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Old 1st July 2017, 20:19   #46
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

Very interesting and thought provoking post. Cris Sacca (one of the early investors in Uber) once said that personal vehicles will become a thing of the past in US very soon. Considering the ever rising popularity of Uber (and other taxi hailing apps), his statement seems to be realistic.
This fact may be hard to digest for us motorheads. But the new-gen certainly has more practical approach towards life. When we were growing up, cars were considered to be a symbol of wealth and status. But now its just a mode of travel. So when it is just a matter of traveling from A to B, millennials find cheaper alternatives like Uber more attractive. Those who still don't want to give up the fun of driving may use self-drive rentals.
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Old 1st July 2017, 23:27   #47
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

So here is a personal example - one that is across time and geographies.

I am a car crazy person and a couple of years ago moved from India to US. I still have my Skoda Laura 1.8T back in India and haven't bought any car in US. Even though the first thing I was looking to do before I landed up here was to buy a car. The reasons for not buying are interesting to note - even for myself - and can give an understanding of the thought process of others like me.

Born in the 80s I bought my first car soon after i landed my first job in 2007. As others have pointed out earlier in this thread car ownership still had some aspirational value till then. Over the next 8-9 years I graduated from a Zen to Honda City to Skoda Octavia to Mercedes and then back to Octy vRs and finally Laura 1.8T. I was looking to buy a hot car after coming to the US. My company provided me with a corporate apartment for initial 2 months that was within walking distance to office. I got hooked to that convenience and ended up leasing an apartment in the same building after that 2 month period. I kept pushing my car purchase out because of the following reasons:

a) I have a zipcar membership and there are 3 of those within a 5 minute walking distance from my apartment - including one that is literally bang outside my door. For any small time needs I quickly book a zipcar - with fuel and insurance included and for rates as low as $8-9 an hour it works out well.
b) For one way travel needs there is always Uber/Lyft.
c) For my weekend travel needs I go and take a look at the 3 car rental companies that are again 5 minutes walk from my apartment. I get a good selection of cars to choose from and can choose according to the situation.
d) For any of my fancy driving needs - car rental companies these days rent anything from a Chevy Spark to a AMG Merc. When I am in the mood I go and pick up a fancy set of wheels from the rental lots - all the managers know me by now and I have picked up Jaguars for as low as 40 bucks a day. You would be surprised about what you may find in a rental car lot!
e) Car ownership has zero aspirational value now and even for car enthusiasts like me the costs and hassles (insurance, maintenance, parking) they come with are a serious consideration towards the decision to buy one.

All in all - the transport scenario is much more versatile and flexible these days negating the 'need' to own a car. This in a country where car ownership is seen as essential. If I want I can buy some really nice cars because I have the finances to do that but its a choice I have made for now. I may still buy one - but for nearly 2 years I have not felt that I cant do without one.

Last edited by Cesc : 1st July 2017 at 23:29.
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Old 2nd July 2017, 07:26   #48
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

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This fact may be hard to digest for us motorheads. But the new-gen certainly has more practical approach towards life. When we were growing up, cars were considered to be a symbol of wealth and status.
I certainly get what you're saying and I also understand that you're of the same school of thought as I, but I hardly think that this "2016" generation (because UBER started to explode only as late as early 16') is practical by any means. If anything they live in a virtual-reality world, everything is swipe-tap and arrives at their doorstep, not my type of life at all.

I consider driving as a skill, like walking, swimming etc, a critical skill. No UBER driver has anywhere close to the skills that I have when it comes to driving, to me its cringe-worthy how they change lanes, change gears, don't follow appropriate speeds over bumps and humps etc.. I call even the highest rated UBERs mediocre at best and many times I'm clutching at my seat-belts in the back when they do a harsh braking to avoid collision and trust me it happens, I was in an accident 2 months back and it was pretty bad, there was substantial injury to the victim motorist and I fell from the backseat into the rear footwell sideways due to the g-forces. The driver asked me to flee and he rushed to calm the crowd down and offer help. When I drive myself I feel more relaxed and in-control and that matters to me.

Cabs are fine for the occasional jaunt and for places which are crowded, they are just an alternative mode of travel and not travel by itself. UBER suits Americans with their big cars like BMWs and other lesser D-Segment sedans like Elantra, Forte, Sonata, Civic etc. Indian taxis? Over 50% of them rattle like they're hollow.

Driving is cool, owning a car is cool.. those won't change.
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Old 4th July 2017, 13:17   #49
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

Being a "millennial" myself and a large portion of my network being people from my age-group, I can concur with the article in the original post.

A good portion of the younger people I know don't even know how to drive. They want to learn driving, yes, but the availability of alternatives like Uber/Ola and metro/decent public transport only reduces the motivation to learn. Not to mention, it is incredibly difficult to learn driving in dense, unmanaged and chaotic traffic in all of the bigger Indian cities.

The younger people who do know how to drive, a huge portion of them are happy buying cars with sluggish and boring automatic transmissions just so that driving becomes less of a chore.

But then there is also a small number of people who love driving and owning cars. Millennials today, on an average, have higher disposable income at their age to spend on cars and fancy modifications/accessories than previous generations.

Are you going to go off-roading in an Ola Swift Dzire? Or will you be taking your Wagor R from Uber to the local race track?

Last edited by Tanmay K : 4th July 2017 at 13:22.
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Old 16th July 2017, 23:16   #50
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

There are a few more not so obvious reason s to not own a car.
Getting a license in any developed country is a big deal. Needs time and investment. Places like UK have crazy amounts as insurance payments for young drivers.
Urban driving many a times is as slow as public transport.
You have to be careful while driving or you risk fines and accidents.

And lastly, parking. Can you find space to park? and when you do it probably costs as much as taking public transport anyway
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Old 17th July 2017, 16:30   #51
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

A few thoughts/comments

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Originally Posted by Mafia View Post
There are a few more not so obvious reason s to not own a car.
Getting a license in any developed country is a big deal. Needs time and investment.
It really depends, actually there are many countries where any adult of a certain age and with a valid driver license and a certain minimum number years of experience can teach a student driver. So a dad can teach his kids at basicly no cost. For instance in the UK.

In my home country, the Netherlands, it is very expensive. You have to go via an official driving school. Most novice driver will take anywhere from 40-80 hours tuition. That will cost several thousands of Euro's. Still, most parents tend to give it to their kids when they turn 17 or 18 in the past. All three of our children were given driving lessions on their 18th birthday.

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Places like UK have crazy amounts as insurance payments for young drivers.
Yes, especially if you want a fully comprehensive scheme, but than again in most Western Europe the insurance is very different from UK schemes. Third party only is really cheap in just about most countries.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mafia View Post
Urban driving many a times is as slow as public transport.
True to the extend that public transport in many major town is actually faster then driving.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mafia View Post
You have to be careful while driving or you risk fines and accidents.
I dont think that is a concern to anybody in Europe. Just sticking to the law isn't unusual at all and does not come at any special consideration.

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Originally Posted by Mafia View Post
And lastly, parking. Can you find space to park? and when you do it probably costs as much as taking public transport anyway
In many European major towns parking is hugely expensive. And very often, even for residents, simply not possible. Many town have permits for its residence, but that never quarantees you a parking place either.

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Old 17th July 2017, 20:19   #52
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

I guess people living in the city proper has a lesser affinity of learning to drive/ride (easy access to various modes of transportation) than the ones in rural / semi-urban areas.
As for me, I wanted to learn how to drive when I reached the legal age, but my dad was out on his transferable job for quite a while around that time, so I only got to learn how to drive once I was 22.

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Most novice driver will take anywhere from 40-80 hours tuition. That will cost several thousands of Euro's.
- that's a pretty steep bill , and are those mandatory hours?
IIRC I spent a few hundred USD, and 7 hrs training.
Enough to get past the road test to grab the DL.
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Old 17th July 2017, 21:00   #53
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Default The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials aren’t buying cars or houses

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Shockked: - that's a pretty steep bill , and are those mandatory hours?

IIRC I spent a few hundred USD, and 7 hrs training.

Enough to get past the road test to grab the DL.

No, the Hours aren't mandatory.
In the Netherlands you have to take a theoretical test first. You will really need to study for it. Then there is the practical test. Here an examinator will sit next to you as you drive. The test will take about an hour and they will try and get you to do as much as possible. Including motorway driving and special skills. Which means pulling away from a slope without rolling back., a three point turn in a narrow street. Reversing around a corner safely etc.

Also, student drivers can only drive in a car with dual control and a certified driving instructor. During the test you will have to show that you know how to drive safely and confidently. So, waiting too long at a junction might get you a fail as well as abruptly pulling into the traffic without proper caution.

Your driving instructor will guide you and tell you when to apply for the test. Only about 60-70% of applicants pass first time. And of course if you fail you need to have more driving tuition to fine tune your skills and stay in practice for the next test.

So it's a pretty serious process, takes a lot of time and money. You can't bypass it. Rich or poor all go through the same process

Jeroen

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Old 17th July 2017, 22:27   #54
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

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So it's a pretty serious process, takes a lot of time and money. You can't bypass it. Rich or poor all go through the same process
An hour long road test is indeed serious business - guess I got it pretty easy.

Also - I have heard that getting a DL is the toughest in the Nordic countries - guess you would obviously have much deeper knowledge on that.

But it's from those Nordic countries, especially Finland, that we get champion drivers like Keke Rosberg, his son Nico (though he raced under the German flag), Mika Hakkinen, Kimi Raikkonen, Valtteri Bottas and the likes.
So the high cost to learn and difficult road to licensing maybe is not deterrent enough for the Finnish youth !!
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Old 17th July 2017, 22:37   #55
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Default Re: The Cheapest Generation - Why Millennials arenít buying cars or houses

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An hour long road test is indeed serious business - guess I got it pretty easy.

Also - I have heard that getting a DL is the toughest in the Nordic countries - guess you would obviously have much deeper knowledge on that.

But it's from those Nordic countries, especially Finland, that we get champion drivers like Keke Rosberg, his son Nico (though he raced under the German flag), Mika Hakkinen, Kimi Raikkonen, Valtteri Bottas and the likes.
So the high cost to learn and difficult road to licensing maybe is not deterrent enough for the Finnish youth !!
I also think all these millenials tend to have driving licenses, they just dont buy cars.
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