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Old 15th October 2015, 20:39   #556
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
VW ordered to recall 2.4 million cars in Germany with cheat software.



http://europe.autonews.com/article/2...autonews-blast
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-34536573

Now 8.5 million across Europe!
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Old 15th October 2015, 21:11   #557
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by itwasntme View Post
http://www.bbc.com/news/business-34536573

Now 8.5 million across Europe!
Ordered to recall is all fine, but does VW have the fix?

Adding a urea tank was one solution they had but it was not for all the models.

Additionally, assuming even a EUR 100 cost per recall (it is too low actually, considering the labor cost), they are already set back by USD 1 Billion. Fines/penalties have not even come into picture yet.
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Old 15th October 2015, 23:25   #558
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Now this is getting more serious.

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Volkswagen AG will embark on one of the biggest recalls in European automotive history, affecting 8.5 million diesel vehicles, after German authorities threw out the carmaker’s proposal for voluntary repairs.


Volkswagen must share technical details of its fix with authorities by mid-November, and the recall will begin in January. The KBA will test vehicles to ensure the repairs were successful, Dobrindt said. New parts necessary to fix some vehicles will probably be ready by next September, he said. Throughout Europe, Dobrindt has estimated that Volkswagen will probably need to exchange or rebuild parts for about 3.6 million engines.

For the sake of customers and the image of the automobile, “we will clear up what happened at Volkswagen,” Enak Ferlemann, state secretary in Germany’s Transport Ministry, said in a speech in the lower house of parliament.


As Volkswagen grapples internally with the crisis, about 400 of its top executives met in Leipzig on Thursday.
VW faces a “large need for change,” Mueller told his top executives in Leipzig, according to a transcript of his speech. “I don’t think much of revolution. And the Volkswagen group doesn’t need one. What we need is courage to act consequently, the will to change.”
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Old 16th October 2015, 09:09   #559
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

I think the recall starts in January and VW have been asked by the Govt to come up with the details my November. The German greens will see to it that they play ball.
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Old 16th October 2015, 10:27   #560
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

VW have admitted about the cheat device in many countries by now, but still I have not seen any update about India. Are they still analyzing about the impact in India, or are they going to skip India since here they may be able to go scott free?

--Anoop
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Old 16th October 2015, 10:46   #561
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Italian prosecutors have conducted searches into Volkswagen and Lamborghini's Head Offices in Verona, Italy, for documents and evidence related to the emissions fraud.

Quote:
Mario Giulio Schinaia, chief prosecutor in the northern Italian town of Verona, where Volkswagen has its Italian headquarters, said that police had conducted searches at both Volkswagen and Lamborghini's head offices on Thursday.

The investigation of managers at the two companies is part of a legal procedure connected with the searches, he said.

"If we want to be able to prove that (cars) have been sold by people who knew they were committing a crime, we need proof that people were aware," Schinaia said.

"It is one thing if I sell water and pretend it's wine but if I sell water believing it is wine it's different."
ET Auto


Volkswagen has suspended the head of it's main Kassel transmissions plant, Falko Rudolph, after he was questioned by internal investigators last week.

Quote:
Falko Rudolph, head of VW's factory in Kassel, Germany, has been suspended after being questioned by internal investigators last week, one of the people told Reuters on Thursday.

Rudolph, who previously ran VW's main engines plant in Salzgitter, oversaw the development of diesel engines at VW between 2006 and 2010.
ET Auto


The whole Volkswagen scandal has brought to light the conflicts in the world of emissions testing, and glaring shortcomings of the existing European lab tests have been exposed.

Quote:
Although Volkswagen's deception was particularly egregious, testing firms in Europe are generally seen as assisting automakers employ what are legal strategies to help their vehicles reduce their pollution in a lab in ways they never could on the road.

Among other problems with the process, automakers in Europe can run their tests on preproduction cars that may not perform like the cars that ultimately come off the assembly line.

"Testing companies assist with the distortion of laboratory test results to produce artificially low results," said Greg Archer, the clean vehicles program manager at Transport & Environment, an advocacy group.

"We have testing organizations that are working for the carmakers, exploiting all the loopholes that they can in an obsolete testing procedure."
ET Auto (must read!)
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Old 16th October 2015, 13:46   #562
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom View Post
This is a long thread now, and I won't say "go back and read it from the beginning!"

Very briefly, and perhaps a little approximately, the cheat "device" is part of the ECU software, and, simply removing it would leave the engine with reduced power and increased fuel consumption, which is not something any owner will welcome. Just removing the "device" is not an option.
Hi,

Thanks for your input - I'm sure the opinion is well informed - its also what everyone else is saying, BUT...

One doubt - in the above, I get the "reduced power" part since the engine is now operating in a mode tuned for emission and not power. What I dont get is "increased fuel consumption" - how can you ever burn more fuel than before and still produce lesser emission?
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Old 16th October 2015, 14:01   #563
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by ddis_dude View Post
Hi,

Thanks for your input - I'm sure the opinion is well informed - its also what everyone else is saying, BUT...

One doubt - in the above, I get the "reduced power" part since the engine is now operating in a mode tuned for emission and not power. What I dont get is "increased fuel consumption" - how can you ever burn more fuel than before and still produce lesser emission?
I think to keep power at the same level you will have to trade off fuel efficiency due to greater consumption. Else you will have to live with reduced power.

Bottom line - you can't have both power and fuel efficiency
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Old 17th October 2015, 06:20   #564
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by theexperthand View Post
VW have admitted about the cheat device in many countries by now, but still I have not seen any update about India...
Coming up with a number is only a matter of checking an internal database, which could have happened within a day if VW was interested (as VW admitted to 480,000 in the US). Instead, they asked for time till end of October (and our government, too, agreed!) as though it involved a physical check.

It's obvious that VW did not want the announcement as a festival season dampener, and they managed it with tacit government support...
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Old 17th October 2015, 15:01   #565
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

This whole thing is getting more shady as 2016 Models have been found to have an 'Auxillary emission control device' that means a second cheat device that help the exhaust to run cleaner during emission tests. The whole team behind this should be hunted down and put behind the bars. VAG won't find it easy anymore with the latest revelations. Hope class action suits will bring the behemoth to task.
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Old 18th October 2015, 00:18   #566
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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During seven years of self-confessed cheating, Volkswagen altered its illegal software for four engine types.

When it started using defeat device software in 2008, VW installed it with the EA189 diesel engine. The software was subsequently added to the newer EA288 engine.

VW's Horn told US lawmakers on Oct. 8 that different software was developed for Europe as well.

Horn added VW was withdrawing its application for regulatory certification of 2016 diesel models because it contained another software feature that had not been disclosed as required by the authorities.

Some industry experts and analysts said several versions of the defeat device raised the possibility that a range of employees were involved. Software technicians would have needed regular funding and knowledge of engine programmes, they said.

The number of people involved is a key issue for investors because it could affect the size of potential fines and the extent of management change at the company .

ET Link
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Old 18th October 2015, 15:45   #567
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Can someone share with me the Url to check if my Jetta has the cheat software please? I have browsed through the last ten pages and am unable to find the correct link, so apologies if it has been posted before.

I have checked these page:
https://www.vw.com/owners-recalls/
http://www.vw.com/content/vwcom/en/owners-recalls.html
https://www.vwdieselinfo.com/

and i get this message: "This is not a recognizable Volkswagen VIN. Please check your VIN and try again." so i might have bigger problems!
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Old 19th October 2015, 12:35   #568
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Quote:
Originally Posted by ddis_dude View Post
One doubt - in the above, I get the "reduced power" part since the engine is now operating in a mode tuned for emission and not power. What I dont get is "increased fuel consumption" - how can you ever burn more fuel than before and still produce lesser emission?
NOx is produced due to high engine temperature. EGR (exhaust gas re-circulation) basically reduces the oxygen intake in the engine, or in other words more fuel for less power, so that higher combustion temperatures are not reached. The increased unburnt HC and CO produced via this method can be tackled using the catalytic converters.

Therefore you burn more fuel and produce lesser emission.
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Old 19th October 2015, 16:50   #569
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Hans Dieter Poetsch, the chief financial officer of Porsche SE and designated new chairman of the VW supervisory board, will also take over as CEO of Porsche Automobil Holding SE from November 1st onwards.

Quote:
Former Volkswagen chief executive Martin Winterkorn is stepping down as head of Porsche Automobil Holding SE, the family-owned holding company that controls a majority stake in Volkswagen, Porsche SE said in a statement on Saturday.

Hans Dieter Poetsch, the chief financial officer of Porsche SE and designated new chairman of the VW supervisory board, was appointed to succeed Winterkorn as Porsche SE chief executive with effect from Nov. 1.
ET Auto


Volkswagen's France offices near Paris have been raided by the French police for evidence on the emissions scandal investigations.

9,46,092 Volkswagen cars in France have been identified as equipped with the EA 189 engines affected by the emissions manipulation.

Quote:
Police searched on Friday Volkswagen's main French office in Villers-Cotterets northeast of Paris and another VW office at Roissy near Paris' main airport, seizing computer material, an official at the Prosecutor's office said.

A Volkswagen spokesman confirmed the company had been searched by French police on Friday and was cooperating with the authorities, declining to comment further.
ET Auto


The Volkswagen group is considering cutting down the number of temporary workers employed by it, as a part of efforts to offset the cost of the emissions scandal.

Quote:
A spokesman for the council, a grouping of labour representatives within the company, said it would support efforts to secure temporary jobs but was aware the company's board was discussing "different scenarios".

Volkswagen said in a statement that the outlook for its employment levels and sales were unpredictable, having on Friday reported lower September deliveries for its core autos division and the 12-brand group as a whole.

"If employment declines temporarily, shortened working hours will be a reasonable option," VW said, adding that the executive board was doing everything it could to secure jobs.
ET Auto


Volkswagen has reported a worldwide sales drop of 1.5 percent for the month of September 2015 and for the first 9 months of this year.

Quote:
VW, facing its deepest-ever crisis after admitting that it fitted 11 million diesel vehicles with pollution-cheating software, said in a statement that worldwide deliveries to customers totalled 8,85,300 in September alone and 7.431 million in the nine months to September.

In both cases, that represented a decline of 1.5 percent compared with the corresponding period a year earlier
ET Auto
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Old 19th October 2015, 20:03   #570
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Default re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Yet another twist to this already confusing who-did-what diesel scandal. Apparently power-house legal firm Quinn Emanuel Urquhart & Sullivan LLP is gathering shareholders to sue the VW group for falsely misleading them. According to the firm the legal procedures will be based from Germany under its Securities Act and initial loss estimates of shareholders are at about 40 billion Euro. Its no surprise that lawyers will move for such compensations if they see an opportunity, part of it is also due to the way VW group is held which is as below :

Porsche Group - 32%
Lower Saxony state of Germany - 12.4%
Qatar Holdings -15.4%

The rest are fragmented portions held by various investment firms with about 12% left for private investors, people being sought by Bentham Group (financial litigation) to form a class action suit. I think this is more to do with Europe than globally, once U.S legal firms prepare the papers and start filing VW will have a lot more to worry about. Though it is a known fact that gaining & losing is part of shareholding, here there is the added fact that the company in question withheld information about its anti-regulatory procedures because of which shareholders would've been unaware at that time about impending troubles which have started now.

I suppose both sides will fight it out good in the courtroom and that final settlements will be nowhere close to initial estimates, but the real problem here would be VW losing trust of customers and of course wasting a lot of time trying to fight this mess than focus on functioning. Even the most optimistic of views would mention VW being cut down a size or 2.

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/m...s-scandal.html

Last edited by dark.knight : 19th October 2015 at 20:06.
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