The lovely Premier Padmini S1 (Fiat 1100-D)

[ananthkamath]

Nice car Ram. I think to complete the look you should lose the wheel covers and paint the wheels black with silver outside (like the old Porsches); just my opinion.

The exhaust was the best part about this version (S1). I think it had a 4 into 2 into 1 manifold and downpipe from the factory with a freeflow muffler. Ram protect this manifold & down pipe from rusting away because it isnt available anywhere anymore (although you might get a replica made).

Fiat 1100 engines have been developed to a very high degree during racing in the early years. My mentor used to race a Fiat special (Formula India) and the engine had every conceivable mod done to it that we talk about today as something new (save for electronic stuff). high compression via milled block, head AND domed pistons (yeah, all the three together), W-I-L-D cam, balanced and reshaped combustion chambers, balanced rotating assembly, lightened flywheel (known to shatter so had a min. thickness rule in rule book, yeah, rule books existed in those days), offset bored rockers, lightened pushrods, special valves, swirl ported intake and exhausts, close ratio gearbox, LSD, hell even the water pump was cut down to reduce power wastage. This was topped off with a Weber 40 DCOE carb (the best there is) with pulse manifold and a 4-1 exhaust with zero muffling. It revved to 8000+ and more with drastically shortened crankshaft life!

[Ram]

Dear friends:

May I share with you, a post on a bulletin board at
www.mumbai-central.com/nukkad
That I'd posted on 13th July 2001.

[nukkad] Fiat 1100 Delight - the passing of an icon

* Subject: [nukkad] Fiat 1100 Delight - the passing of an icon
* From: Ram Rao <>
* Date: 13 Jul 2001 01:38:33 -0000
* Organization: Mumbai Central

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Tip of the day: Voice your opinion at
http://www.mumbai-central.com/sawaal/
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The ubiquitous Fiat 1100 Delight(aka Premier President; aka Premier Padmini) graced the Bombay taxi world from 1960 thru 1999. She is not produced anymore. Her diesel engine has been outlawed. The surviving black and yellow Padmini taxis we see in the City today, retrofitted to injest compressed natural gas, are all between two and fifteen years old.

The Fiat Delight was a single model that survived over four decades.
During her four-decade life span, she bore and sustained a small-ticket cottage industry from pavement garages: Koliwada and Saki-Naka to parts fabricators from Patiala to Coimbatore.
Her frugal costs of acquisition, running and maintenance afforded taxi travel to a middle-class Bombay.
Never again will we see such longevity in a model and more importantly such frugality.

Buyers of new taxicabs are experimenting with the dimunitive Daewoo Matiz, Maruti Alto and Fiat Uno.
Does a London, NewYork, Tokyo or Singapore have ugly one-box squarebackers as taxicabs dotting the landscape?

And all of these three happen to be priced higher than the Padmini ever was.
The availability of spares is sparse and the prices hefty in comparison with the humble Padmini.
Not to mention the Padmini’s rugged longevity.
She was so much more car than these micro-hatchbacks will ever be.

She joins the Trams, Czech trolley buses, Victorias, Daimler double-deckers that once graced Bombay
— an icon is passing!!

Ram

[rallystar]

Can any one please post pics of fiats rallying in India.

[Ram]

Originally Posted by ananthkamath

Nice car Ram. I think to complete the look you should lose the wheel covers and paint the wheels black with silver outside (like the old Porsches); just my opinion.

The exhaust was the best part about this version (S1). I think it had a 4 into 2 into 1 manifold and downpipe from the factory with a freeflow muffler. Ram protect this manifold & down pipe from rusting away because it isnt available anywhere anymore (although you might get a replica made).

Fiat 1100 engines have been developed to a very high degree during racing in the early years. My mentor used to race a Fiat special (Formula India) and the engine had every conceivable mod done to it that we talk about today as something new (save for electronic stuff). high compression via milled block, head AND domed pistons (yeah, all the three together), W-I-L-D cam, balanced and reshaped combustion chambers, balanced rotating assembly, lightened flywheel (known to shatter so had a min. thickness rule in rule book, yeah, rule books existed in those days), offset bored rockers, lightened pushrods, special valves, swirl ported intake and exhausts, close ratio gearbox, LSD, hell even the water pump was cut down to reduce power wastage. This was topped off with a Weber 40 DCOE carb (the best there is) with pulse manifold and a 4-1 exhaust with zero muffling. It revved to 8000+ and more with drastically shortened crankshaft life!

Thanks for the compliment, Ananth.
Yes the car does have unusual exhaust plumbing, and catalytic converter but no freeflow muffler. It is a conventional muffler, I think.
The car is meant for unleaded fuel and has a characteristic Hydrogen sulphide odor in the treated exhaust, not to mention the throaty roar.

I remember seeing a Fiat 1100-D with a V6 engine transplanted into it at John garage in Chembur. Don’t know the origin, but could it have been a 2-litre V6
from the 1968 Fiat Dino spider?

[islero]

I wish it were......hope it is.......

[jkdas]

I have one I have one. I used to drive it till we bought the santro back in 2000. The soudn it produces is just gr8. Its coz of its 4-2 exhaust out setup?

[devarshi84]

I had this fiat model( car in the pic not mine).

It is the older Fiat 1100. Mostly people on the car used to mistake it for a mini ambassador.

[Ram]

Originally Posted by devarshi84

[blue Fiat 1100 picture]

I had this fiat model( car in the pic not mine).

It is the older Fiat 1100. Mostly people on the car used to mistake it for a mini ambassador.

Dear Devarshi Fadia:

The blue Fiat picture you have shown is really beautiful.


Three things tell that it is a 1963 model, the last of the round top Fiats before the 1100-D with the wrap-around rear glass.

A. The movable ventilator (colloquially called "cut-glass" in Mumbai) appeared only in 1963 on the round top Fiat 1100.
In 1964 the round-top was replaced by the 1100-Delight (which lasted till the Premier Padmini)

B. Older round-tops (Fiat Millecentos) had a two-level thin spear. Only the 1963 had this fluted straight spear, which continued with the Fiat 1100-Delights.

C. The round turn-signal lamp appeared in 1963 and stayed until the late-Padmini introduced a rectangular lamp.
Earlier round-tops had a horizontal elongated tear-drop shaped turn signal indicator.

Three things tell that it is not an Indian Fiat 1100.

D. It is a left-hand drive.
E. The curved stainless steel protectors under the doorhandles were not standard in India.
F. The bumper overrider and additional tubular guard is original Fiat, but never available in India.

Regards
Ram

[devarshi84]

Originally Posted by ram

Dear Devarshi Fadia:

The blue Fiat picture you have shown is really beautiful.


Three things tell that it is a 1963 model, the last of the round top Fiats before the 1100-D with the wrap-around rear glass.

A. The movable ventilator (colloquially called "cut-glass" in Mumbai) appeared only in 1963 on the round top Fiat 1100.
In 1964 the round-top was replaced by the 1100-Delight (which lasted till the Premier Padmini)

B. Older round-tops (Fiat Millecentos) had a two-level thin spear. Only the 1963 had this fluted straight spear, which continued with the Fiat 1100-Delights.

C. The round turn-signal lamp appeared in 1963 and stayed until the late-Padmini introduced a rectangular lamp.
Earlier round-tops had a horizontal elongated tear-drop shaped turn signal indicator.

Three things tell that it is not an Indian Fiat 1100.

D. It is a left-hand drive.
E. The curved stainless steel protectors under the doorhandles were not standard in India.
F. The bumper overrider and additional tubular guard is original Fiat, but never available in India.

Regards
Ram

Dear Ram Rao You are really Intelligent. I love your information. I sincerely find your information about fiat cars interesting. would like to know more info about fiat from you.

btw if you are trying to prove that the car in the pic is not mine then let me please draw your attention to my post above where I have specifically mentioned that this is not my car.


here is one more pic to show how the older fiat turned in to the pdamini. Look at the very similar rear.



and bsmotoring article on padmini against the siena.

http://www.bsmotoring.com/2000/00feb05_4.htm

[Ram]

Originally Posted by devarshi84

...
love your information. I sincerely find your information about fiat cars interesting. would like to know more info about fiat from you.

here is one more pic to show how the older fiat turned in to the padmini. Look at the very similar rear.
...

Thanks for the compliment Devarshi!

Amazing how you found yet another original Italian 1963 blue Fiat 1100.



Had this car been in India, rust might have necessitated a trip to the tinsmith.
And in trying to rejuvenate the rear-quarter panel they would've lost the original ridge around the bumper (A) (as they have invariably done in India, on Fiats of that vintage)

(B) This blue car still has the original push button dikky-lock which was later found on Fiat-1100Ds but replaced on the Padmini by the twist-handle lock.

Also it has the original Fiat chrome-plated aluminium hubcaps, with a ridge (C) which was never available in India. These original Fiat hubcaps had black paint around the FIAT stamped letters, instead of the maroon-red found in India.

Also these hubcaps were held to the wheel by four spring-steel ears. The hubcap had an internal cone to grip the spring ears and hold tightly to the wheel. These ears continued on, in the Fiat 1100Ds until 1968.

In 1969, the metal wheel was changed. It got a full raised lip and lost the spring ears. Later hubcaps were simple stamped frisbees to be pressed onto the lip.

Two other changes made from 1962 to 1963 were:
(D) replacement of the aluminium capped external dikky hinges with internal hinges, later seen on the Fiat 1100-D. Devarshi, I took the liberty to put them in the picture to illustrate my point.

(E) rectangular reflectors on the tail-light units which were not there on earlier Millecentos.

Interestingly exactly twenty years later, Ford of Europe introduced their jelly-bean shaped Ford Sierra in 1983 to replace the aging Taunus-Cortina. And your picture has a Rangoon-red Ford Sierra in the background.

Ram

[devarshi84]

Originally Posted by ram

Thanks for the compliment Devarshi!

Amazing how you found yet another original Italian 1963 blue Fiat 1100.



Had this car been in India, rust might have necessitated a trip to the tinsmith.
And in trying to rejuvenate the rear-quarter panel they would've lost the original ridge around the bumper (A) (as they have invariably done in India, on Fiats of that vintage)

(B) This blue car still has the original push button dikky-lock which was later found on Fiat-1100Ds but replaced on the Padmini by the twist-handle lock.

Also it has the original Fiat chrome-plated aluminium hubcaps, with a ridge (C) which was never available in India. These original Fiat hubcaps had black paint around the FIAT stamped letters, instead of the maroon-red found in India.

Also these hubcaps were held to the wheel by four spring-steel ears. The hubcap had an internal cone to grip the spring ears and hold tightly to the wheel. These ears continued on, in the Fiat 1100Ds until 1968.

In 1969, the metal wheel was changed. It got a full raised lip and lost the spring ears. Later hubcaps were simple stamped frisbees to be pressed onto the lip.

Two other changes made from 1962 to 1963 were:
(D) replacement of the aluminium capped external dikky hinges with internal hinges, later seen on the Fiat 1100-D. Devarshi, I took the liberty to put them in the picture to illustrate my point.

(E) rectangular reflectors on the tail-light units which were not there on earlier Millecentos.

Interestingly exactly twenty years later, Ford of Europe introduced their jelly-bean shaped Ford Sierra in 1983 to replace the aging Taunus-Cortina. And your picture has a Rangoon-red Ford Sierra in the background.

Ram

WOnders never cease eh!

[Mpower]

Originally Posted by GTO

The best thing about the S1 was its exhaust note.

Guys, dumb question. what is an S1 Fiat and how is it different from the regular ones.

Also didnt the original Fiats have a different taillights (more tapering and less pointy)

[Ram]

Originally Posted by Mpower

Guys, dumb question. what is an S1 Fiat and how is it different from the regular ones.

S1 stands for Step 1.

This Padmini S1 had some modifications over the previous one.

More effective pollution control
The Premier Padmini S1 has a catalytic converter which converts hydrocarbons and nitrogen oxides in the effluent exhaust to carbon dioxide and water. The "cat" requires unleaded petrol, because presence of lead in the petrol poisons the Platinum catalyst, making it ineffective.

By 1995 (the year of my red white and blue Padmini (The lovely Premier Padmini S1 (Fiat 1100-D))) a few petrol pumps in Mumbai already supplied unleaded fuel. By 2000, India phased out leaded petrol entirely.

In the pre-S1 models, the fanbelt driven radiator cooling fan, pilfered 8-9 bhp from the engine output. The fan was also was less effective at low rpms. When Premier Auto's engineers discovered that, they substituted a constant speed electric fan. A thermostat switch turned the fan on and off as needed. Suddenly, voila the engine developed 48 bhp instead of 39!

They also provided an engine-vaccuum dependent feedback-control mechanism to advance or retard the ignition timing.
The result was improved acceleration, accelerator response and fuel economy.

The S1 also got a cross flow radiator with a separate overflow tank.
The Padmini would no longer overheat going up the western ghats ("Bhor" ghat on the old Bombay-Poona road.

A disposable spin-on oil filter replaced the original cleanable tank-filter.

Redesigned exhaust headers and down-pipes improved power and produced a rich engine note, more attractive to auto-buffs.

Premier licensed an entire drivetrain from Nissan of Japan (what was used in their Nissan Sunny).
This included a free-revving 1,172 cc, engine that developed 52 bhp @ 5600 rpm and 79 Newton-metres of torque @4000 rpm.
The Premier 118NE (Nissan-Engine) got this drivetrain.

The same drive train, minus engine also benefited the Padmini S1.
This included a velvety-smooth four speed all-synchromesh gearbox and a robust differential.

All these changes distinguish the Premier Padmini S1, the swan-song generation of the Fiat 1100 in India.

[Mpower]

thanks for that exhuastive explanation ram. Indeed its a seductive exhuast note unmatched by any of today's cars. This is the original Fiat I was refering to. Note the tailights.

[hrag]

Originally Posted by ram

Premier licensed an entire drivetrain from Nissan of Japan (what was used in their Nissan Sunny).
This included a free-revving 1,172 cc, engine that developed 52 bhp @ 5600 rpm and 79 Newton-metres of torque @4000 rpm.
The Premier 118NE (Nissan-Engine) got this drivetrain.

The same drive train, minus engine also benefited the Padmini S1.
This included a velvety-smooth four speed all-synchromesh gearbox and a robust differential.

Hats off to you - a true 1100 D fan!

If I'm not mistaken, only the deluxe models of the S1 range got the NE gearbox (an absolute gem). We have a 1996 Premier Padmini S1 - the least frills model, which has the column mounted gearshift, bench seats front and rear, no A/C. This gearbox is not all-synchromesh.