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Old 12th October 2015, 05:59   #526
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by sgiitk View Post
I hear in medical malpractice suits the support (ie lawyers etc) may pocket as much as 90%.
Yes, but that is only one side of the story. With the help of medical malpractice lawyers, litigants usually get 10x to 1000x of what the litigants originally expected to get. Medical malpractice litigation involves understanding extremely complex medical technicalities which a common litigant does not understand at all. The overhead costs and documentation costs of malpractice litigation are exorbitant. Before you criticise, you should read the following two articles to understand the American system better.
1. Claims, Errors, and Compensation Payments in Medical Malpractice Litigation, New England Journal of Medicine,May 11, 2006.
2. Medical Malpractice Study, Disproving Frivolous Myth , Jeffrey B. Bloom, Gair, Gair, Conason, Steigman & Mackauf, The National Law Journal, July 3, 2006.
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Old 12th October 2015, 11:16   #527
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Found this 2010 document online for federal tax credits given to Clean diesel engines. VW has a great score for drivability and emissions.
Check the comment on VW Jetta towards the end of the listTDI.pdf
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Old 12th October 2015, 14:06   #528
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

More trouble brewing for VW.
Repercussions of this fall out is beyond my grasp for sure!

All this is going to shake very foundation of VW and the worry of Indian VW owners is very much legitimate.
Sorry, but the future is looking little bleak, hopefully we will see a resilient VW on the other side.

VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test-capture-vw.jpg

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Speaking at a meeting of the International Monetary Fund (IMF) in the Peruvian capital of Lima, EIB president Werner Hoyer said that he was “very disappointed” with Volkswagen, and that the EIB would rigorously investigate how the company spent the $5.2 billion in loans it has received from the bank since 1990. Hoyer said that, pending the results of the investigation, the EIB may have to “demand loans back.” An unspecified fraction of those loans were intended for the development of low-emission engines.
Time article link

Last edited by johannskaria : 12th October 2015 at 14:10.
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Old 12th October 2015, 14:28   #529
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by iliketurtles View Post
Mercedes-Benz, Honda, Mazda and Mitsubishi have joined the growing list of manufacturers whose diesel cars are known to emit significantly more pollution on the road than in regulatory tests, according to data obtained by the Guardian.

How deep does this rabbit hole go, and is the issue a more systemic one as hinted at in the article? Makes for worrying reading to see so many car makers names come up like this.
This is not a rabbit hole, it is just a result of the way cars are tested - differs wildly from how they are driven. In India they aren't even put on load (on a dyno with gear engaged), just revved in neutral. How is that really going to be even close to evaluating real world emissions.

I'm not sure what the cheat "devices" are, but if there is such a device on VW's larger diesels, I don't understand why disabling the device or removing it wouldn't switch the car permanently to the "clean" map? Why does this need a major engine overhaul?
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Old 12th October 2015, 14:34   #530
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

I think with time VW will be allowed to come out of this with some punishments meted out to few people.

Its too big a company to fail or close. We hear phrases like 'disappointed with VW' and nothing more from govt authorities.
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Old 12th October 2015, 14:43   #531
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Post re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by johannskaria View Post
More trouble brewing for VW.
Repercussions of this fall out is beyond my grasp for sure!

All this is going to shake very foundation of VW and the worry of Indian VW owners is very much legitimate.
Sorry, but the future is looking little bleak, hopefully we will see a resilient VW on the other side.
On the contrary, on the US Stock exchange, the VW share prices are on the rise. After falling to the 52 week low on Oct 1 - $22.71, it is continuously on the rise until today. It currently trades at about $28 USD.
Those who bought the VW shares on the lowest price already made a 25% profit, within 2 weeks!
When such is the case, I don't think there will be any bankruptcy notice soon. VW will suffer for sure for their blunder of taking customers for ride, but they will come out of it as a business and when they do so, it will be a spectacular turnaround worth of a number of MBA case studies.
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Old 12th October 2015, 15:21   #532
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Unlikely they will be in any shape to recover lost brand value. This is like investing again with bernie Madoff or racing with lance armstrong... I see a lot of corporate restructuring and some part bankruptcies in the next 2 years. VW might survive, but will probably be half of its current size
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Old 12th October 2015, 15:53   #533
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Winterkorn to step down from remaining VW Group posts.

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The German state of Lower Saxony, VW's second-biggest shareholder, put pressure on the former CEO to quit the posts.

Winterkorn is chief executive of Porsche SE, the family-owned holding company that controls a majority stake in Volkswagen, as well as chairman of VW's luxury brand Audi, trucks division Scania and the group's newly-created Truck & Bus holding

http://europe.autonews.com/article/2...mail-ane-daily

Last edited by volkman10 : 12th October 2015 at 15:54.
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Old 12th October 2015, 16:44   #534
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by VeluM View Post
... ... ... I'm not sure what the cheat "devices" are, but if there is such a device on VW's larger diesels, I don't understand why disabling the device or removing it wouldn't switch the car permanently to the "clean" map? Why does this need a major engine overhaul?
This is a long thread now, and I won't say "go back and read it from the beginning!"

Very briefly, and perhaps a little approximately, the cheat "device" is part of the ECU software, and, simply removing it would leave the engine with reduced power and increased fuel consumption, which is not something any owner will welcome. Just removing the "device" is not an option.
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Old 12th October 2015, 16:52   #535
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

I have been seeing the whole incident from different point of view since it took place.

When I heard about stock values falling around 20-30% all of a sudden after hearing about the emission cheating incident, a doubt came in my mind that it maybe be some scandal by some insider to get hold on more number of stocks at lower price. But now it looks like some more serious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
Winterkorn to step down from remaining VW Group posts.

Quote:
The German state of Lower Saxony, VW's second-biggest shareholder, put pressure on the former CEO to quit the posts.

Winterkorn is chief executive of Porsche SE, the family-owned holding company that controls a majority stake in Volkswagen, as well as chairman of VW's luxury brand Audi, trucks division Scania and the group's newly-created Truck & Bus holding
Now this makes it look like a big scandal had been running inside VW itself since long time. Maybe some ambitions of getting hold on the ownership or getting more powerful posts in the group.

US emission cheat scandal maybe a part of the whole planning to bring down the reputation of the group and stock value so that the shares can be made available in large number at lower price for acquisition.

Acceptance of mistakes, releasing apologizes and drastic changes in posts of people designated at top during the crucial period make the whole incident look more suspicious.

Lets see how the story folds in upcoming weeks.
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Old 12th October 2015, 17:28   #536
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by tbppjpr View Post
Maybe some ambitions of getting hold on the ownership or getting more powerful posts in the group.
Like this? Look who's in and who's out now
Quote:
(In April), Mr. Winterkorn survived a failed attempt by former chairman and company patriarch Ferdinand Piech to oust him. The extension of his contract closes the chapter on Mr. Piech’s efforts and gives Mr. Winterkorn a final triumph.

When Mr. Piech failed to win support for his move, he resigned all of his posts at Volkswagen after leading the company for decades.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/volkswag...act-1441180576
http://www.wsj.com/articles/volkswag...eud-1429266670
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Old 12th October 2015, 17:52   #537
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by johannskaria View Post
Speaking at a meeting of the International Monetary Fund (IMF) in the Peruvian capital of Lima, EIB president Werner Hoyer said that he was “very disappointed” with Volkswagen, and that the EIB would rigorously investigate how the company spent the $5.2 billion in loans it has received from the bank since 1990. Hoyer said that, pending the results of the investigation, the EIB may have to “demand loans back.” An unspecified fraction of those loans were intended for the development of low-emission engines.
Wow! So VW took loans to develop fictitious engines and duped customers with fictitious claims. Did VW take lessons from KFA?
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Old 12th October 2015, 19:17   #538
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

At least, US market sees VW selling gasoline based cars at below sticker price or good cash discounts.

Volkswagen stopped selling new diesels as soon as it admitted to the manipulation of emissions. Meanwhile, the new cars that VW is still selling—models powered by gas, uninvolved with the scandal—are apparently in need of a big push to get buyers to bite.

http://time.com/money/4064643/vw-die...facebook_money
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Old 13th October 2015, 03:49   #539
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Now it's gonna be a movie too.
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VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test-1444688351794.jpg  

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Old 13th October 2015, 09:43   #540
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

The Volkswagen Group is planning to get 3 billion Euros from it's suppliers in the form of price cuts to help mitigate the emission scandal costs it is about to incur in the future, according to German newspaper Handelsblatt.

This will be a part of a bigger cost-cutting programme within the company which will include pay, marketing, sponsoring activities and variety of models to help it overcome an estimated 40 billion euros in total costs.

ET Auto
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