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Old 3rd May 2009, 10:02   #16
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Originally Posted by sujaylahiri View Post
You guys are kidding, right?
......
.
Whoa, thats a pretty detailed break down there, but even so, I like Chrysler and what it stands for. I`m not saying that its a logical view, its just that their cars make me feel good, the 300 is super cool. the Charger, the Jeeps, the PT Cruiser even!!

Ofcourse I`m just saying this on what I feel, purely on looks/branding/emotion, as I have hardly had many chances to drive Chryslers except my last visit to the US, but I just feel good about the brand.
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Old 3rd May 2009, 22:06   #17
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Bankruptcy was the only way out for Chrysler (as it will be for GM), no doubts there. The media keeps talking about the UAW, American economy, tight finance et al.

Buttttttttttttttttttttt

It really just boils down to one simple thing for the big 3 : Nice cars. Ford (now to a lesser extent), GM & Chrysler have simply failed to match the Japs & the Koreans at the low to mid market segments and the Europeans at the top. Sure, trucks & SUV's are profitable. Yet, a mass manufacturer cannot survive on them. The Big 3 became too complacent over the last 2 decades; that singularly brought them to their pitiable state today.

I'd said this before "Two wrongs don't make a right" and will say it again. Still not convinced of how a Fiat + Chrysler merger is going to work:

- Chrysler could never make things work with Daimler, it was an imbalance between their cultures. How does Chrysler expect to maintain a healthy working relationship with the emotional Italians? Lets not forget, in the recent past, GM paid $2 billion to divorce Fiat after running short-term & long-term feasibility studies.

- Fiat's cars aren't exactly the epitome of reliability nor fit & finish. They may have a car or two that gives buyers an alternative to say the Honda Jazz. But the market will recover and the States will get back to his king-size car habits. Fiat has nothing to offer there. And Chrysler...well..doesn't have any money to R&D new $40,000 cars.

- Fiat is strongest in Europe & Brazil. Their cars cater to European tastes. How well will these cars find acceptance in the States? Hell, they hardly have automatic transmissions!

- For inexplicable reasons, the USA will never become a pro-diesel economy (just as automatics never clicked in India). Fiat's strength is in their fabulous diesels. But the States will probably go all electric rather than diesel. Also, can Fiat's diesel clear the tough American diesel norms?

- Fiat has a bad name in the States, Alfa Romeo too. Can they improve their brand equity?

Chrysler pretty much tried sleeping with everyone, Fiat was the only suitor who accepted the proposal.

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Originally Posted by kutlee View Post
quite sad...but it's funny that govt is going to repair cars. nice democracy.
for the people, by the people and repaired by the people....
Well, they aren't actually going to repair cars. Just a matter of boosting customer confidence in Chrysler by saying "The warranty is backed by the USA govt". I doubt we'll ever see a day when the govt will actually have to step in for 'em warranties.

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Originally Posted by evo View Post
I somehow liked Chrysler out of all the three.
I agree. Chrysler / Dodge always made character-rich cars.

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will i guess help but they need to do a lot more. I was reading some where the other day that the cost of labor per hour for non American cars Honda Toyota stands at around 17-20 USD per hour at the same time for GM and all it is in excess of 30 USD per hour,
What's worse is that they spend MORE to build POORER cars!
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Old 3rd May 2009, 23:01   #18
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Further to add to GTO, Chrysler's lack of technological innovation even in current times is simply disappointing.

As an example, the 3.6L Phoenix V6 engines which are due to be introduced in 2011 and are touted as the next best thing for Chrysler still do not feature direct injection, whereas both Ford and GM have had that in their V6 since 2008.
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Old 4th May 2009, 10:39   #19
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Chrysler's lack of technological innovation even in current times is simply disappointing.
You bet. Again a result of lack in focus & funds.
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Old 5th May 2009, 16:47   #20
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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
- Chrysler could never make things work with Daimler, it was an imbalance between their cultures. How does Chrysler expect to maintain a healthy working relationship with the emotional Italians? Lets not forget, in the recent past, GM paid $2 billion to divorce Fiat after running short-term & long-term feasibility studies.
I know a person in Canada who owns many dealerships there including Chrysler & Ford. I had asked him about why the Chrysler-Daimler thing did not work out. He said that Chrysler wanted to sell a Mercedes priced vehicle in Chrysler brand . It was very difficult for customers to digest this and hence sales were hit and there on Daimler's departure from the Venture.
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Old 5th May 2009, 18:13   #21
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Im somehow glad that Daimler separated from chrysler.
The European brand is too eloquant for Americans and they Americans cant get out of the Ford era..somehow.
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Old 6th May 2009, 11:33   #22
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Americans are infamous for looking at short cut mergers to make things work, but for FIAT, I think its a win win situation, they dont invest any money, just give away technology (which no one else is willing to buy anyway) at zero opportunity cost, and in the process, become bigger (best case) or shrug off Chrysler after 2-3 years as a mistake and chuck it back into banruptcy or sell it to Geely/M&M or anyone else who`d be interested to buy.

However, the one good thing is that American people like American companies are also short term knee jerk reactors, as such, they might just start buying a large amount of small cars in the immediate future.

Also, remember, that as the economy improves, gas prices will also rise, so going back to trucks etc will not be as simple as it sounds, though it will happen eventually.

Me? I`m just hoping that cars like the 300C and Charger continue to be made.
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Old 7th May 2009, 10:10   #23
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Originally Posted by evo View Post
Americans are infamous for looking at short cut mergers to make things work, but for FIAT, I think its a win win situation, they dont invest any money, just give away technology (which no one else is willing to buy anyway) at zero opportunity cost, and in the process, become bigger (best case) or shrug off Chrysler after 2-3 years as a mistake and chuck it back into banruptcy or sell it to Geely/M&M or anyone else who`d be interested to buy.

However, the one good thing is that American people like American companies are also short term knee jerk reactors, as such, they might just start buying a large amount of small cars in the immediate future.

Also, remember, that as the economy improves, gas prices will also rise, so going back to trucks etc will not be as simple as it sounds, though it will happen eventually.

Me? I`m just hoping that cars like the 300C and Charger continue to be made.
You're missing a key point here. Just to keep the Chrysler plants running, Fiat will have to spend billions of dollars every quarter. That includes operating costs, wages, healthcare costs, payments to suppliers etc. And since Chrysler's credit rating is pretty much worthless, Fiat will be burning through its own cash reserve (if any) pretty quick.

And retooling the Chrysler plants for Fiat cars is also gonna cost a large chunk of money, which Fiat will be spending from its own pocket.

Since Chrysler's sales have declined by over 50% compared to last year when they were not even profitable, they'll need to achieve over 200% sales growth in the next 12-24 months just to break even and survive on their own. And that will still not be sufficient to pay off the billions of dollars in loans it has already taken from US and Canadian taxpayers.

So if you ask me, they're doomed. :(

Last edited by sujaylahiri : 7th May 2009 at 10:19.
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Old 7th May 2009, 11:05   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sujaylahiri View Post
You're missing a key point here. Just to keep the Chrysler plants running, Fiat will have to spend billions of dollars every quarter. That includes operating costs, wages, healthcare costs, payments to suppliers etc.
And retooling the Chrysler plants for Fiat cars is also gonna cost a large chunk of money, which Fiat will be spending from its own pocket.
So if you ask me, they're doomed. :(
You forget that the federal govt is gonna bankroll all of that, not Fiat!
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Old 18th August 2011, 10:05   #25
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Default Re: Chrylser files for Bankruptcy Protection

An update on an old thread for anyone who`s interested. Fiat has now acheived its stated goals of turning around Chrysler and has now bought the additional stake that they were going to get. It seems that except India, they are doing just fine everywhere else.
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