Go Back   Team-BHP > BHP Worldwide > The International Automotive Scene


View Poll Results: Which of these cars would you like to own
Mercedes Benz 15 26.79%
BMW 41 73.21%
Voters: 56. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 12th October 2005, 03:46   #31
BHPian
 
comfortablywacky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 540
Thanked: Once
Thumbs up

It HAS to be BMW for me over any other car manufacturer.Period!
comfortablywacky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th October 2005, 03:28   #32
Senior - BHPian
 
devarshi84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Ahmedabad - Tor
Posts: 3,996
Thanked: 118 Times
Default

wow! that's the biggest lead I have seen in any poll on this wbsite until now.

No wonder Merc's are trying to ramp up in India before Beemers enter the market.
devarshi84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th October 2005, 07:14   #33
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Mpower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 10,432
Thanked: 1,682 Times
Default

From a satisfied customer, its gotta be the BMW for me. I just hope the de-banglization process starts pretty soon.

Moreover, I live for hitting apexes.
Mpower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th October 2005, 08:29   #34
BHPian
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 529
Thanked: 12 Times
Thumbs up

I would prefer a BMW any day...
Merc is a second option for me...he he he
zulfikar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13th October 2005, 23:32   #35
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Pune
Posts: 80
Thanked: 3 Times
Default

I read around 15 years ago in "AutoCar" maybe...

"Mercedes is like your trusted wife.... BMW is like your mistress"

well..., at least something along those lines.

Now, you could not say that anymore!

- dm
DrunkenMonk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th October 2005, 01:03   #36
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Sahil's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 5,201
Thanked: 2,091 Times
Default


No wonder every1 wishes to own both ...preferably at the sametime
Sahil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th October 2005, 13:46   #37
BHPian
 
GrimReaper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Mumbai, India
Posts: 261
Thanked: 0 Times
Default

While I would go for the Beemers on the lower end of the spectrum, I would probably go for MB on the higher end. I mean the S, CL, SL, CLS are waaaaay ahead of their BMW counterparts.

One thing though, you all seem to be somewhat basing your opinions on the fact that MB isn't reliable anymore, which is true, but what you'll probably didn't figure out is that neither is BMW. My brother bought a 5 series in London last year thinking its oh so much better than the E, but to his surprise, the 5 sucks. He says that it is underpowered, has a drab interior and reliability sucks. And this is true for quite a lot of 5 ers and 7 series out there. The only difference is MB was KNOWN and RECOGNIZED for its build quality so their image has taken more of a beating than BMW.
Just so you know, when he went back this year, after about 3 weeks his IDrive crashed, so he sent out for repairs since nothing could work without Idrive. The BMW service centre didn't provide him any service and didn't give him a courtesy car which is sorta customary in the UK, US etc. Then about a week ago his IDrive crashed again and is so fed up that hes trying to warn everyone against buying any BMW whatsoever. He finally decided on selling the car and buying another MB or Audi when he returns.
GrimReaper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14th October 2005, 14:04   #38
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bangalore
Posts: 11,883
Thanked: 9,697 Times
Default

...as I harp on Mercedes are on the path to fixing things...at least they are not in denial - main issue is reversing the image which they suffer as a result from. Read as follows:

http://motoring.independent.co.uk/fe...icle318539.ece


From The Bible's Cain to the fashion bibles' Kate, history is full of high-profile falls from grace. But in the car business, little can compare with the decline of Mercedes-Benz: the world's greatest car brand; "engineered like no other car in the world"; a byword for quality and craftsmanship; the globe's best-selling premium car badge. Then, a few years ago, it all went terribly wrong. Quality collapsed.

It isn't just anecdotal evidence from disillusioned Benz buyers, although heavens, there is enough of that. I was a victim, too. My new Mercedes C-class estate was, by some margin, the worst car I have owned, with six unscheduled visits to the (arrogant and lazy) dealer in three disillusioned years of ownership.

Worse for Mercedes, the customer satisfaction surveys backed the gossip. Mercedes plummeted to near the bottom of ownership studies carried out in America, the UK and Germany. It wasn't just trailing its natural premium rivals - BMW, Audi and Lexus. The three-pointed star was frequently behind the mass makers too - the likes of Ford and Vauxhall, and even the Johnny-come-lately Koreans. In one UK survey, the 4x4 M-class was the worst car of all.

Heads rolled. But in the case of Mercedes' supreme boss - DaimlerChrysler chairman Jürgen Schrempp - it took a long time to get him to the scaffold. After pressure from investors, Schrempp finally announced in July that he would be leaving at the end of this year. Company shares jumped 10 per cent.

Schrempp's chairmanship saw much action, but few achievements. He oversaw a lot more than Mercedes slipping from the best quality in the world to near the bottom - as if that wasn't unforgivable enough. He also engineered Mercedes-Benz's disastrous takeover of US mass maker Chrysler in 1998 - which has seen the company's share price fall by almost half. He oversaw an expensive and disastrous alliance with Mitsubishi that floundered just as rival Renault was making a huge success of its Japanese partner, Nissan. The Smart small car business has been a financial catastrophe (although I'm fond of the cars) - overall losses are reckoned at more than £2bn. And the Maybach luxury car brand has been a disaster: sales are a fraction of those anticipated.

So the only way to go, for new boss Dieter Zetsche - moustachioed former head of the Chrysler division, who takes over as chairman on January 1 - is up.

Schrempp's legacy is clearly a large one, but, to loyal customers (and no customers were more loyal than Benz's), the biggest catastrophe of all was Mercedes-Benz's fall into the quality gutter. Mercedes had built the finest cars in the world for probably 40 years, maybe longer. Benz had invented the car. Nobody made tasteful, beautifully wrought, elegantly designed cars as well as Mercedes-Benz.

I bought one almost 10 years ago, a second-hand E-class estate, M-reg, trademark German-racing silver. For four years it provided superb, no-fuss, distinguished transport for self, wife, three small boys and spaniel. I loved its bulletproof build quality, its trustworthiness, its safety, and I loved the feel-good security of driving behind that three-pointed star, sparkling on the grille, standing guard over my family and me. I sold it, to friends, when a company car came my way.
When the company cars ran out, I needed another car and, naturally, we bought another Mercedes. There was no question of buying anything else. We bought a C-class estate from a west London dealer. Not only was the car unreliable, it felt about as solid as a Big Mac carton. Less than three years later, it was gone, with a hefty dose of good riddance (and £15,029 spent regretfully in lease payments).

So where did it all go wrong for the maker of "the best cars in the world"? Back in the 1990s, Mercedes manufacturing processes were old-fashioned and cost-intensive. The result was great quality - at great cost. The upshot was also that Toyota, an exemplar at efficient "lean" production, took less time to make a car than Mercedes took to rectify each fully assembled car. If Mercedes was to stay in business, this could not continue.

Swingeing cost-cutting took place and the whole manufacturing process was reformed. This coincided with the industry trend, keenly followed by Mercedes, to make ever-more complex cars - more features, more gadgets, more complicated electronics (electronic problems, overwhelmingly, are the prime cause of complaints on new Mercedes cars). It also coincided with Mercedes expanding its model range, mostly down market, adding the Smart car, the A-class and the 4x4 M-class (the latter - assembled in a brand new, low-cost factory in Alabama - is probably the worst-made car in Mercedes history). Moving downmarket so often ends in calamity - look what happened to Rover? Add it all together and it spelt disaster.

The good news is that Mercedes knows it, and senior managers acknowledge past mistakes while admitting that the number-one challenge is to fix quality. The three-pointed star is now steadily climbing up customer satisfaction surveys. New versions of the A- and M-class are much improved (the just superseded models were the two dogs of the Mercedes kennel); both are near class-best in craftsmanship and solidity.

Meanwhile, Zetsche, the savvy new head of the Mercedes car division, and - come next year - the head of DaimlerChrysler, too, has promised best-in-class quality. "Our surveys show that quality is now at Mercedes' best-ever levels," claims Zetsche. "And it will get better."

Cost reduction will continue. "But I absolutely reject the notion that lower cost means lower quality," says Zetsche. "If anything, the opposite is true. Good production processes ensure good quality." The precedent is Toyota. It has the lowest costs in the car industry - and the best quality.

So it will not take a turnaround of biblical proportions to transform Benz quality - it's already happening. Restoring the company's damaged reputation, however, will require more of a miracle.
ajmat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th October 2005, 02:17   #39
Senior - BHPian
 
devarshi84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Ahmedabad - Tor
Posts: 3,996
Thanked: 118 Times
Default

who agrees that VOlvo is as good as a Beemer or Merc but lacks that image???
devarshi84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th October 2005, 09:03   #40
Team-BHP Support
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 7,300
Thanked: 23,856 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devarshi84
who agrees that VOlvo is as good as a Beemer or Merc but lacks that image???
In terms of looks and safety, Volvos are just as good as Mercs or Beemes if not better. In other aspects, Volvo is getting there, but still not quite there.
Aditya is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 16th October 2005, 09:52   #41
Senior - BHPian
 
adya33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Pune
Posts: 1,839
Thanked: 91 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aditya
In terms of looks and safety, Volvos are just as good as Mercs or Beemes if not better. In other aspects, Volvo is getting there, but still not quite there.
Volvo's are suppose to be the safest cars
adya33 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th October 2005, 11:10   #42
Senior - BHPian
 
devarshi84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Ahmedabad - Tor
Posts: 3,996
Thanked: 118 Times
Default

the last news I read was that Volvos are still unbeaten in Safety and In my Marketing book( the ever famous Kotler and Armstrong) I read that Volvos spent 25 years on the R&D of seats alone. THe only aspect they still dont have is the image and design of the cars.
devarshi84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th October 2005, 14:32   #43
GTO
Team-BHP Support
 
GTO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bombay
Posts: 47,700
Thanked: 89,125 Times
Default

Quote:
Volvo's are suppose to be the safest cars
Well, Volvos are safe cars but by no means THE safest cars. It was a superb marketing strategy by choosing to play the safety card at the same time that the value of life was increasing exponentially in developed economies. I dont remember which specific models, but there was a showdown between Volvo and Renault in safety tests and Renault beat Volvo raw each and every time.

GTO
GTO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th October 2005, 20:51   #44
BHPian
 
streetlife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: New Delhi, India
Posts: 216
Thanked: 11 Times
Default

A three pointed star for me.....Anyday!!!
streetlife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th October 2005, 02:51   #45
Senior - BHPian
 
devarshi84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Ahmedabad - Tor
Posts: 3,996
Thanked: 118 Times
Default

while volvo maynoy win in some reviews Volvo has given a consistent victory in safety tests.

It like beemer wins in one followed by a volvo and then in another A merc wins followed by a volvo.
devarshi84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Trade Merc SLK350 for Merc SL500? zenzi12 Luxury, Imports & Niche 4 15th June 2012 16:03
Merc E220 or Merc E280 madan009 Luxury, Imports & Niche 27 3rd July 2009 10:53
Some upcoming Merc and BMW's! S350L-E240 The International Automotive Scene 0 9th May 2004 16:56
BMW and MERC Rivals? S350L-E240 The International Automotive Scene 9 5th May 2004 12:32


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 13:04.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks