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Old 18th October 2011, 15:44   #1066
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

The divergence of views in the last few comments proves that looks are purely subjective. I find the Merlin dashboard in the pic a lot better looking than the XUV dash which looks garish & cheap, IMO.
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Old 18th October 2011, 16:07   #1067
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Per an insider, the cars are ready and done and final touches on the launch are being decided - Diwali being the target (either before, after, or during). The engine specs have been tweaked a bit. Roof integrated A/C, freed up headroom all the way back. The backside apparently looks really neat. Option of side facing or front facing third row. Price range 13-15 Lacs.
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Old 18th October 2011, 16:38   #1068
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shortbread
As far as the Merlin is concerned, these 'half baked expert' comments predicting doom and other nonsense based on a single dashboards image from a Merlin prototype are immature to say the least. One doesn't know:
[*]What the cars features are[*]How it drives[*]What the bloody pricing is[*]How it really looks in metalThe messy front end and appalling interior colours did not stop the XUV from it initial bookings craze, did it??!! These aren't the main factors that decide a vehicles success.

While the naysayers will want to shout out obscenities at the Merlin come what may, I hope rest of the sensible folk prevailing in this thread wait till the car comes out!!
You starting a fight? What's with the "Half baked expert" and senseless (by implication) comments?

We don't know what the car's features are, true.
We do know from some insiders that it rides far better than the current Safari at the marginal cost of plushness in a straight line, which is acceptable and maybe even desirable.
We can infer what the pricing will be from the reports of insiders or former insiders that Tata plans to price the Merlin in the GX and VX range of the current Safari, and their vehement statements that the Aria is better than and does not compete with the XUV
We do have pictures of how it looks in the metal, though we don't know if there will be additional bling.

The single dashboard image shows a staid, sensible and functional design except that the stereo still apparently slots in at the bottom of the central console, in front of the gear stick. I find it okay, and I dislike the XUV for all it's jazz. I even mentioned in several posts that we should remember that the XUV's pricing is temporary. However the messy front end and appalling interior colours of some models didn't stop the XUV from its initial bookings craze because of the pricing. People get it wrong all the time, but depressingly, as much as I want Tata to pull a rabbit of the hat with the Merlin's pricing, I don't think they will. And THAT's the clincher. There will still be the few Safari fans including maybe me still willing to buy the Merlin, but the price can kill it, and from all indications it appears that it will.
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Old 18th October 2011, 16:46   #1069
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Per an insider, the cars are ready and done and final touches on the launch are being decided - Diwali being the target (either before, after, or during). The engine specs have been tweaked a bit. Roof integrated A/C, freed up headroom all the way back. The backside apparently looks really neat. Option of side facing or front facing third row. Price range 13-15 Lacs.
Even Aria starts from 11.xxL and 4x4 top line has a price tag of 15.xx Lakhs. Howcome TATA can think of pricing old Safari refresh at 13-15L
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Old 18th October 2011, 16:47   #1070
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Per an insider, the cars are ready and done and final touches on the launch are being decided - Diwali being the target (either before, after, or during). The engine specs have been tweaked a bit. Roof integrated A/C, freed up headroom all the way back. The backside apparently looks really neat. Option of side facing or front facing third row. Price range 13-15 Lacs.
Everything looks fine except price! Even loyal TATA customer will hesitate to spend that much on Merlin if the product looks somewhere close to those spy pictures. As someone mentioned Merlin looks great with that cover on.

Sad to see that TATA is not learning the importance of correct pricing even after XUV launch, initial hype and public reaction.
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Old 18th October 2011, 17:13   #1071
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Price range 13-15 Lacs.
It might be difficult to sell a Merlin for this price even if they throw in a Safari for free! Okay, I am exaggerating. But seriously, I hope they have learnt from the Aria pricing. I doubt they will price it so high.
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Old 18th October 2011, 18:36   #1072
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

We can debate endless whether Aria or Merlin is competition for XUV, but bottom line is that Merlin if priced at or above XUV prices, becomes competition for the XUV. It doesn't matter which model is targeted at which model. The XUV will make a grand meal of every product in Tata's stable, priced over 10 lakhs, whether you call it, Aria, Safari, Merlin, Gremlin or whatever..


@shortbread:

On your next trip to India please count the number of yellow board Scorpios you see? The top end of the yellow board MUV market is owned by Toyota. Bottom end by Xylo and mid end by Tavera. The recent sales of 4000 Scorpios a month is not due to Taxi sales. This is purely speculation from your end. Although I own a scorpio, I am not a huge fan of it and never hesitate to criticism it's flaws, but it is wrong to assume that 4000 Scorpio sell a month due to demand from Taxis.

How many yellow board Scorpios do you guys see on a regular basis, as compared to Innovas, Taveras and most recetly xylos..

Scorpio Sells, because, the SLE at about 8 Lakhs on the road with ABS and usual creature comforts is the most VFM SUV one can buy in India these days.

@safari_lover:

Obituaries are being written for Merlin just based on pricing of the Safari compared to the XUV. Even of the XUV prices are raised by a lakh for each model, it will still make more sense than the Safari for majority of users, unless you require a proper 4x4 with T-case and all. About the Aria, the less said the better as I have seen only two vehicles between three Chennai, Coimbatore, Cochin and all national highways that connect these cities.
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Old 18th October 2011, 18:59   #1073
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

After the launch of the XUV 5oo the market has become aware as to what can be bought at what price point. Now no company can afford to overprice their products without proper quality and equippment. So Tata better equipp their vehicles properly, make them handle better and then finally price them properly so that they can retain or improve their market share. Its high time car manufacturers and sellers in India start making corrections both in their products and prices.
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Old 18th October 2011, 19:30   #1074
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
Scorpio Sells, because, the SLE at about 8 Lakhs on the road with ABS and usual creature comforts is the most VFM SUV one can buy in India these days.
That is right, IT IS Scorpio which has eaten away Safari's sales. It might be a bitter pill to swallow but Safari (Merlin) has to return the favor by launching the upgraded version soon and pricing it competitively w.r.t. Scorpio, while offering better comfort levels and features. That is there ONLY chance. Don't expect charity from customers. After all these cars are not humans :-).
At present, due to extremely competitive pricing of XUV500, prospective Scorpio customers are in dilemma. Merlin has to cash on that. Come on. Be fast.

Last edited by ajay0612 : 18th October 2011 at 19:32.
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Old 18th October 2011, 20:14   #1075
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
We can debate endless whether Aria or Merlin is competition for XUV, but bottom line is that Merlin if priced at or above XUV prices, becomes competition for the XUV. It doesn't matter which model is targeted at which model. The XUV will make a grand meal of every product in Tata's stable, priced over 10 lakhs, whether you call it, Aria, Safari, Merlin, Gremlin or whatever..
That should also apply to the Scorpio as some of its variants are also priced above 10L.

Quote:

Even of the XUV prices are raised by a lakh for each model, it will still make more sense than the Safari for majority of users, unless you require a proper 4x4 with T-case and all.
I am not sure if many agree with you when you say 1 Lakh price increase is acceptable.

Anyways, it again boils down to my basic point. We are all taking too many things for granted. Let the darned thing get launched first; let the specs and price be made public. Then we can all go and compare it with everything from Bolero to Fortuner and prove how it isn't VFM

Last edited by safari_lover : 18th October 2011 at 20:19.
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Old 18th October 2011, 20:42   #1076
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post


Scorpio Sells, because, the SLE at about 8 Lakhs on the road with ABS and usual creature comforts is the most VFM SUV one can buy in India these days.
Agree with you on everything just one correction though , the Scorpio SLE is for 9.32 lakhs ex showroom and not for 8 lakh on road.
It still is the most VFM product in the under 10 lakhs suv market.
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Old 18th October 2011, 20:48   #1077
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
Price range 13-15 Lacs.
Well priced!!! It would sell, provided they give an Aria free with Merlin. Anyway they have so many Aria's gathering dust.
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Old 18th October 2011, 21:36   #1078
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by safari_lover View Post
That should also apply to the Scorpio as some of its variants are also priced above 10L.
The XUV will definitely eat into the sales of the higher end scorpios as well. I think the Scorpio VLX will be discontinued as it doesn't make sense to get the VLX.

Quote:
Originally Posted by safari_lover View Post
I am not sure if many agree with you when you say 1 Lakh price increase is acceptable.
Against a merlin that costs between 13 to 15 lakhs, I think a 1 lakh increase in each variant of the XUV500 will be very much acceptable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by safari_lover View Post
Anyways, it again boils down to my basic point. We are all taking too many things for granted.
If you notice, my team bhp handle is not Scorpio Lover or Fortuner Lover, so it helps to see the pros and cons of various models objectively, and I can tell with certainty that if they price the Merlin above the XUV500, it will be a bigger hit than the Aria...
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Old 18th October 2011, 21:39   #1079
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patil View Post
After the launch of the XUV 5oo the market has become aware as to what can be bought at what price point. Now no company can afford to overprice their products without proper quality and equippment. So Tata better equipp their vehicles properly, make them handle better and then finally price them properly so that they can retain or improve their market share. Its high time car manufacturers and sellers in India start making corrections both in their products and prices.
I partially agree with you.
My difference in view - We Indians [at least the gross majority] wants a TATA and M&M vehicle to be priced lower, but the same or lower spec'd Japanese/European brands can charge more. We people buy them saying reliability, stability, handling, etc ... Though it may be true, there have been n-number of stable Indian branded vehicles running along for years together documented in the same TBHP forums. Its just a western influence we are into and we are losing our patience and tolerance on our native brands by doing this.

Further more, I feel this thread better be locked OR the last 2 or 3 page of discussions should just be deleted as we started discussing more on XUV rather than the Merlin spy. Its almost looking like a comparison b/w a "non-existing" XUV and "due to be released" Merlin. When I say "non existing" XUV, I mean "on-road".

Prem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4x4addict View Post
...
Against a merlin that costs between 13 to 15 lakhs, I think a 1 lakh increase in each variant of the XUV500 will be very much acceptable...
This is exactly what I meant in my previous post - we dont know if the TML knows about the Merlin pricing. But, looks like few in TBHP already know for sure
I believe, this is what is "taking for granted" meant by safari_lover and I dont see anything "objective" here as well !

Prem.

Last edited by Amartya : 19th October 2011 at 08:11. Reason: Kindly edit the original post if posting again within 20 mins.
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Old 18th October 2011, 21:46   #1080
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Default re: Tata Merlin - Safari replacement? *UPDATE* Uncovered Pics on Pg 90

Quote:
Originally Posted by kaviprem View Post

Further more, I feel this thread better be locked OR the last 2 or 3 page of discussions should just be deleted as we started discussing more on XUV rather than the Merlin spy. Its almost looking like a comparison b/w a "non-existing" XUV and "due to be released" Merlin. When I say "non existing" XUV, I mean "on-road".

Prem.
+1
It is better to lock the thread until the vehicle is launched or MODS request BHPians to refrain from posting/comparing Merlin with other vehicles.
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