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Old 20th November 2015, 11:57   #691
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

U.S. authorities are now examining whether Bosch, the world's largest auto supplier, knew or participated in Volkswagen's years-long efforts to circumvent U.S. diesel emissions tests. Bosch built key components in the diesel engine used in six Volkswagen models and one Audi model that the automaker has admitted to rigging to defeat emissions tests.

The probe is at an early stage and there is no indication that U.S. prosecutors have found evidence of wrongdoing at Bosch.

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Old 20th November 2015, 13:16   #692
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Post Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by deetjohn View Post
U.S. authorities are now examining whether Bosch, the world's largest auto supplier, knew or participated in Volkswagen's years-long efforts to circumvent U.S. diesel emissions tests. ]
Of course Bosch knew what was going on. They wrote the software code on the ECU and let this charade go on for all these years. They have already gone on record and claimed that these softwares were provided to VW only for trial purposes.

All said and done, Bosch is a German company and this is a golden opportunity for the American regulators to make their lives difficult.
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Old 20th November 2015, 14:12   #693
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Arrow Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by sukarsan View Post
Of course Bosch knew what was going on. They wrote the software code on the ECU and let this charade go on for all these years. They have already gone on record and claimed that these softwares were provided to VW only for trial purposes.
Bosch will only flash the software on to the chip. Software will be developed and provided by VW. If Bosch was the Software vendor for VW, than this discussion is meaningful.

Say, tomorrow if some cheat-bug is found in Microsoft-windows, will all of us be termed as part of the goof-up, just because we load OS on to our systems?
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Old 20th November 2015, 14:27   #694
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by Chethan B G View Post
Bosch will only flash the software on to the chip. Software will be developed and provided by VW. If Bosch was the Software vendor for VW, than this discussion is meaningful.
From what I know - Bosch makes the ECU hardware, and also writes reference firmware/software to go with the hardware. This ensures that the ECU will work with the type of engines it is designed for in a basic way, but is not optimized.

Its then down to individual manufacturers (VW, Ford, etc.) to then enhance that reference firmware based on the characteristics of their engine, design parameters, etc.

For instance, Bosch might assume that for an ECU intended for use with a diesel engine, the peak torque will come in at 2000 rpm; but the eventual manufacturer can then tweak those characteristics based on their needs (such as choosing between mileage vs. performance).

In this instance, Bosch seem to be claiming that they wrote two sets of reference firmware, but one of those were not meant for use in the field; and it is VW that violated that directive and ended up using it in the field.

Last edited by arunphilip : 20th November 2015 at 14:29.
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Old 20th November 2015, 15:13   #695
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Arrow Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by arunphilip View Post
From what I know - Bosch makes the ECU hardware, and also writes reference firmware/software to go with the hardware. This ensures that the ECU will work with the type of engines it is designed for in a basic way, but is not optimized.
It is logical to assume that Bosch makes the hardware and related driver.

But these ECUs (like our CPU board) are sort of universal - Right? Given that the processing speed and other requirements are met, they can be used with any engine - Diesel / Petrol. Is it even possible to standardize all engines and write a master controlling software, even if it is for basic control? With so much of difference between different engines; such as number of valves, number of CAMs and their position, type of turbos... etc - I do not think it is possible to generalize.

May be, I am ignorant.
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Old 20th November 2015, 15:24   #696
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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For the VW models named in the reports, Bosch supplied the common-rail injection system as well as the supply and dosing module for exhaust-gas treatment.

As is usual in the automotive supply industry, Bosch supplies these components to the automakerís specifications. How these components are calibrated and integrated into complete vehicle systems is fundamentally the responsibility of each automaker
The company claims that vehicle integration is primarily the responsibility of the automaker, so is unaware of illegal software used to circumvent the regulations.

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Attached Files
File Type: pdf PI9081.pdf (229.5 KB, 138 views)

Last edited by batterylow : 20th November 2015 at 15:36. Reason: Additional info
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Old 20th November 2015, 16:29   #697
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by deetjohn View Post
U.S. authorities are now examining whether Bosch, the world's largest auto supplier, knew or participated in Volkswagen's years-long efforts to circumvent U.S. diesel emissions tests. Bosch built key components in the diesel engine used in six Volkswagen models and one Audi model that the automaker has admitted to rigging to defeat emissions tests.

The probe is at an early stage and there is no indication that U.S. prosecutors have found evidence of wrongdoing at Bosch.

Source
To date, I still havent seen any real indepth technical explanation on how this cheat software is supposed to work. Lots of simplified, dumb down explanations all over the net.

But I do seem to recall reading somewhere that what has now become known as cheat software is essentially a standard function available in Bosch ECUs, primarily for certain testing and verification methods. VW seems to have used it in a very different way.

But again, it might be just www-gossip. I would still like to understand how this cheat software was really implemented in the ECU. We have a few Bosch Guru's on the forum I thought? Havent seen to many comments from them yet, maybe for good reasons.

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Old 20th November 2015, 18:03   #698
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

While a scam is a scam and need to be dealt with, my question is are we not inhaling more poisonous gases due to all commercial diesel vehicles that do not have superior technology and also ill maintained?

In Indian conditions does it make sense to see VW in isolation to cause harm to humans more than all other poorly made/maintained commercial vehicles?
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Old 20th November 2015, 20:00   #699
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LandCruiser View Post
While a scam is a scam and need to be dealt with, my question is are we not inhaling more poisonous gases due to all commercial diesel vehicles that do not have superior technology and also ill maintained?



In Indian conditions does it make sense to see VW in isolation to cause harm to humans more than all other poorly made/maintained commercial vehicles?

I think there are two different issues. The VW case is around VW knowingly cheats its customers and the authorities in making them believe their cars comply to certain emission norms and or specifications.

Poorly maintained vehicle are the responsibility first and for most of the owners. They might be in violation of emission laws and regulation, but not because of the manufacturer.

In the greater scheme of things you are probably correct that the VW scam has a minute effect on the air quality in India compared to many other causes. Poor maintenance of many vehicles being only one of those

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Old 21st November 2015, 03:42   #700
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http://m.economictimes.com/news/inte...5956.cms<br />
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VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test-1448057523790.jpg  

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Old 21st November 2015, 11:51   #701
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

VW diesel recall may cost much less than expected.

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The technical fixes for 1.6-liter diesel engines require installing a 10-euro ($10.74) sensor inside the air filter and a software update.
A simple hardware solution could reduce total recall costs for the 11 million affected vehicles worldwide by 3 billion euros and enable VW to fix the cars more rapidly
Quote:
VW is preparing to recall about 8.5 million of the affected cars in Europe. Most engines, which range from 1.2-liters to 2.0-liters in capacity, may only require a software update

http://www.autonews.com/article/2015...-magazine-says

Last edited by volkman10 : 21st November 2015 at 11:53.
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Old 21st November 2015, 17:41   #702
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

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Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
VW diesel recall may cost much less than expected.






http://www.autonews.com/article/2015...-magazine-says
Is it another cheat device? Had this been so simple as this, why did they go through the shameful way?
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Old 21st November 2015, 19:10   #703
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V6 engines included in the VW dieselgate#
SOURCE :http://ow.ly/UUWm2 (autocar)
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Old 22nd November 2015, 10:08   #704
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Volkswagen Cuts Investments by €1 Billion in 2016, Delayed Phaeton was an EV.

Focus on newer technologies, China investments and German market to continue.

Quote:
the new Phaeton. The rumors that it's being delayed were true, as the flagship model originally expected in 2019 has been delayed indefinitely. And get this: it wasn't supposed to be powered by a W12 or even a hybrid V6 engine, but a "pure-play electric" system
Quote:
the biggest carmaker in Europe will cut "investments in property, plant and equipment, investment property and intangible assets, excluding capitalized development costs (capex)" to €12 billion, down one full billion euros ($1.1b) compared to previous targets.
Quote:
Most of the remaining 12 billion euros for 2016 will go towards the development and launch of the all-new Golf VIII, the Audi Q5, the new VW Crafter plant in Poland, as well as "upfront expenditures for the modularelectric toolkit (MEB)."



http://www.autoevolution.com/news/vo...eo-102207.html

Last edited by volkman10 : 22nd November 2015 at 10:09.
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Old 24th November 2015, 08:28   #705
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Default Re: VAG's emission fraud - VW cheats in emission test

Volkswagen chief says diesel engine refits 'manageable'

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BERLIN: The steps needed to fix about 8.5 million Volkswagen cars in Europe fitted with illegal emissions-control software are technically and financially manageable, the German automaker's chief executive said on Monday.

Analysts have said the costs of fines, lawsuits and vehicle refits caused by VW's rigging of diesel emissions tests could top 40 billion euros ($42 billion).

"The efforts (needed) to carry out the refits are technically, mechanically and financially manageable," Chief Executive Matthias Mueller said in a speech to managers at the company's Wolfsburg base. "This is a good development."

Separately, Audi said late on Monday a "mid-level double-digit million euro" amount will be needed to reprogramme the auxiliary emission control software (AECD) in 3.0 litre diesel engines deemed illicit by U.S. authorities.

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency said last Friday that emissions issues in larger luxury cars and SUVs extended to an additional 75,000 VW group vehicles, including Audi and Porsche models.

VW's flagship luxury division said it failed to properly disclose the use of three AECDs, adding one which is designed to adjust the working temperature of catalytic converters is viewed as a defeat device by U.S. authorities.

Audi also said the group's decision to take affected vehicles off the market had been extended until further notice, without being more specific.

VW has set aside 6.7 billion euros to help cover the costs of the diesel recalls and another 2 billion for compensation payments related to its manipulations of carbon dioxide emission levels.

"Investigations are running at full speed," the CEO said. "To avoid raising false expectations, we are talking about very complex processes which in part date back a long time."
SOURCE: VW Emission Scandal!
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