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Old 11th December 2008, 08:07   #16
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I have read in some books that the "business" is always favoured then individuals in any country. So its taxing system and other freebies. Main reason is, govt. can not for sure provide direct employment for all their citizens. Its these business that helps to show the unemployment lower and as a country to "shine".

So, if the business is let down, then it only add to the chaoas.

Its time to streamline the business rather than close it and add to the already huge list of "pink slip holders".

So, I beleive that the money will be granted and those big 3's [may become big 2's too] will have their time again.
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Old 11th December 2008, 08:25   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenhorn View Post
ford has been out their attacking every ford fansite/club/forum with lawyers!
Ford Goes After Online Communities For Trademark Infringemnt
Did you even read through the link? There is a reason why the RangerStation website was pulled up.
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Old 11th December 2008, 09:22   #18
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the article seems to have been updated recently. that stuff wasnt there when I posted that link!
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Old 11th December 2008, 09:50   #19
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Atleast the big three companies have guts to come out openly to US public and state facts. Unlike in our country, where you go and 'buy' out that Minister/s to save you out. End of the day, in any country, it is our MONEY(Tax payers ONLY) which will be splundered for everything else other than development.
Makes me wonder, inclusive of all bribes/corruption/fees/charges/taxes etc we must be paying a cool 50 paise of every rupee we earn the hard way!!
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Old 11th December 2008, 11:06   #20
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How is a crossover better then a SUV? Does it give better mileage? If so how much better then a SUV?

Meanwhile, GM has launched a new crossover Chevrolet Traverse. It's powered by a 3.6 L V6 VVT petrol engine mated to a 6 speed A/T with AWD. Mileage is 8.4L/100kms highway and 12.7L/100kms City.
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Old 11th December 2008, 12:02   #21
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Originally Posted by greenhorn View Post
at least this is ok

ford has been out their attacking every ford fansite/club/forum with lawyers!
Of the (erstwhile) Big 3, Ford suddenly seems to have come out the strongest - they are even telling the government that they do not need bailout money right now but they would like to reserve their right (!!!) to the money should the recession continue beyond another 6 months.

They did the smartest deals - picked up several stakes in other automakers when the markets were down, and sold them on a fair high just before the market collapsed again.

If only there were as smart with cars.
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Old 11th December 2008, 13:48   #22
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I received this feedback from a friend who was watching the live discussion on CNN-IBN on internet that during the recent interview/review/approval process or whatever you call it of the Detroit 3 ( not Big 3 anymore) by the senate the CEO's of these companies almost came out like school going kids babbling with stupid answers et. all.

One question came from the senator, who all came to DC in your own private jet? Obviously all 3 raised hands and when the senater asked who would like to take the return flight back home in economy in a commercial airline, none raised.

Imagine their leadership skills, level headed-ness, ability to manage a tight situation. Even a small indian school going kid can get out that tight spot

And, to think that American people are being fooled again to re-invest their hard earned money in Detriot 3's new found gimmick to get a piece of the US$700 Bilion bailout for all industry segments.

I am sure they will get the bailout but which will make them even more aggressive ( not in making better,smaller and fuel efficient cars but doling out such advertisments as posted in this thread).
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Old 11th December 2008, 14:50   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenhorn View Post
I dont get this american free market concept.

You make profit, you get your customers money, and tell the govt to get out of you way and money .
You make losses, you go crying to the govt how you lost your cash and the govt says, aww, thats ok, here, have some taxpayers money.

so much for a mature economic system. this sound more like an immature kid
The only reason they're getting any help from the Govt. (and the money comes with riders, it's not a free pay out) is because of the job losses involved if any of these or all 3 go under. Millions of jobs would be lost & the impact on the economy would be unprecedented.

No Govt. how so ever strong can see millions of its people getting unemployed & so will try everything they can to stop these companies from going under & recovering. Remember that we're talking about GM, Ford & Chrysler which are companies of massive scale worldwide. Them closing down or going bankrrupt will mean bad for all of us, not just the people of the US.

I don't like most of their products anyway & have been watching them self-destruct for the past decade or so but let's face it if they do go bust we're all in deep trouble.
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Old 11th December 2008, 15:11   #24
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Originally Posted by iraghava View Post
No Govt. how so ever strong can see millions of its people getting unemployed & so will try everything they can to stop these companies from going under & recovering. Remember that we're talking about GM, Ford & Chrysler which are companies of massive scale worldwide. Them closing down or going bankrrupt will mean bad for all of us, not just the people of the US.
You read my thoughts Ishan cheers:
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Old 11th December 2008, 16:00   #25
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Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
My feelings exactly. This is legalized begging.

And the sad part is that they will get away with it.
If you thought this was begging, just read the letter from Lehman Brothers CEO to Warren Buffet - Corporate begging at its best
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Letter from Lehman CEO to Buffett.pdf (37.9 KB, 231 views)
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Old 11th December 2008, 16:36   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nemo View Post
If you thought this was begging, just read the letter from Lehman Brothers CEO to Warren Buffet - Corporate begging at its best
Super Duper letter from Dick !!!!!

I particularly liked one sentence, where he mentioned, he will " consider" Buffet's $5B investment whereas in reality they were desperate for those funds. Totally hilarious. These CEO's have egos so inflated that begging is tactfully modified to sound like strategic investment.

I reckon this attitude is what we indians lack.

Thanks for posting this Nemo, i totally enjoyed reading it and its also a wealth of information

Last edited by mobike008 : 11th December 2008 at 16:37.
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Old 11th December 2008, 17:31   #27
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I do not believe GM issued this.
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Old 11th December 2008, 17:39   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1100D View Post
What is the source that says GM indeed issued this?
The GM website has the full text in pdf. What is quoted here is not the full text but around 80 per cent of it. Even I am surprised that they indeed said all this. GM is trying to convince the people that what happens to the US automobile industry affects main street, which is perhaps true.
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Old 11th December 2008, 18:18   #29
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Originally Posted by fatherlover View Post
I do not believe GM issued this.
If you can't believe Washington Post, what more proof do you need?

washingtonpost.com

Last edited by Samurai : 11th December 2008 at 18:21.
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Old 11th December 2008, 21:28   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by getsurya View Post
Atleast the big three companies have guts to come out openly to US public and state facts. Unlike in our country, where you go and 'buy' out that Minister/s to save you out. End of the day, in any country, it is our MONEY(Tax payers ONLY) which will be splundered for everything else other than development.
Makes me wonder, inclusive of all bribes/corruption/fees/charges/taxes etc we must be paying a cool 50 paise of every rupee we earn the hard way!!
Agree with you. Whatever they are doing, it is with some reason of transparency. And in the thread about GM bankruptcy, I have posted the details about the facts and figues GM was putting out on what would happen if all of them collapse. The figures were quite scary and this the reason why US government is giving money. But they requested $35 billion initially, then it became $34 Billion and now they are given $14 billion. And its not free. They were asked to present the future plan in which Ford said that electric is the way ahead. GM CEO was going again in Chevy volt after they were critized on why their own jets.

But we must appreciate that they are more honest than our industry at the end of the day. Pressure is there to prove that the money will not be wasted and they will come out of this. GM needs $7billion in December just to stay afloat and another $7 Billion in early 2009.

A few links :

House approves $14 bn auto bill - bearish Senate vote pending - worldcarfans

White House wants car czar with power to force bankruptcy on automakers - worldcarfans

Calls growing for GM chief to resign - worldcarfans




Quote:
Originally Posted by amit View Post
How is a crossover better then a SUV? Does it give better mileage? If so how much better then a SUV?

Meanwhile, GM has launched a new crossover Chevrolet Traverse. It's powered by a 3.6 L V6 VVT petrol engine mated to a 6 speed A/T with AWD. Mileage is 8.4L/100kms highway and 12.7L/100kms City.

Crossover will atlest have better aerodynamics and they are lighter also. The percentage gain on FE depends upon the cars that are compared, but they are any given day better than the " trucks " based SUV US loves/d.

I think it is the same motor in Traverse as the one availble in Suzuki XL-7 in US and its GM co-operate cousins.


EDIT : I think atleast Ford must be appreciated that they are in the best health as compared to the other two. They had asked for $9Billion and said they would use it only if necessary. I am also personally against Richard Wagoner and I consider him to have literally killed the diesel market in US. Thankfully the diesel market is coming up there.

Last edited by aaggoswami : 11th December 2008 at 21:30.
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