[given2fly]

may be mods, should consider merging this thread with the one below:

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/intern...l-cap-too.html

[Samir Taheer]

Volvo trucks already said they dont want to buy back Volvo cars.. but supposedly the Swedish Governament is putting together a consortium, for a possible buyout.... They are both great brands... lets hope they dont wither away...

[NetfreakBombay]

Another problem for GM.

GMAC is unable to raise funds to gain bank status. It outs whole bailout game in trouble.

GMAC's bid to become bank in jeopardy - News Wires - CNBC.com

[Path_Finder]

Not very sure if this is the right place for this or not!

[manu7781]

As per current news the $14 Billion bailout package has collapsed. Just heard about that on CNBC.

[aaggoswami]

Yes, its true that the bailout package is stalled.
Source :
Senate Republicans stall bailout passage - worldcarfans

Article:

Senate Republicans are saying: Not so fast. Or maybe, not at all.
The endless bailout saga continues. This time it is Republicans in the Senate who are seeking to block passage of the 14 billion US dollar bailout package that the House passed on Wednesday night. That package was agreed upon by Democratic leaders and the White House which would provide emergency bridge loans to General Motors and Chrysler in order for the two most desperate of the Big 3 automakers to avoid a collapse.
But with Democrats holding a tenuous 50-49 majority in the Senate, passage without at least some Republican support is almost impossible. Democrats would need a super majority of 60 seats in order to override any Republican blockage.
Senate Minority Leader, Mitch McConnell, Republican of Kentucky, said in a speech on the Senate floor, "a lot of struggling Americans are wondering where their bailout is." McConnell is supporting an alternative bill, sponsored by Republican Senator Bob Corker of Tennessee, that requires immediate concessions by auto workers and debt holders as a pre-requisite for the low-interest loans being provided to automakers. Republicans are also weary of giving money to the struggling industry based on mere promises of reform. They want automakers to make commitments to restructuring before getting any help.
The Bush administration, having agreed on the plan with Congressional Democrats, is trying to convince Republicans to support it. But President Bush no longer holds much sway with lawmakers of his own party.

About Saab and Volvo: Sweden government is trying to rescue them. They are plannig $3.4 Billion aid.

Source : Sweden unveils $3.4 billion aid plan for auto makers - worldcarfans

Article:

Sweden's government announced their own auto industry bailout today. The deal, worth an estimated 28 billion kronor ($3.4 billion), consists of emergency loans, funding for research and development, and a credit line.

The news comes on the heels of an announcement by a coalition of engineers from Volvo and Saab calling for a merger of the two companies. A merger could only take place if Volvo and Saab were dumped by their respective parent companies, Ford and GM.

Both American companies have considered selling off their Swedish divisions as of late.

Now, the Swedish Government and employees of the two units are looking for a way out from under the thumbs of their financially toxic parents. The government says the funding is necessary to ensure "the continued success of the Swedish automotive industry," despite the worsening crisis. The plan also calls for faster development of alternative fuel and fuel efficient technologies. Sweden does not wish to nationalize the brands.

Meanwhile, Magnus Sundemo and Håkan Danielsson, representatives of the automakers engineers, wrote an item in the Svenska Dagbladet newspaper claiming Saab and Volvo have "complete development organizations" to produce and develop vehicles on the global market, independent of their American parent corporations. Together, they say, the two companies are large enough "for basically all components which go into determining a competitive manufacturing price." At the same time, they have also derided their parents, saying the scale advantage brought to the table by GM and Ford were an overstatement.

On new ownership, the two wrote, "The search for a future owner must be directed toward a solution by which industrial know-how and capital generated in the Nordic region and where both brands are retained in a new, common company.”

Sweden's bailout proposal from the center-right government still requires the approval of legislators.

[machhan81]

Originally Posted by manu7781

As per current news the $14 Billion bailout package has collapsed. Just heard about that on CNBC.

I am confused ! today i had read in times of india about possiblity of the bail out package for GM working out.

GM, Chrysler race against time



Congress Votes In Favour Of Auto Bailout Bill, Sends to Senate For Debate



Washington: The debate over the automaker bailout in Congress has become a race against the clock.
The US House voted 237-170 Wednesday night to approve emergency loans for General Motors and Chrysler, shifting the focus to the Senate, where Republican opposition threatens to delay or kill the legislation.
Democratic leaders and the Bush administration are trying to beat a deadline to save the companies and the millions of jobs dependent on the industry before GM and Chrysler burn through their remaining cash. For GM, that could be in three weeks.
“Without this bridge, we’re going to fall into the biggest calamity this country has known since the Great Depression,” said Representative John Dingell, a Democrat from Michigan, the carmakers’ home state. “A terrible disaster looms.”
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi tossed a challenge to senators, saying she wouldn’t bring her chamber back for further action if the Senate passed a different version of the plan.
The legislation will let GM and Chrysler draw on $14 billion of loans to keep operating while they develop restructuring plans required by March 31. Without the aid, the two companies would likely have to declare bankruptcy by the end of the year.
“The House vote brings us closer to saving jobs and to creating a more competitive US auto industry,” GM said and urged the Senate to act on the measure soon. The firm’s value has fallen 89% since the last peak in October 2007.
In a sign pressure is growing for GM to solve its cash shortfall, the automaker has been asked for payments in advance by a small number of auto-parts companies, people familiar with the matter said. GM has rejected the requests.
Republicans who oppose the measure said Congress should stay in session next week to allow time for changes. Any revisions in the legislation by the Senate would require the House to reconvene. During the debate, Massachusetts Democrat Barney Frank warned colleagues that further House action is unlikely. “This is the last train out of the legislative station this year,” he said. AGENCIES


times of india chennai edition 12-12-08



Can some please clear this confusion as i am planning to buy the new captiva awd which is getting launched next month !

[srishiva]

@machhan81, the deal collapsed in the Senate. Not sure how Indian operations would be affected.
The possibility of a bail out still exists.

[bblost]

They are asking for 14 Billion.

If you see this list Buffett boosts wealth to top Gates on Forbes list | Reuters

then you realise that just 10 American individuals contributing less than 4% of their wealth can infuse enough capital to save the company and so many American jobs.

Why don't they give back to the economy that has given them so much.

[aaggoswami]

The bailout plan are rejected after the senate vote, well almost.

Source :
Auto Bailout Rejected After Senate Vote - worldcarfans

Article :

The US Senate has rejected a compromise deal that would see Detroit's Big Three get $14 billion in bailout money.

GM and Chrysler desperately need bailout funds to make it past the New Year, or at least until President-elect Barack Obama comes into office under the hopes his administration would save them. GM and Chrysler's survival, and to a certain extent Ford's, doesn't just affect the US but the whole world where these companies trade, have factories, dealers, workers and other peripheral suppliers.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said of the collapse in talks: "I dread looking at Wall Street tomorrow. It's not going to be a pleasant sight. This is going to be a very bad Christmas for many people."

The key issue for the bailout failure was the United Auto Workers (UAW) to meet Republican senators demands of benefit rollbacks on par with those of foreign manufacturers' factories by 2009. The UAW said it was willing to do this when the current contracts expire in the late summer of 2011 but not sooner. Another idea, touted by Democrats but rejected by Republicans, involved UAW to agree to accepting company stock in exchange for US$10 billion owed in retiree health care.

Now it looks as though only President George Bush can save the deal by accessing what's left of the $700 billion financial bailout fund, half of which is being made available. Previously Bush did not consider this option, but a White House aide says he is now looking at all the available options.

Minority Leader Mitch McConnell commented: "We simply cannot ask the American taxpayer to subsidize failure... Even if we grant that these companies would fail without taxpayer help, we would still have to ask ourselves whether the proposal before us achieves the goal that everyone claims to embrace -- namely, the long-term viability of ailing car companies -- and, in my view, it does not."

[amit]

Originally Posted by aaggoswami

The key issue for the bailout failure was the United Auto Workers (UAW) to meet Republican senators demands of benefit rollbacks on par with those of foreign manufacturers' factories by 2009. The UAW said it was willing to do this when the current contracts expire in the late summer of 2011 but not sooner. Another idea, touted by Democrats but rejected by Republicans, involved UAW to agree to accepting company stock in exchange for US$10 billion owed in retiree health care.

The UAW are just amazing. They have put our own commies to shame!

[amit]

The Big-3 have been approved for $3.3 Billion from Canada but the release of those funds will be done only after America gives the aid money.

Meanwhile, some further grim news on the crashing auto sector in the west.

General Motors confirmed that it will stop virtually all North American production in January. That would cut 250,000 vehicles from its first-quarter production schedule. In all, 21 factories across North America will be affected.

GM says the Oshawa, Ont., plant will shut down for about six weeks beginning in January. The shutdown would end in the middle of February.

All of our plants -- as a result of the declining sales in the U.S. -- are facing unprecedented shutdowns."

300,000 or 400,000 Canadians dependent on the industry will lose their jobs.

Source: CTV Canada

[gt_mustang]

ok i have to ask this

is it true that GM is selling their cars at a huge discount in the states??

[Centro-P]

Originally Posted by bblost

They are asking for 14 Billion.

If you see this list Buffett boosts wealth to top Gates on Forbes list | Reuters

then you realise that just 10 American individuals contributing less than 4% of their wealth can infuse enough capital to save the company and so many American jobs.

Why don't they give back to the economy that has given them so much.

Well I don't think Warren Buffet became the richest man in the world by investing in a failing venture. What are these 'Detroit 3' other than failed ventures? If he invested in failing ventures he would be a nobody right now.

And they don't have to "give back" to the economy by propping up failing companies. What did the Detroit 3 give to these guys. WB and Bill Gates give back by paying taxes, employing people, buying products etc. Buffet drives a Lincoln iirc, I think that's enough "giving" to Ford.

What if your neighbourhood grocery store was about to go bankrupt, would you give him money so that he can stay in the business for a while? What if 10 of the stores were going bankrupt? If your answer is no, why do you expect these rich guys to?

I am glad that these auto makers are going to bite the dust. This had to happen sooner or later. They made cars that the market didn't want and I don't want my tax money going into saving these guys. The $3.3 billion Canada wants to give can be used to prop up infrastructure around the country, especially in the Greater Toronto Area. That would create jobs too and boost the economy.

[given2fly]

So finally, this is coming to India someday. The real recession hasn't even begun yet. Though not wanting to be a pessimist and naysayer, it is going to be real hard in coming days. The stock market that boomed on that day by 100s of points on Thursday and is up by 250 odd points today, I would love to see it survive the day.