanboy (not just their cars, but the group as a whole), it pains me to see some of the utter nonsense that they try, especially at Tata Motors and Tata Indicom
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Old 11th September 2010, 20:49   #18
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Default My opinion about FIAT

In 1998 when FIAT Uno was launched absolutely there was no Advt. They assumed that Indian customer buys FIATs with closed eyes.
Then good selling model Uno (though very costly at that time Rs.4.5 L)suddenly discontinued and introduced Palio/Sieana with more ads of Sachin. But I feel that, in 2001 FIAT introduced so advanced car with high maintainance cost as compared to maruti/tata/Hyundai. Moreover FIAT dealers were totally unresponsive.
Then from 2001 to 2009 just one varient of Palio/petra was introduced. Whereas in other brands minimum 4-5 budget options were available. Somehow FIAT was never tried his best in holding the market base in India. Meanwhile all other competitors went ahead with all skills/opportunities and grabbed the market. Major giant like FIAT(with PAL) who was having almost 50% share in India is having less than 1% of market share.
Now they have to be proactive with lot of models introducing in every year, renewal of existing models, , keeping cost minimum (Here I'l like to mention cars of the same segment who runs on FIAT diesel engine like swift/Indica are at least cheaper by 40-60k as compared to Punto), Keepng spares cost minimum with short time for waiting, lot of Advt. on TV, magazins, news papers and Hordings in the City and so on.

Most Imp: Treating every FIAT customer as a ambassador of mouth publicity

Only hope is they are seemed to be on nice track. Let us wait n watch and do whatever all FIAT fans can do.
Requets to all FIAT fans: Instead of just critisizing on various forums, may be a little bit of efforts by giving genuine feedback from our side (and of course buying FIAT cars) will definately help them..

My Dream: FIAT will have 25% market share in India by 2015 and 50% by 2020. It will be amazing to see every alternate car as Palio/Punto/Linea/Bravo/Uno/Panda and all new models

Last edited by Fiat&Me : 11th September 2010 at 20:52.
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Old 11th September 2010, 20:53   #19
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I don't know if it is the right thread to ask, so excuse me,

Do the Tata/Fiat SVC's have dedicated ramp & a set of mechanics exclusively for Fiat? What about the spares? Does the same counter deal with both the brands?
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Old 12th September 2010, 04:04   #20
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Was just looking up engines on wikipedia..turns out the 1.6 multijet has a torque output of 300nm at 1500 rpm...wow! Why isn't that engine in india yet? That would be the new torque king here. The not so discerning driver would be bowled over by that kind of torque. I mean, how many people look at 0-100 times or power-torque graphs or rev the engine to its redline? Most people would just do a test drive maybe rev the engine to 3000, love the torque and buy the car.

Or a slightly off-topic note, why doesn't fiat (and any other manufacturer with a 1.2 petrol) stick a turbo charger on their 1.2 and make a tjet out of it? Same fuel economy, excise cuts, cheaper to manufacture, and a whole LOT more power...

Uhoh..i might have double or triple posted. This site doesn't work well with opera mini on my mobile phone at all..

Note from Team-BHP Support Staff : Please use the "edit" function instead of creating back-to-back posts within a short time. Thanks.

Last edited by FlyingSpur : 12th September 2010 at 08:50.
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Old 12th September 2010, 09:35   #21
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Sheel, why do you ask ?
Quote:
Sheel : Do the Tata/Fiat SVC's have dedicated ramp & a set of mechanics exclusively for Fiat? What about the spares? Does the same counter deal with both the brands?
Spares seem to be managed through the same stores. I have only seen Prerana Hosur Road, and I think they have a few dedicated service bays for Fiat vehicles. Though the equipment would be the same. (except dedicated stuff like scanners etc)
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Old 12th September 2010, 09:43   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by condor View Post
Sheel, why do you ask ? Spares seem to be managed through the same stores. I have only seen Prerana Hosur Road, and I think they have a few dedicated service bays for Fiat vehicles. Though the equipment would be the same. (except dedicated stuff like scanners etc)
I ask this, because we have 1.4 petrol too doing duty, maybe the engine & its functioning might be the same and the same mechanic might be able to do a good job, but what about electricals or other mechanical bits which will be completely different from that of a Tata car,
is the same mechanic sent for training at Fiat?would he cope up with the pressure of handling so many cars and that of Fiat with Tata's svc mgr breathing down his neck?
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Old 12th September 2010, 09:53   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subbarao View Post

What i observed all these days are they are very much worried about scoring highest points, after serving the satisfied work, they request me to rate them highest possible score on feed back calls form fiat, 15minutes back i got a call from fiat international the person at other end speaking in italian style english, saying they need feedback on product.

Is the FIAT thinking seriously on After SS?! Hope so..
That is good service and feedback loop should keep dealers and service centers in check.

Fiat needs to keep doing it consistently to remove perception of poor service.
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Old 12th September 2010, 10:12   #24
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Great writeup sid.
Being a Punto 1.4 owner myself, it saddens me to see it failing, what could be a stellar offering after some tweaking.

Here's what I think FIAT must do:

1) TRAIN your salespersons. For all I know, they don't know the diff between torque and acceleration.
2) Highlight unique features:
- blue and me was never in the picture when the salesman was elaborating on the features during the test drive
- I didn't know that Punto had a rear A/C vent till much later
- Even at 170kmph, the car is stable!
3) Upgrade the interiors. Thankfully I've not experienced any parts falling of :touchwood:
4) Better fit and finish - the paint on door handles has already started chipping off.
5) Re-position the brand to appeal to the youth
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Old 12th September 2010, 12:52   #25
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Thats one of the best analysis that I have read about the Fiat Tata JV. SID you should have been their product consultant man you have just hit the Perfect bulls eye.

Tata Fiat if you are ever reading threads at TeamBhp - then this thread should be your bible for Car variants across the JV. Hope some one is listening and implements your suggestions SID.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheel View Post
I don't know if it is the right thread to ask, so excuse me,

Do the Tata/Fiat SVC's have dedicated ramp & a set of mechanics exclusively for Fiat? What about the spares? Does the same counter deal with both the brands?
To give answer to your question, Yes - Fiat have dedicated Service Advisors for their cars. I take my car to Balaji Motors thane and there is one SA who is specifically for Fiat cars. To tell you I am very much happy with the service of this person. He knows his cars and is ready to help wherever possible. I have till date not faced any issues with him - touch wood

Regards,
Kailash

Last edited by kailashnj : 12th September 2010 at 12:53.
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Old 12th September 2010, 13:26   #26
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Quote:
Sheel : .. with Tata's svc mgr breathing down his neck?
I am not sure either - will ask my SA next time I meet him. Even if the SA is different, the works manager and the management looking after the cars are the same. So there should not be such differentiation and hence pressure.

Some mechanics may get specialized training on Fiat specific parts.

Last edited by condor : 12th September 2010 at 13:28.
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Old 12th September 2010, 14:51   #27
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The main problem in Fiat cars of present is their lack of performance. Can't believe Fiat would be questioned on performance in Inda especially after cars like 1.6 GTX but that is the truth of the moment. The engines too are reasonably modern but the main culprit is the old gearbox. Fiat, to minimise costs reworked the gearbox of the previous generation Palio and it shows. The shifts are not slick, ratios are distorted but the fuel consumption is reasonable and hence accepted by the minority in the market. The need of the hour disaster management for Fiat India is to plonk the european gearbox at not too much hike in prices, thereby making their products more competitve.
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Old 13th September 2010, 11:28   #28
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Last weekend FIAT/TATA ushered all the three cars in our complex ( Linea, Punto, MANZA). I sat in all three cars observed very closely, found that its silly for FIAT to sell car next to manza. Manza make so much sense, great space, better interiors, same engine... and all at lower price. While both L and P have poorest interiors, cramped and are claustrophobic. There are very less people who would care for 'thud' and marginally better ride and handling.
I asked some guys who were observing both the car and almost everybody was interested in Manza.
I think JV wont make sense if Linea is to be sold next to manza.It just not done. They have overlapping products, and tata has better positioning, better brand name (better consumer experience).JV Does not make sense at all.

Last edited by Ajay_J : 13th September 2010 at 11:29.
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Old 13th September 2010, 13:50   #29
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I recall an article about an electronics retailer in the US which flogged Cheap VFM TV's mostly. It used to showcase some pretty big name high end TV's with no intention of selling them ,at outrageous prices. The objective was to help people rationalize their purchase of the cheaper TV's ( people would think - this is so much more of a sensible purchase than the other TV)

I feel Fiat cars are doing the same thing sitting in tata showrooms
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Old 13th September 2010, 14:31   #30
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I believe FIAT should start targeting small cities as well. There is a hidden booming market there as well.
The way I see the sale of SX-4, ANHC etc. in a small city of Ranchi, I think given a better choice people can buy them.

Over there people still have the same old perception about pathetic A.S.S and parts issue with fiat and it is still one rare breed on road. My friend has a 1.6 stile still parked in garage for a month waiting for parts after a small accident.
And guess what, the true value offered him 70k for 2007 stile lol!.

Maruti, on the other hand, gave a comfortable feel to their customers. I believe once the small city customers gets geared up then it should be easier to get the metro customers.

One more thing is FIAT is loosing the opportunity of long waiting period by maruti. If they mimic the service quality of maruti and gain confidence of customers, then the waiting period of maruti these days can bring fortune to bleeding fiat.
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