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Old 15th December 2010, 09:32   #16
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

4x4 is preferred only by enthusiasts or people who really need/ use it.

Most urban SUV owners simply like the street presence, people carrying capacity and huge luggage space that an SUV affords them. There is a psychological comfort in "perceived" safety too.

With 4x4 commanding a higher price+ the "build on order" policy+ waiting period tend to turn potential buyers off.

In our country we dont encounter things like snow and ice on the roads on a regular basis except in a few places, so the sheer usage of 4x4 is typically much less.

Even abroad for that matter there are statistics to prove that perhaps as many as 80-90% of Range Rover owners have never so much as taken their vehicles off the normal tarmac! It is not much different in India though of course the normal road conditions here are pretty close to off road conditions in some places!

Last edited by shankar.balan : 15th December 2010 at 09:33.
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Old 15th December 2010, 09:39   #17
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

The reason why SUV's with 4X2's sell is here
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...uv-debate.html (Should you buy an SUV? The definitive Sedan vs SUV debate)

When bhpians can succumb to a SUV fantasy (won't add much here) why not the aam-junta and then not so aam junta?

^^A while ago was discussing a SUV choice of a newly elected politico, he has a Scorpio VLX, have suggested him a Fortuner.
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Old 15th December 2010, 09:59   #18
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

What is the difference in FE between 4x2 vs 4x4 ?
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Old 15th December 2010, 10:35   #19
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

my old 1988 soft top 970cc gypsy which I had in 1997-2000, used to give me around 8-9 average in normal city driving and highways. it had no ac. using it in 4x4 with 4L on the beach etc in madras many years ago I clocked the FE at 4-5kmpl

then my more recent (1995 or 1997 model) 970CC hard top standard gypsy which I had in 2004-2005 used to give me around 8-9 on highways in 4x2 mode. with AC it used to give 6-7 max on highways.

in 4x4 mode using 4L while fiddling about in the swampy areas and during off roading, it used to drop to 4-5kmpl or so (obviously without AC etc)

In my observation the MM540's MM550's used to drop in FE from an average of 9kmpl (hill driving) to about 6-7 while using 4x4 with 4L inside some really bad parts of the estate we lived on in those days.

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What is the difference in FE between 4x2 vs 4x4 ?

Last edited by shankar.balan : 15th December 2010 at 10:36.
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Old 15th December 2010, 10:43   #20
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

Hi
Why not to choose a four wheel drive
1. Extra expense
2. Limited use for people who are not into off roading
3. Many of four wheel drives available at present in the market are not suited for serious off roading. Even if they do they require serious changes to make it safe before off roading can be attempted.
4. Majority of people who enter this segment require a large vehicle to travel with family rather than off roading.
5. Less agressive promotion by the sales executives.
6. More expensive to maintain.
Cheers.
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Old 15th December 2010, 17:52   #21
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

Quote:
Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
my old 1988 soft top 970cc gypsy which I had in 1997-2000, used to give me around 8-9 average in normal city driving and highways. it had no ac. using it in 4x4 with 4L on the beach etc in madras many years ago I clocked the FE at 4-5kmpl

then my more recent (1995 or 1997 model) 970CC hard top standard gypsy which I had in 2004-2005 used to give me around 8-9 on highways in 4x2 mode. with AC it used to give 6-7 max on highways.

in 4x4 mode using 4L while fiddling about in the swampy areas and during off roading, it used to drop to 4-5kmpl or so (obviously without AC etc)

In my observation the MM540's MM550's used to drop in FE from an average of 9kmpl (hill driving) to about 6-7 while using 4x4 with 4L inside some really bad parts of the estate we lived on in those days.
Thanks & what happens on highway ?? I doubt on highways there is a big diff in FE.
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Old 16th December 2010, 09:46   #22
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

not much - perhaps 2 kmpl gain on account of driving at constant cruising speed in 4th gear (those old gypsies didnt have 5th gear though it was a desperate need on highway which I felt)

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Thanks & what happens on highway ?? I doubt on highways there is a big diff in FE.
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Old 17th December 2010, 20:16   #23
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

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Originally Posted by shankar.balan View Post
With 4x4 commanding a higher price+ the "build on order" policy+ waiting period tend to turn potential buyers off.


I would buy a 4x4 even if it was 1L more than the 4x2, and as I do not like gizmos, I want my 4x4 at the lowest trim level. But that is not possible. I would also like airbags and ABS. My preferred vehicle is just not available.

If the 4x4 was available at lowest trim level, with safety essentials off-the-shelf (or nearly so), I feel there would be a lot more buyers. As an example the Scorpio LX BS-IV is 7.8 in Delhi, add 0.8L for 4x4 and 0.5L for ABS and Airbags, it would be 9.1 against 11 for the VLX with Airbags. If they come up with a 320d CE type of scheme for Scorpio or Safari 4x4 then sales may pick up.

Last edited by bblost : 17th December 2010 at 20:25. Reason: Fixed the quotes. Thanks
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Old 17th December 2010, 20:27   #24
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

Ford India made a smart move by introducing the 4x2 Endeavour and pitted it against Toyota Fortuner which is sold in only one variant/model and that too is full time 4x4.

so people buy ford 4x2 are doing it by choice, where as people buying fortuner are forced to buy 4x4.

for 4x4 offroad fun, Gypsy and MM Jeeps are available so why use your expensive SUVs offroad!

4x4 = moderate + serious offroading!

Sports Utlity Vehicles = sit higher than sedans, drive like a tank and go to the mall!
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Old 17th December 2010, 20:48   #25
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

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Originally Posted by Parm View Post
so people buy ford 4x2 are doing it by choice, where as people buying fortuner are forced to buy 4x4.
If you look at prices the 4x2 is available in two trims - 3L Auto and 2.5L MT while the 4x4 is available only in 3L Auto. The price difference is 2.5L between the two extremes. That may be the reason for 4x2 sales. If it was 0.8L as in Scorpio or Safari, then we could claim it a choice, but now it seems to be economics to me.
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Old 18th December 2010, 13:17   #26
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

Real 4x4 cater only to a hand full of real off roader.s. The bigger market is for the cross over.s for the tourist taxi sector and big families. A Yeti like compact SUV (not a crossover) @ 6-7 lakhs both in 4x2 and 4x4 with modern looks will be a great product i feel. Can'nt understand why Maruthi is not bringing in a Diesel Vitara or a Gypsy ??
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Old 20th December 2010, 07:31   #27
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

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Originally Posted by DRC View Post
I may sound funny, but I would prefer a 4x4 SX4 than an SUV.
.
A 4x4 sx4? Did you mean an AWD SX4? A sedan cannot really off-road. Probably, it can be on some messed up roads like the ones in Kerala but I guess an AWD would do good in these kind of situations.

Imagine an SX4 with a 4x4 features . That 170mm ground clearance wouldn't do any good in that case.
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Old 20th December 2010, 12:21   #28
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

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Originally Posted by cyqed View Post
A 4x4 sx4? Did you mean an AWD SX4? A sedan cannot really off-road. Probably, it can be on some messed up roads like the ones in Kerala but I guess an AWD would do good in these kind of situations.

Imagine an SX4 with a 4x4 features . That 170mm ground clearance wouldn't do any good in that case.
4x4 SX4 is available in Europe. Watch this clip
Suzuki Sx4 4wd Offroad Dirt Track Test 2
you can watch other clips of off-roading.

This would be an ideal vehicle for most of us.
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Old 20th December 2010, 12:35   #29
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

Absolutely true that most of them buy an SUV for the road presence, space and ease of driving over broken roads. Some SUVs are great to drive on tarmac too - they offer excellent comfort for 5 people and their luggage over extended periods of driving. Moreover, there is also the perception of added safety.

With these points in mind while buying an SUV, a 4x4 does not make sense for these buyers, since more than 90% of such SUV owners will never want to take their prized possessions into an off-road terrain and risk any damage to it.

Then there are the serious off-roading enthusiasts who cannot imagine owning a 4x2 SUV. They always go for the rugged ones, the Jeeps, Gypsies and the like.

Nevertheless, there are many 4x2 SUV owners who wish they had gone for an 4x4 after owning the 4x2 SUV for a while.
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Old 20th December 2010, 12:45   #30
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Default Re: Are more people preferring 4x2s these days?

most irritatingly in the case of a 4WD Scorpio (for example) despite it being a "build on order" vehicle - we dont get a choice of trim level. it is only available in VLX form with loads of electronics etc. And most buyers of the VLX trim wont even be bothered about 4WD or anything else!
They may even be travelling at some 80kmph and just for fun they may turn the selector to 4H or 4L with some interesting results!!

Some of the electronics in the VLX I do like - for example the parktronic system. I dont like the voice telling me my seat belt is not on etc though.
I also dont see the need for tyre tronics because I am slightly obsessive about air pressure in my tyres.
I like the Safety features like ABS and Airbags. Ideally they should have EBD as well but they dont.
I also dont appreciate the fact that the 4WD Scorpio seems to be offered only in Black or White?
Who the he** do they think they are to dictate my choice of colour? (Like Henry Ford a 100 odd years ago!)
If a vehicle is a "build on order" vehicle then I should have the flex to buy the colour I want.
Being a build on order vehicle, why cant they allow us to personalize/ customize our own Scorpio and charge accordingly? Imagine the amazing flexibility a consumer could get in this way!

The Mahindra's should take heed of consumers like us, who are serious people with absolutely clear requirement lists.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Aroy View Post

I would buy a 4x4 even if it was 1L more than the 4x2, and as I do not like gizmos, I want my 4x4 at the lowest trim level. But that is not possible. I would also like airbags and ABS. My preferred vehicle is just not available.

If the 4x4 was available at lowest trim level, with safety essentials off-the-shelf (or nearly so), I feel there would be a lot more buyers. As an example the Scorpio LX BS-IV is 7.8 in Delhi, add 0.8L for 4x4 and 0.5L for ABS and Airbags, it would be 9.1 against 11 for the VLX with Airbags. If they come up with a 320d CE type of scheme for Scorpio or Safari 4x4 then sales may pick up.
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