Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP Worldwide > The International Automotive Scene


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 22nd January 2009, 11:05   #31
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 49,851
Thanked: 103,668 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
Chrysler has no small cars. So they complement each other pretty well.
Quote:
2. Chrysler isnt into diesels in a big way,
My doubts lie around this : Are the current owners of Chrysler interested in selling cars at all?

With the companys valuation today, Cerberus are looking like a bunch of fools for buying Chrysler at the price they did prior to the recession. IMHO Cerberus would have probably flipped & moved Chrysler in parts already. If it weren't for the current situation in the States. Fiat doesn't have big money either, and if they do buy a stake right now, Cerberus will be forced to sell at a massive loss. Talk about having to choose between a rock and a hard place!
GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd January 2009, 12:12   #32
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: N.A
Posts: 6,873
Thanked: 1,642 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samir Taheer View Post
I don't think its just about Fiat selling a few 500's in America. With the Chrysler alliance it will give Fiat a better base for all their cars, including - Ferrari, Maseratti, Lancia, etc.
Ferrari and Maserati already have a strong US market presence and distributor network. The US is probably their largest market.

As for Lancia, how many Lancias does one get to see on the roads anywhere in the world? What does the brand symbolise - sport or luxury or both? It is a very vague brand in the current scheme of things. Alfa Romeo, I'd rather not comment - at least their cars LOOK good and therefore may not be entirely out of place in the American scheme of things.

Last edited by Steeroid : 22nd January 2009 at 12:13.
Steeroid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd January 2009, 13:10   #33
BHPian
 
sridhga's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 179
Thanked: 13 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
Ferrari and Maserati already have a strong US market presence and distributor network. The US is probably their largest market.

As for Lancia, how many Lancias does one get to see on the roads anywhere in the world? What does the brand symbolise - sport or luxury or both? It is a very vague brand in the current scheme of things. Alfa Romeo, I'd rather not comment - at least their cars LOOK good and therefore may not be entirely out of place in the American scheme of things.
Alfa Romeo was rated as 1st among the cars that American customers love in 1989 Fortune International magazine
sridhga is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd January 2009, 13:42   #34
BHPian
 
Samir Taheer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: London & Pune
Posts: 416
Thanked: 123 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FERRO View Post
Has Fiat got similar deal with Tata ? I mean does it own any stake in Tata motors ? or is it the other way round,does Tata owns some stake in Fiat spa ? I think its win-win situation for Fiat, if it fails bye bye Fiat.
I dont think it will be Bye Bye Fiat - Dont forget they are getting alot for nothing - A stake in Chrysler and a Tooled up production line.

Steeroid - I totally agree America is one of the largest, if not the largest market for Ferrari and Maseratti - My point was that the alliance would make it easier for Fiat in America - with all its brands. To export cars, build them, service, spares...etc etc... plus a larger dealership network.

Lancia on the otherhand - Fiat are trying to re-launch the face of Lancia. I dont doubt alot of people will find the new breed of Lancia ugly. Which segment they fit into... hmm dont know..

Alfa... the new line of cars are nice.. I quote like the Mito Gta and the 8c.. and they seem to have sorted out reliability issues.

Either way.. i dont think Fiat have much to loose. Chrysler need to get into building smaller cars...maybe the 500 would be a bit extreme for them but a decent sized saloon or coupe.
Samir Taheer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22nd January 2009, 13:46   #35
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: N.A
Posts: 6,873
Thanked: 1,642 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sridhga View Post
Alfa Romeo was rated as 1st among the cars that American customers love in 1989 Fortune International magazine
In 1989 GM sold Oldsmobiles and was the world's undisputed #1. Hyundai was not known as an automaker. VW was still the maker of Golfs and Beetles.

The world has moved on. Alfa Romoe was also the brand I always wanted to own - till I actually owned one, that is .

But this thread is not about personal preferences or about discussing model strengths. Let us see if this arrangement works - I think the common consensus is that it could go either way.

Last edited by Steeroid : 22nd January 2009 at 13:50.
Steeroid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2009, 12:09   #36
BHPian
 
siddhu_engg24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Pune
Posts: 46
Thanked: 9 Times
Default CC & FIAT Align...

Here's some more info from a extract received thru' one of my friend...

Fiat & Chrysler in partnership talks! EDIT: Fiat completes Chrysler buyout-cc-fiat-align-1.jpg

Fiat & Chrysler in partnership talks! EDIT: Fiat completes Chrysler buyout-cc-fiat-align-2.jpg
siddhu_engg24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2009, 12:45   #37
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 12,209
Thanked: 11,073 Times
Default

Chryslers foray with Chery for small cars went for a six. This is a cash free opportune time for Fiat to get in. Only hope the cars hold up to demanding (as in requirements not use) americans.

If Alfa can get the 166 revamped and efficient as well as reliable. The Yanks will lap it up
ajmat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2009, 16:29   #38
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 49,851
Thanked: 103,668 Times
Default

Also depends on how long the Americans stay fascinated with small cars. Gas prices have crashed.
GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd January 2009, 16:35   #39
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 1,431
Thanked: 34 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Also depends on how long the Americans stay fascinated with small cars. Gas prices have crashed.
Not just the gas prices I guess. The recession can also play a part here.

But, I have my doubts on this deal. All cars seem to be available to distributors only after 2011, which is eternity. Till then, who knows? The recession may pass...

I would say that this deal looks great only if Fiat-Chrysler combine can push the cars a lot earlier than 2011.
deepakhon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2009, 15:26   #40
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,717
Thanked: 426 Times
Default

Fiat gets 35% equity stake in Chrysler. If tomorrow, Chrysler goes under would Fiat be responsible for Chrysler's liablities and creditors?
amit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2009, 19:25   #41
BHPian
 
Samir Taheer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: London & Pune
Posts: 416
Thanked: 123 Times
Default

From what i understood Chrysler is a Limited Liability Company... so Fiat wont be responsible for any outstanding liabilities... thats why i said earlier.. Fiat have nuthing to loose - With a 35% stake and 2 tooled production lines...

I maybe mistaken about the LLC part..

Also even though cars wont be avialable until 2011.. and yeah Oil prices have crashed and the recission might be over - If America follows in the EU steps and brings out a average emmisions law... this will be a way in which Chrysler will be able to meet those regulations...

Last edited by Samir Taheer : 24th January 2009 at 19:27.
Samir Taheer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th January 2009, 22:11   #42
Senior - BHPian
 
devarshi84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Ahmedabad - Tor
Posts: 3,996
Thanked: 119 Times
Default

A rushed move by both the companies. Fiat had announced sometime back about needing a partner to survive and chrysler wants small cars and cheaper platform sharing to increase their portfolio.

But Where does Chrysler serious fit in for Fiat? the chart above doesnt really give a fair idea.

Also For Chrysler to really succeed Mr. Rob Nardelli needs to go. He isnt the one for the Car industry.

Why for heaven's sake is Chrysler killing their own ideas?
devarshi84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th January 2009, 12:12   #43
Senior - BHPian
 
madan80's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Santa Clara, CA
Posts: 1,357
Thanked: 73 Times
Default 7 Fiat Vehicles for the US

Chrysler LLC and Fiat S.p.A. will bring seven new vehicles to North America under their alliance — four with Chrysler brands and three as Fiats or Alfa Romeos.
The vehicles will be built at Chrysler plants in North America and sold through select Chrysler, Dodge and Jeep dealerships, according to sources who have seen the product-sharing agreement.


The plan includes vehicles on four Fiat platforms — in the microcar, or A, through the mid-sized, or D, segments. The two companies have not decided on timing or volumes. Teams at both companies are hammering out details of a plan they hope to make final by April 30.

The two companies said last week that Fiat would take a 35 percent stake in Chrysler. Under terms of their tentative agreement, Chrysler will make the Fiat 500 at Chrysler's Toluca, Mexico, plant for sale in North America, according to sources familiar with the plans.

Chrysler will retool the Toluca factory, where it currently makes the Dodge Journey crossover and Chrysler PT Cruiser. Chrysler announced last week that it would quit making the PT Cruiser this summer and put the line up for sale, making room for another vehicle.

Speaking with reporters at the Automotive News World Congress on Wednesday, Jan. 21, Frank Klegon, Chrysler executive vice president for product development, said teams from both companies were working on a plan.

Referring to Chrysler's current lineup, Klegon said, "We don't have an A-segment vehicle, and we don't have a B-segment vehicle, and our C-segment vehicle [Dodge Caliber] is in the next stage of renewal. That creates some opportunities for us."


Quote:

Minicars
(A segment)
Two small cars, the Fiat 500 retro 3-door hatchback and a 5-door hatchback based on a next-generation Fiat Panda. The latter likely will be sold as a Chrysler or Dodge.
Subcompact
(B segment)
Alfa Romeo MiTo, plus a vehicle for one of Chrysler's brands.
Compact
(C segment)
A vehicle on Fiat's C-Evo platform made at a U.S. Chrysler plant, possibly a Dodge Caliber replacement. The alliance also would build the Alfa Romeo 147 replacement for U.S. sale on this platform.
Mid-sized
(D segment)
A replacement for the Chrysler Sebring and Dodge Avenger mid-sized sedans on a stretched version of the C-Evo platform Fiat is developing.
Small-car fix

The Fiat deal, if made final, would provide a quick fix for Chrysler's small-car problem. The company needs a fleet of vehicles to meet new, stricter U.S. fuel economy standards, which take effect for the 2011 model year.

The agreement calls for two minicars in Europe's A segment, the Fiat 500 and one with a Chrysler or Dodge badge. A CSM Worldwide report says the 500 could be sold in the United States in 2012.

The five-door minicar could be based on the next-generation Fiat Panda, a small five-door hatchback that is the biggest-selling small car in Europe, where Fiat dominates the segment.
A Panda-style vehicle would give dealers a city car. The 500 is something else altogether — a small, retro three-door that has Mini-style cachet without the Mini price. The 500 is Europe's second-best-selling minicar, trailing the Panda.

"The 500 is selling like hot cakes, even in this difficult economic environment," said Nigel Griffiths, an analyst for Global Insight in London. "It has been a runaway success."
Under the plan, Chrysler dealers also would get a subcompact, or B segment, Fiat, most likely derived from the next-generation Fiat Grande Punto. Dealers also will sell the Alfa Romeo MiTo, built on the same platform. The CSM Worldwide report says Chrysler could get a small crossover from this platform.

The alliance also would give Chrysler access to Fiat's 1.4- and 1.8-liter four-cylinder gasoline direct-injection engines. The engines would be made at a Chrysler engine factory, most likely in turbocharged versions. Chrysler's smallest engine now is a 2.5-liter four-cylinder made at the Global Engine Manufacturing Alliance plant in Dundee, Mich. CSM says the engines could be built in Dundee. A source familiar with Fiat plans says Chrysler may make only the 1.4-liter engine.


Mid-sized quest
Fiat also will supply Chrysler new platforms to develop cars in the compact and mid-sized, or C and D, segments — glaring weaknesses in Chrysler's lineup.
In the compact, or C, segment, Chrysler offers the Caliber, Jeep Compass and Jeep Patriot. In the mid-sized, or D, segment it has the Dodge Avenger and Journey.

Quote:
Chrysler is uncompetitive in the compact and mid-sized segments. "Fiat offers Chrysler the ability to field small/compact unibody offerings with stronger global scale and increased fuel efficiency"
The C-Evo debuts at the end of this year in Europe on the Alfa Romeo project 940 car, which replaces the current 147. The C-Evo is a sporty hatchback stylistically inspired by the 8C Competitizione, a high-priced supercar sold through some Maserati dealerships in the United States.

Fiat hasn't decided which models it will build on the stretched C-Evo platform. A Chrysler mid-sized car could be the first application.

In 2007, Chrysler formed a team, called Project D, to explore possibilities for replacing the Sebring and Avenger. The team was disbanded in September, and CEO Bob Nardelli said Chrysler had moved the project down its list of priorities in the face of the credit crisis and the request for federal funds.

Fiat may distribute the Journey cross-over and the Dodge Dakota pickup in Latin America and other markets, say sources familiar with the plan.

Fiat's benefits may be more on the manufacturing and distribution sides of the deal. Fiat would gain cheap access to the North American market, where it hasn't played since 1995, when Alfa Romeo withdrew.

Fiat also could fill a gap in its engine lineup with a V-6 from Chrysler's Phoenix family of engines due next year.

More

Last edited by madan80 : 26th January 2009 at 12:15.
madan80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th January 2009, 14:57   #44
Senior - BHPian
 
amit V8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: kolkata
Posts: 1,066
Thanked: 189 Times
Default

this is a very very good news for both the companies. BUT, please please FIAT don't change the ram trucks, they are great.
amit V8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th March 2009, 06:18   #45
Senior - BHPian
 
madan80's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Santa Clara, CA
Posts: 1,357
Thanked: 73 Times
Post Fiat reviews Chrysler plants as it prepares for alliance, sources say

Fiat S.p.A. is conducting environmental and safety reviews of Chrysler LLC factories this week as part of its plan to take a 35 percent stake in the U.S. automaker, said two people familiar with the effort.

Fiat has hired Environ Holdings Inc. of Arlington, Va., to do the studies, the people said. Environ teams have been combing Chrysler factories to determine whether a Fiat investment would expose the Italian automaker to environmental or safety liabilities.

The planned alliance, announced in January, is viewed by Chrysler executives as the preferred route to survival. Chrysler, which is relying on $4 billion in U.S. loans to stay afloat and is seeking $5 billion more, would get access to Fiat engines, transmissions and small-car platforms to help meet stricter U.S. fuel-economy standards.

The agreement also would help Chrysler ease its dependence on low-mpg light trucks, while Fiat would be able to sell vehicles through Chrysler's U.S. dealer network.

Environ and Fiat declined to comment. Chrysler spokesman Max Gates said, "Chrysler and Fiat are in the due diligence phase of our strategic-alliance discussions,'' but he didn't provide specifics.

The alliance is contingent on Chrysler receiving the additional $5 billion in federal aid to continue operations and carry out its restructuring.

The automaker's U.S. sales have dropped more than 40 percent, year-to-year, in each of the past four months.
madan80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Fiat and Uber in talks over driverless car partnership dZired The International Automotive Scene 3 10th June 2016 11:17
Rumour: Mercedes-Benz contemplating Aston Martin buyout Aditya The International Automotive Scene 3 20th August 2014 12:41
Notice Period Buyout RAINMAKER Shifting gears 80 19th July 2012 19:56
Chrysler in cooperation talks with Fiat, Tata. madan80 The International Automotive Scene 14 13th August 2008 12:34
Chrysler in Deep trouble. Daimler-Chrysler Divorce? GTO The International Automotive Scene 21 5th April 2007 16:28


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 14:04.

Copyright 2000 - 2018, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks