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Old 14th May 2007, 22:04   #1
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Default Hybrid cars mileage ratings take a nosedive

Hybrid Cars' Fantasy Mileage Ratings Drive Into the Sunset -


EPA has revised the test procedure so that it mimics real world driving more. In earlier tests there was a lot of idling, which meant the hybrids could switch off their engines, with the new system, its closer to real world driving.

Most cars have seen a 10-11mpg drop in their mileage!
Looks like the diesels are going to charge ahead.
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Old 14th May 2007, 22:42   #2
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There actually had been a debate abt whether hybrids are environmentally friendly at all due to the process their suppliers mine nickel was it?

Its interesting to note from the above comparo that hybrids give lesser highway mileage than in the city. That should fairly nullify their eco image, one would think.
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Old 14th May 2007, 22:50   #3
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I hate cars like the overrated Prius, so I feel kinda good reading this. Looks like the American manufacturers overstated their EPA ratings the least.
Japanese ones cashed in on the hype. BTW, the article states that it will take a person 14.5 years to recover the extra cost he paid over a standard Accord..
But I still dont think Americans will go for diesels.

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There actually had been a debate abt whether hybrids are environmentally friendly at all due to the process their suppliers mine nickel was it?
It was stated in a thread here that its much more environmentally damaging than a Hummer!

Last edited by sajo : 14th May 2007 at 22:52.
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Old 14th May 2007, 23:49   #4
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Technology folks, technology! Long term benefits outweigh short terms risks when it comes to hybrids. Without the current Prius that gives 40 mpg combined (which is much better than many other cars on roads) there wouldnt be a 2009/10 Prius with an estimated mileage of 60 mpg combined.

And speaking of environmental damage, I would prefer damage through mining than damage through burning gasoline which has a side effect of filling saudi coffers and the associated ills.

Quote:
Its interesting to note from the above comparo that hybrids give lesser highway mileage than in the city.
ummm... thats the way they are designed. Hybrid technology depends on regenerative braking which is only possible in city driving and hence the high mileage. You cruise on highways and see little or no braking and hence low mileage. Hybrids were never marketed as highway vehicles.
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Old 15th May 2007, 00:33   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979
Looks like the diesels are going to charge ahead.
As long as americans keep getting dirt cheap petrol they will care a zilch for any other source of energy. Its only the recent crude price hikes across the world that has set them thinking to an extent.

Diesel will still take time to get in. Americans have this idea that diesel is only for those trucks... Europeans are cleverer. Its only when some class I magazines will do a follow up on what the world is burning vis a vis the americans and how also they are saving a packet in the process that they will take a serious note of it. As yet diesel awareness is in a nascent stage there.
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Old 15th May 2007, 00:46   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sajo View Post
BTW, the article states that it will take a person 14.5 years to recover the extra cost he paid over a standard Accord..
unfortunately cost is the factor, rather than environmental consciousness. hence many americans are really not happy with their purchase of hybrids.

Off topic, I remember reading about a man who, instead of getting an electric car, bought a prius and added an extra battery to increase it's range to 50-60 miles. now he has an electric car which he recharges every night, with the reliability of toyota.
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Old 15th May 2007, 00:58   #7
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got a prius as a rental a month back. with my lead foot i noticed that it really didnt offer any more fuel efficiency than a civic. i hate the prius, i didnt find anything good about it.
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Old 15th May 2007, 02:36   #8
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Love it or Hate it but you can not deny one thing for Pirus - it started all awareness about fuel consumption among American citizens.

Quote:
As long as americans keep getting dirt cheap petrol they will care a zilch for any other source of energy.
Not true. Americans may get cheaper petrol than say us but look at the distances they travel every day.

As for more realistic hybrids, U was very much impressed by prototype hybrid kept by M&M at Auto-Expo. SUV hybrid with diesel engine. Now thats real saving.

@Mayavi : Fantastic point about technology.
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Old 15th May 2007, 03:01   #9
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Originally Posted by adya33 View Post
Not true. Americans may get cheaper petrol than say us but look at the distances they travel every day.
ummm... americans travel long distance because they get cheap gas

Anyway, on topic:

It is being speculated that the next generation Prius is going to have 100 mpg city! If not the next generation, the one after that for sure (marketing stratergies). It will be solar powered with panels on the roof in addition to the electric motors.
Also, check out Toyota's future hybrid models which have electric motors in all four wheels which not only look cool but also gives unbelievable mileage. Wheel mounted motors are the future and it wouldn't have been possible without Prius.

GM had a very good electric car which they killed for no reason and destroyed all cars they produced except for the prototype! Their new electric car platform is awesome but the battery technology has not kept up with the car requirements.
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Old 15th May 2007, 08:31   #10
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Just picked up an autocar uk when coming back. Talks about a trip across the US in a Merc E320 CDi Bluetec - cost of fuel for whole journey = $200!!!

Looks like diesel will be the wy forward. A new variant of diesel called WFL or something like that which does not stink might be the solution
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Old 15th May 2007, 10:23   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsk1979 View Post
...
Looks like the diesels are going to charge ahead.
Diesels still may not benefit much in US since the cost of diesel is slightly hi gher and same with the cost of the vehicle. So the combined effect may not really benefit the advantage of better mileage of about 10-15%.

Hybrid cars are not only about gas consumtion, its also about environment pollution, and in that definitely it is far better than any other cars. I have driven Prius and its surely not a drivers car. It resembles NHC (non-VTEC) in its driving dynamics. And its also a pure city car, as it gives better mileage in city, at an average of about 45-50 mpg.

Lets give them time. They will surely improve the technology and make it better. In fact the Hybrid Camry is said to give the same mileage of a gas Corolla (about 30 mpg) without compromising power.

Quote:
ummm... americans travel long distance because they get cheap gas
True and also you should notice that the gas prices still comprises of only a small portion of their expenses. Even Coke costs more than double.

Last edited by appuchan : 15th May 2007 at 10:30.
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Old 18th May 2007, 17:38   #12
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Diesel engines currently offer significantly better fuel efficiency than petrol engines, but diesel has a higher carbon dixoide intensity than petrol. Thus policies promoting diesel vehicles might not necessarily achieve any reduction in carbon dixode. The EPA figures quoted are only for hybrids. In fact, this is selective quoting from some journo which has now been posted here. The EPA has downgraded FE for all vehicles sold in US to reflect actual conditions.

Last edited by aah78 : 23rd May 2007 at 02:38. Reason: removing text format tags
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Old 18th May 2007, 17:46   #13
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Actually diesel is more FE but it emits 14.7% more carbon than petrol. Thus, this is the amount of higher FE per litre that diesel must have to be carbon neutral as compared with petrol. Of course, there are other costs of diesel such as higher suplhur, higher cost of production (which also requires inputs such as power, steel which require energy such as coal to produce).
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Old 23rd May 2007, 02:50   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayavi View Post
ummm... americans travel long distance because they get cheap gas
Quote:
Originally Posted by appuchan View Post
True and also you should notice that the gas prices still comprises of only a small portion of their expenses. Even Coke costs more than double.
cheap gas!? not any more!
just for comparison:
a gallon of Regular Unleaded Gasoline (87 octane) is available at an average of $3.00. Premium (generally 91-94 octane) averages at about $3.50 per gallon, while the price of Plus (89 octane) lies somewhere between the two.
a can of Coca Cola is available at approximately $1.00 (cheaper if you buy wholesale).
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Old 23rd May 2007, 03:17   #15
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I know, yesterday I paid $3.23 for 91 ocatne and that is membership price. Shell is charging $3.5 for the same.
But still, it is cheaper compared to rest of world with the exception of Oil exporting countries. If you consider gas price as a percentage of average family income, it is even cheaper.
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