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Old 18th August 2007, 01:48   #31
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Originally Posted by esteem_lover View Post
Don't follow any trend here. If you feel the M-800 is good enough for you, why don't you try just that ? Just let me know, i will bring a M-1000 to counter you.
First of all I didn't say I would follow the trend.

Secondly If I do bring the 800, it will pumped up to take up more than the M-1000.

BTW isn't yours an esteem John?
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Old 18th August 2007, 02:49   #32
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Originally Posted by flipsyde View Post
will you be kind enough to educate us as to how you suppose this is possible?

the stock engine comes with 106 horses your talking about an increase of 44 horses!!! as rocam said the kind of mods that'l have to go into making such a good increase in power will make the car impossible to use on the street.
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Originally Posted by Ford Rocam View Post
No Akshay its not that easy to make 150 hp N.A in indian 1.5 vtec block unless you intend to do some serious work. it will still be very difficult & car wont be streetable imo. dont expect much in N.A form, from a pony 1.5 single cam block.
Jitu, and flipsyde, I stand by my words. If you give me a reasonable budget, under that of a turbo job, I could get an Indian Vtec to cross 150 hp NA. I'm not going to go around giving things out, or I know a couple of tuners who would be more than happy to beat the crap out of me, but trust me when I say it can be done, and I've seen it being done.
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Old 18th August 2007, 03:39   #33
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Originally Posted by fiery enzyme View Post
Ok that said, It is only a case of following the trend then. OHCs and esteems alike. Any car could take its place then.
Yes fiery, any car with good power developed in it can easily replace the Honda and the esteem.
The 800 is a really good choice for modding given it races in its category, to drag the 800 against
The esteem or the Honda u have to race the car in Indian open. And in this class the other cars will be well
Prepared for the run. And even the best prepared 800 will not stand a chance. That is why a bigger car is preferred.

I think the class thing is all bull**** when it comes to the track. If u are looking to do up an 800 and u feel
Good doing it up. Then go for it. Again racing is something u do to feel complete within urself.
It really doesn’t matter even if ur friend is driving a skyline, if ur the best in ur category.

There are a lot well done up 800’s who are really good in their Category.
We have RAC, Harry (800 with NOS), and a few others who race or used to race 800’s

As far as 800 goes u can very well install a 1liter engine and total supe it up.
The only thing is u cannot install any thing bigger in it as the chassis would not take the beating.

So u can have a fast Street car, But not an Indian open winning car.

Last edited by GTO : 21st August 2007 at 13:19. Reason: Removing font tags
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Old 18th August 2007, 06:33   #34
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Originally Posted by v1p3r
I'm not going to go around giving things out
Wonder what ever happened to the freedom of speech we enjoyed? Or have things changed since .... ?

Besides, I do not think it should be that difficult too. Since the Thai Vtec puts out what 132 bhp (cant recollect the exact fig)? A change in the ECU, intake manifold, headers, a slightly wilder cam can get you there? Then add a good port/polish, an aftermarket race cam, bump up the CR a bit and you could be hitting close to the target. Though, it would cost one an arm and maybe a neck too for all this. Jitu, would it possible then? Lets say if one wants to have an all out NA build, what could we realistically expect? Street driveability not being such a paramount issue.

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and I've seen it being done.
Just warn me from getting into trouble with these fellows will ya?

Last edited by mclaren1885 : 18th August 2007 at 06:37.
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Old 18th August 2007, 10:24   #35
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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
I stand by my words.
I am talking practical.

i said its not easy to make power increase 50% over stock in N.A, even the JDM block, it makes 130 @ crank so to wheels it comes down to 110.
The D series head dont flow that kind of cfm required to make power in NA even if you port & polish.
Tell me how many guys in India have measured "CFM" pre & post head porting? i tell you... non! & unless you measure that, you dont know how much effective is the head porting/polishing. here people go blindly & think porting polishing will give them a very big increase.
The stock compression is 9.1 you will have to go atleast 11.3 & above so choice of fuel is limited & you will need to change pistons for that, infact custom made. you will need to strip the block for install. when you strip the block then goes lots of parts in reassembling, Gasket, Seals, bearings,oils & what not. There are no Bolt on Cams available, so you get it custom made, race spec, atleast 290 deg, so will it be streetable?
You will also need standalone preferably Hondata S300 or Rdkartik's ecu, install, tune it & make everything work together. for a D series engine you can up the rev limit by 8000-8200 rpm (after upgrading valve train components) anything above that, i can gaurantee you it will not make any power.the torque curve will start falling past 8k rpm due to the engine geometry.
Its not end here, you will require injectors,manifold, a well tuned custom made exhaust. I can give you my B series injectors which are 240CC which is adequate but Pistons, Cams, valve train components will have to be sourced from abroad. so how do you intend to source it?who will transfer the money & track orders shipping cost & the headache involved with our customs to clear things out.
At the end i can gaurantee you the landed cost will be in tune of 1-1.5L
but ofcourse there are methods to cut down cost if reliability is not paramount.

Last edited by Ford Rocam : 18th August 2007 at 10:38.
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Old 18th August 2007, 10:37   #36
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Wonderfully put Jitu. And no playing with words! Just straight, clear answers.
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Old 18th August 2007, 14:12   #37
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Very well put Jitu. Its a hard work nonetheless and a bit complicated too. And definitely the car might not be streetable. But, the kind of customers Akshay is referring to don't necessarily want the car to be streetable either as long as it wins drags.

Quote:
so how do you intend to source it?who will transfer the money & track orders shipping cost & the headache involved with our customs to clear things out.
He has struck a goldmine Jitu, any Suzi or Honda aftermarket parts. V1p3r is the man to approach. He is out there with the best.
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Old 18th August 2007, 18:46   #38
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can anyone point out the mods in rdkarthiks esteem..or was it just a GREAT driver..??

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Originally Posted by madan80 View Post
well , OHCs and Esteems are Jap engines - easy to modify. Palio's power range (from what i heard) is in the 2500- 3000 - so till it gets there, the other car would have left it too far behind to catchup.

The OHCs and the esteems have their power coming up at a much higher rpm than the Palios..i guess its the availability of spares..and the ability to mod them..

We are closer to south east asia where the jap cars have a lot of spares available than the palio..or an european / american car,,

Quote:
Originally Posted by n_aditya View Post
I agree with you MCL. Another point to add is that Jap engines revv more freely and smoothly than their american or european counterparts. This is why modifications are easier and relatively hassle free on the jap engines.
It not the revability aditya..its the hassle..If the same track day were in Europe..i'm sure a Palio can beat the hell out of an Baleno!.. or Honda City..

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Originally Posted by nitrous View Post
What does free-revving have to do with modding???
Nothing!
Currently, the 1.8T RS engine has the most off-the-shelf performance goodies in India. But, at heavy price tags.
OT.. Cars that dont rev can be driven easily.one less pedal to press!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by fiery enzyme View Post

If RDkarthik's esteem can beat the Cayenne with an ecu only mod, just do that to the 800 along with the other frills and you get the best power to weight ratio.


OT : Thanks John for dedicating the song for us. AND NITROUS
Okay..what mods did his car have .. can anyone elaborate.. please..?

Last edited by Rtech : 19th August 2007 at 10:39. Reason: no need to create individual posts within minutes of each.
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Old 18th August 2007, 20:04   #39
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Just an ECU swap, i guess. check the event thread.
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Old 18th August 2007, 23:44   #40
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COMPLETELY OT: was tailing a rally esteem today, and trust me either that car had a very bad exhaust or the car struggles to keep up in front of a swift d (4 adults loaded) on an indian highway within 130 kmph

so much for power tuning, i think most tuners are playing with power band (where its placed wrt rpm) compared to actual increase in power out put. Just a guess from my side.
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Old 19th August 2007, 00:19   #41
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Originally Posted by headers View Post
Okay..what mods did his car have .. can anyone elaborate.. please..?
Hey Headers. RDkart was only running his Race Dynamics ECU and i think I read that he had removed the air filter for the drag. no other performance parts. Hears his post.

Quote:
Btw, i was using the RD0601 street version ECU without launch control.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/motor-...fficial-9.html

I pmed him and he gave me more info on the ECU which helped him capitalize on the PTWR component of his lil esteem
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Old 20th August 2007, 15:47   #42
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Originally Posted by Ford Rocam View Post
Tell me how many guys in India have measured "CFM" pre & post head porting? i tell you... non!
People have been using flow benches and metering airflow in BLR for decades.

Jitu, I'm not going to argue this here. When we meet up next, maybe I can show you a couple of Hondas that produce power over 8000 rpm without spending the earth. FYI, all the parts you mentioned, injectors, manifold, exhaust, pistons, conrods, cams, are available here.

Yes, the whole install may cost you around 1 lakh, but it's cheaper than a turbo job, and you get that high-revving NA rush.
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Old 20th August 2007, 15:56   #43
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Originally Posted by nitrous View Post
What does free-revving have to do with modding??? Nothing!
I was merely quoting what headers had said suring one of our meet/drives. I hope u both can recollect.

Last edited by n_aditya : 20th August 2007 at 16:12.
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Old 20th August 2007, 15:59   #44
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Originally Posted by v1p3r View Post
You mean like them slow-revving Ferraris and Lamborghinis?
No!!! i dont mean to say ferrari's and lambo's are slow revving. Thats why my post said "american and european counterparts" like opel, ford etc.

Who in the wildest dreams would compare a ferrari or a lambo to an OHC or an esteem? And IF the OHC / esteem was an equal counterpart to the ferrari and lambo, many of us would be very proud and happy.

Last edited by n_aditya : 20th August 2007 at 16:02.
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Old 20th August 2007, 18:48   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narayan
anyway enuf reason for mcl and supreme baleno not to miss the next drag !!
Really wanted to make it to the drag as a spectator, but could not. As far as participating is concerned, I have not even seen a professional drag event, let alone participating. So, ruled out for some more time. But yes, one day surely plan to do it.
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