Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP Worldwide > The International Automotive Scene


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 3rd October 2013, 00:08   #61
BHPian
 
kraft.wagen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: LA <---> Coimbatore
Posts: 943
Thanked: 254 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
It is an interesting thought experiment that the clear majority supports the decision to run over the bikers!
I totally agree with you that no one has a right to take someones life or take them down, but the situation here is different. The RR driver could have panicked, adrenaline rush, safety of his family, fear of getting beat by a mob are some that he may have gone through and being in a closed cage, he sure felt a little protected to flee taking down a few bikers. But the situation could have been whole lot different if he had been a pedestrian or even if he was on a convertible may be?
kraft.wagen is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 03:58   #62
Distinguished - BHPian
 
phamilyman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Gurgaon
Posts: 5,601
Thanked: 3,452 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by ToroRosso View Post
No Offence phamilyman , Have you ever been in a scenario where you felt your family was in grevious danger?
Of course not, in my 2 lakh+ km in the last decade itself, (80% in the road-rage crazy NCR), I have only met really nice people who break into a Karan Johar song and dance at every conceivable opportunity .. not!

Your incident is again downright foolish in *my* book - had all those guys turned up with enough weapons to overwhelm you , things could've been WAY dirtier (I know of an similar such murder near my place where a local rowdy skilled in fighting was simply overwhelmed by manymore rowdies and iron rods). I am happy that you made the best of that mess - good for you. *I* will not behave as you did even if I had the talent and the fitness - to each their own. Whose to say that those rowdies could've not come back at you or (worse) your family later?

Quote:
Originally Posted by NetfreakBombay View Post
In this case, this is not an experiment anymore. SUV driver was not charged at all and police has thrown books at few bikers.

DA must have had some reason for this.
You mis-read my post. I am talking about BHPians here saying that they would have run over the bikers as well, not about the DA. The DA won't be having "emotional distance over the internet"

The worst part is that the video has footage of the biker's stupidity but not of Lien mowing Mieses down. (could he have avoided him?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kraft.wagen View Post
I totally agree with you that no one has a right to take someones life or take them down, but the situation here is different. The RR driver could have panicked, adrenaline rush, safety of his family, fear of getting beat by a mob are some that he may have gone through and being in a closed cage, he sure felt a little protected to flee taking down a few bikers. But the situation could have been whole lot different if he had been a pedestrian or even if he was on a convertible may be?
If everyone starts killing others the moment they fear being beaten in a road rage incident, then God save this world.
phamilyman is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 3rd October 2013, 04:30   #63
BHPian
 
ToroRosso's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Bay Area
Posts: 260
Thanked: 87 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
Your incident is again downright foolish in *my* book - had all those guys turned up with enough weapons to overwhelm you , things could've been WAY dirtier
Sarcasm uncalled for. I understand the point that you were trying to make. I was just putting across a behavioural response that an average joe like me exhibited under a similar situation.

In a very tense situation all it takes is one tiny action for everything to snap. In my case, It was my lil' sister's crying and scared face. Now that I am older , would I have acted any differently?Hell No!
ToroRosso is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 3rd October 2013, 05:21   #64
BHPian
 
kraft.wagen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: LA <---> Coimbatore
Posts: 943
Thanked: 254 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
If everyone starts killing others the moment they fear being beaten in a road rage incident, then God save this world.
Well my point was not that people go around killing each other! I said that since he was in a car he drove past(over) the bikers, and if this incident had happened while he was walking, do you think he will punch people or run for his life?
kraft.wagen is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 08:27   #65
BHPian
 
samarth.bhatia's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 412
Thanked: 292 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Two sides to every story.

The Range Rover was stopped due to a fender bender argument with the bikers. And then as the group of bikers started surrounding the RR, the driver tried to escape, as he had his wife and 2 year old daughter with him in the car.

Currently, NYPD has not declared the RR as incorrect in his actions, as there are multiple factors contributing to the fact that he acted as such to protect his family from an intimidating biker gang, which in the end beat him up badly (once they found him stuck in city traffic).

Source: CBS News Link
samarth.bhatia is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 08:30   #66
Senior - BHPian
 
F150's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: PUNE
Posts: 1,557
Thanked: 646 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
Of course not, in my 2 lakh+ km in the last decade itself, (80% in the road-rage crazy NCR),
If everyone starts killing others the moment they fear being beaten in a road rage incident, then God save this world.
Dear Phamilyman,

There are only two possible reactions to threat. You fight or flee. I think the intent of the driver in this incident is to flee rather than to mow down people intentionally.

I would like to hear your opinion, as what you would have done in such in a situation.

Delhi, four bullets doing wheelies in the middle of the road, you hit one of them accidentally. Th pillion riders get down start banging your windows, your car has no possible exit, as you have bikes standing in front of your car.

The above scenario is hypothetical and doesnt in any sense wish you bad luck or drishti.

Human instinct is to protect yourself first. That's the way humans are wired or for that matter any creature in this world.

I acknowledge your higher emotional quotient.

Last edited by F150 : 3rd October 2013 at 08:40.
F150 is offline   (6) Thanks
Old 3rd October 2013, 11:38   #67
BHPian
 
AbhishekB86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 330
Thanked: 360 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
Of course not, in my 2 lakh+ km in the last decade itself, (80% in the road-rage crazy NCR), I have only met really nice people who break into a Karan Johar song and dance at every conceivable opportunity .. not!

*I* will not behave as you did even if I had the talent and the fitness - to each their own. Whose to say that those rowdies could've not come back at you or (worse) your family later?

"emotional distance over the internet"




If everyone starts killing others the moment they fear being beaten in a road rage incident, then God save this world.
I think the emotional distance you're talking about in previous posts applies to you as well. It is easier to talk about what the car driver should have done/could have avoided after watching the clip.

Was the SUV driver at fault? Most definitely, yes.

I don't think you can guarantee what you would be doing in such a situation. When you're stuck in a situation so bad and have a toddler and your wife in the car with men ready to beat you to pulp thinking rationally doesn't happen so easy. When fear takes over your standard rules and principles in life would not apply. Put any man in a situation like that and watch his values and principles erode.

It is easier to have an higher intellectual stand unless you're the one who's being targeted.

What guarantee did the SUV driver have that these guys weren't going to attack his wife or kid? Again, I am not justifying his actions but If you corner anything/anyone no matter how docile it will fight for it's life.

Last edited by AbhishekB86 : 3rd October 2013 at 11:39.
AbhishekB86 is offline   (4) Thanks
Old 3rd October 2013, 12:26   #68
BHPian
 
satishv1987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 52
Thanked: 108 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

All that the car's driver had to do was call the cops immediately. The first time he bumps the biker you can clearly see that the biker slows down all of a sudden.The Rover was also at fault. He should ve maintained a safe distance from the bike in front of him.

On a funnier note, this looks like a scene straight out from the movie 21 Jump Street

satishv1987 is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 13:11   #69
BHPian
 
500ContyCruiser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: KA25
Posts: 524
Thanked: 368 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by satishv1987 View Post
All that the car's driver had to do was call the cops immediately. The first time he bumps the biker you can clearly see that the biker slows down all of a sudden.The Rover was also at fault. He should ve maintained a safe distance from the bike in front of him. On a funnier note, this looks like a scene straight out from the movie 21 Jump Street
How do you maintain safe distance when someone overtakes you on a highway (where you are at high speed already) and stops right in front of you?

Yes, if have read complete story posted here (in various articles) he did call 911. However as the bikers were already over him and he felt there is no point in waiting for cops to arrive, as his family was already at stake.

If the RR guys was wrong, why not the bikers at the first incident called cops and allowed them to handle the situation? Then the story would have been different and no one would be at hospital now.

Last edited by bblost : 3rd October 2013 at 13:28. Reason: removed embedded video
500ContyCruiser is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 14:47   #70
BHPian
 
Arch-Angel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Chn(Atrocity)
Posts: 552
Thanked: 277 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

The video is downright shocking. Now, i neither support or condone anything that has happened here but lets look at what happened.

1. Initial incident where the rangey hits a biker and stops to check (up on various sites but i am not sure how accurate this is). Tension is slightly high.
2. Bikers confront the rangey guy and begin damaging the car. Group vs A guy with his family, guy in the rangey has panic set in and now has the "fight or flight" instinct which he acts upon.
3. Rangey guy guns it and rams the biker in front and runs over him in the process. Bikers now show mob mentality and decide the swarm the guy.
4. Rangey stops near a traffic intersection and gets beaten alongwith the car.

Now, civilized riders would have stopped, called the police and let them deal with the issue. So much simpler than taking law into one's hands. Now, please dont start about our country where the biggest goons are the protectors of the law itself. America atleast has a police force they can atleast be happy with. All in all, guy reacts on instinct and runs over a fellow motorist. All this could definitely be avoided.

My ride is already marked in all places inspite of me driving carefully thanks to absolute maniacs on the road. I never confront them but tell them that they should try and drive carefully so that it doesnt happen the next time. No use in getting worked up for it because in the end, as Russell Peters says, "Somebody gonna get a hurt real bad".
Arch-Angel is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 16:08   #71
Senior - BHPian
 
Soumyajit9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: 10010
Posts: 1,501
Thanked: 1,665 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by phamilyman View Post
It is an interesting thought experiment .... that doesnt give him license to run over Mieses!!
Apologies, I quite didn't manage to understand your "Hi-Fi" usage of English grammar in the first 3 paragraphs.

Though I condemn the running over of the bikers by the RR guy, at the same time, I condemn the sudden slowing down of the biker in front of the RR, which caused the rear-ending. 'Taali ek haath se nahi bajti".

The RR guy panicked or not, I can't say, but I would have surely panicked in a similar situation. I can't say if I would have run over a human being, but I would have surely done something crazy out of panic.
C'mon, we are humans and are not robots. We are not fed with "If-Then" computer programs. We react according to situations.

If I were alone, I would have probably stopped and picked up an argument with the bikers.
If I were with my family and kid, I would have slammed anyone coming in a way of threat to my family.
Soumyajit9 is online now  
Old 3rd October 2013, 16:45   #72
Team-BHP Support
 
benbsb29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 8,025
Thanked: 3,483 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arch-Angel View Post
Now, civilized riders would have stopped, called the police and let them deal with the issue. So much simpler than taking law into one's hands.
The other videos posted of the same bikers gang shows them riding atop pavements, cutting dangerously into the paths of vehicles alongside, as well as riding on the wrong side of the road breaking traffic signals. Such a scene is oh-so-common in India, but considering this is how they behaved in the US on NYC roads, there certainly was no civilized behavior displayed.
benbsb29 is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 17:23   #73
BHPian
 
Arch-Angel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Chn(Atrocity)
Posts: 552
Thanked: 277 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by benbsb29 View Post
The other videos posted of the same bikers gang shows them riding atop pavements.......there certainly was no civilized behavior displayed.
So much for fun. What goes around, comes around. I am not saying or wishing anything bad for those bikers (even though they are quite a sorry bunch and not the real bikers whose passion is riding and enjoying the journey). I understand now that these were nothing but a bunch of law-breaking lowlifes.

OT:

Somehow i feel there is more than what meets in the eye with regards to the arrests made. Something to do with the USADA? Usually, this is how bikers were busted in the earlier years where they had cults and used to drive after taking substances.
Arch-Angel is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 17:31   #74
Senior - BHPian
 
humyum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Leicester/Mumbai
Posts: 2,306
Thanked: 2,188 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Even in Panic situations you can make sure you don't hurt people while you escape. I mean comes as a natural human reaction when a bike and car is involved that the car has to 'make sure' he does not take a life in the form of the biker because at the most the car will get damaged and for the biker, the at the most is 'death'.

If I was the Ranger Rover guy, I would have not gunned the accelerator and plummeted through the group, but rather gently accelerator and pushed the bikes as well as the riders off the way. A gentle touch and move, atleast that way the bikers would have got time to move away, the bike being run over is fine.

Gunning the accelerator just made sure his intent was to run at 'any cost' even if it meant killing. Sure seemed like an immature dude. Of course the bikers are way immature too, but when you are in a bigger vehicle, you should be more responsible than the bikers.
humyum is offline  
Old 3rd October 2013, 17:41   #75
BHPian
 
AbhishekB86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: New Delhi
Posts: 330
Thanked: 360 Times
Default Re: New York: Road Rage / Accident between Range Rover & Bikers

Quote:
Originally Posted by humyum View Post
but when you are in a bigger vehicle, you should be more responsible than the bikers.
I am sorry humyum except the last line in your post everything else made sense. Funny but it reminds me of how things work in our country. Everyone sides with the poor biker/poor auto wala/poor cycle wala even if they bang into your vehicle. Why? Because they are more prone to injuries. So should this not be a reason for them to be more responsible for their own safety?
.
AbhishekB86 is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Pics: Silver Land Rover Range Rover SE Gordon Super-Cars & Imports in India 38 4th May 2011 17:06
Land Rover Unveil 2010 Range Rover Sport with all-new 510hp V8 Engine hanmust The International Automotive Scene 2 8th April 2009 20:53
Shameful behavior - 15 bikers beat up war veteran in a fit of road rage DriverR Shifting gears 11 24th September 2007 10:49


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 05:07.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks