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Old 1st June 2011, 10:42   #61
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

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Originally Posted by esoticoreventon View Post
Here is the Video of the Mass Hamilton Incident on-board Hamilton's car.


Lewis was significantly faster than Massa before approaching the hairpin. As he approached the hairpin he decided to make a move. Massa saw him and decided to block him rather than let him past. That is obvious in the video.. look at where all the other cars take the corner and look at where Massa turns in. Hamilton would have easily completed the maneuver easily if Massa had sticked to his line. If you watch the Hamilton Maldonado incident its even more apparent that Maldonado turned in too soon in an attempt to prevent Lewis from overtaking.

I'm sorry, but Lewis' anger is more than justified.
I dont agree with you at all.

Look at the video again. Webber is in front of Massa on the outside of Lowes, (he's trying to overtake the car in front of him) therefore he had to turn in slightly earlier.
When he does turn in lewis's front wheels and his rear wheels are aligned. He is by no means alongside, that somewhat happens mid corner after there's contact.
Now how is that justified and not a desperate move?
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Old 1st June 2011, 11:50   #62
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

Quote:
Originally Posted by esoticoreventon View Post
Here is the Video of the Mass Hamilton Incident on-board Hamilton's car.




Lewis was significantly faster than Massa before approaching the hairpin. As he approached the hairpin he decided to make a move. Massa saw him and decided to block him rather than let him past. That is obvious in the video.. look at where all the other cars take the corner and look at where Massa turns in. Hamilton would have easily completed the maneuver easily if Massa had sticked to his line. If you watch the Hamilton Maldonado incident its even more apparent that Maldonado turned in too soon in an attempt to prevent Lewis from overtaking.

I'm sorry, but Lewis' anger is more than justified.
First, Lewis is more than a car length behind Massa. Massa had every right to choose his line through the corner. If they were alongside and Massa had turned in, it would have been his fault.

Second, what kind of driver tries a move by jumping over kerbs. There will be only one result - disaster!

Maybe the Maldonado incident was a bit different (although I feel that was also over-ambitious from a frustrated Lewis) but this incident is clearly Lewis Hamilton's fault.

Massa is right in a way, Hamilton has been involved in dangerous driving ever since he came into Formula 1. There is a huge, easily distinguishable line (not a thin one by any means!) between aggressive driving and dangerous driving and Lewis has more often than not, crossed that line and needs to be reprimanded quite strictly.

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I dont agree with you at all.

Look at the video again. Webber is in front of Massa on the outside of Lowes, (he's trying to overtake the car in front of him) therefore he had to turn in slightly earlier.
When he does turn in lewis's front wheels and his rear wheels are aligned. He is by no means alongside, that somewhat happens mid corner after there's contact.
Now how is that justified and not a desperate move?
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Old 1st June 2011, 11:54   #63
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

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Originally Posted by esoticoreventon View Post
Lewis was significantly faster than Massa before approaching the hairpin. As he approached the hairpin he decided to make a move. Massa saw him and decided to block him rather than let him past. That is obvious in the video.. look at where all the other cars take the corner and look at where Massa turns in. Hamilton would have easily completed the maneuver easily if Massa had sticked to his line. If you watch the Hamilton Maldonado incident its even more apparent that Maldonado turned in too soon in an attempt to prevent Lewis from overtaking.

I'm sorry, but Lewis' anger is more than justified.
Lewis was faster because he took the inside line before the hairpin. Felipe was not a back marker so you cannot just expect him to give away his position just like that. He tried to block since he was in front, a full car length and was pretty fair in doing so. I still think Lewis was being a little too aggressive just like his idol Senna but he should remember that he is no Senna.

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Old 1st June 2011, 13:12   #64
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

Quote:
Originally Posted by esoticoreventon View Post
Here is the Video of the Mass Hamilton Incident on-board Hamilton's car.




Lewis was significantly faster than Massa before approaching the hairpin. As he approached the hairpin he decided to make a move. Massa saw him and decided to block him rather than let him past. That is obvious in the video.. look at where all the other cars take the corner and look at where Massa turns in. Hamilton would have easily completed the maneuver easily if Massa had sticked to his line. If you watch the Hamilton Maldonado incident its even more apparent that Maldonado turned in too soon in an attempt to prevent Lewis from overtaking.
Want to know how the overtaking was supposed to happen

Watch this...



and this....



Its about placing your car in the right spot when you enter that corner. What Lewis tried was stupid and this is not the first time. See this

Name:  248070_10150210311368919_565918918_7189173_1684644_n.jpg
Views: 776
Size:  76.1 KB

And... When you screw it up like this which Paul Di Riesta also did and got a drive through penaly, he says this...

autosport.com - F1 News: Di Resta frustrated with himself

compared to calling the stewards as racists!

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I'm sorry, but Lewis' anger is more than justified.
Lewis's anger was supposed to be a silly joke right!? At least thats what he told the stewards later!
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Old 1st June 2011, 13:23   #65
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

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Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
Want to know how the overtaking was supposed to happen

Watch this...



and this....



Its about placing your car in the right spot when you enter that corner. What Lewis tried was stupid and this is not the first time. See this

Attachment 553427

And... When you screw it up like this which Paul Di Riesta also did and got a drive through penaly, he says this...

autosport.com - F1 News: Di Resta frustrated with himself

compared to calling the stewards as racists!



Lewis's anger was supposed to be a silly joke right!? At least thats what he told the stewards later!
Absolutely right. The move on Lewis was very well done. Nico though seemed to be a bit too generous about it. Hamilton should watch and learn.
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Old 1st June 2011, 13:56   #66
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

Not that I am a lewis Hamilton fan [am a Ferrari Fan], but to be fair to him, in the move by Schumacher on Nico, Schumi was in a position similar to that of Hamilton. Thing is, Schumi made the move on his team mate who probably realised it is important to let the faster partner through. That was not the case with Hamilton. Had he tried the move on Button, then, maybe, Button would have let him through.
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Old 3rd June 2011, 12:52   #67
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

F1 needs more Hamiltons. When he is driving, even on a circuit like Monaco, you know that he will try to pass given the slightest opportunity. They are not in a traffic procession to be honest for him to honor the cars which are infront of him. If he just sits in there waiting for things to happen, then he will be like any other average driver. The likes of him, Kobayashi, Sato, JPM make F1 exciting. These are drivers who have the ability to make you sit on the edge of your seat during race weekends. Bring it on.
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Old 3rd June 2011, 14:32   #68
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

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Originally Posted by RacingForIndia View Post
F1 needs more Hamiltons.
I agree and he needs to stop calling other drivers 'ridiculous' and stop blaming them for his stupidity on track! Most drivers have come up the ranks and deserved each and every bit of their racing seat by their talent. Finally, blaming the stewards for punishing him because he is black really showed his personality.

Quote:
When he is driving, even on a circuit like Monaco, you know that he will try to pass given the slightest opportunity. They are not in a traffic procession to be honest for him to honor the cars which are infront of him.
Its funny when you say this, the other drivers are paid millions to follow other cars like they do in a traffic procession? Everyone fights on the track, the difference is no one makes it look like demolition derby!

And none of the video feed shows that he had any opportunity to overtake. He simply wanted the cars in front to move away. Maldonaldo's crash with Hamilton was so typical, Maldonaldo held his racing line while Hamilton kept his nose along side his car only to punt him off.

Quote:
If he just sits in there waiting for things to happen, then he will be like any other average driver. The likes of him, Kobayashi, Sato, JPM make F1 exciting. These are drivers who have the ability to make you sit on the edge of your seat during race weekends. Bring it on.
Nobody waited in Monaco behind any car. Webber did a superb move on Kobayashi and Michael infact overtook Hamilton in the same curve where Hamilton pulled a stupid move on Massa. I dont want to sit on the edge of my seat wondering who's next to be taken out by Hamilton.
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Old 3rd June 2011, 15:20   #69
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Arrow Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
I agree and he needs to stop calling other drivers 'ridiculous' and stop blaming them for his stupidity on track! Most drivers have come up the ranks and deserved each and every bit of their racing seat by their talent. Finally, blaming the stewards for punishing him because he is black really showed his personality.



Its funny when you say this, the other drivers are paid millions to follow other cars like they do in a traffic procession? Everyone fights on the track, the difference is no one makes it look like demolition derby!

And none of the video feed shows that he had any opportunity to overtake. He simply wanted the cars in front to move away. Maldonaldo's crash with Hamilton was so typical, Maldonaldo held his racing line while Hamilton kept his nose along side his car only to punt him off.



Nobody waited in Monaco behind any car. Webber did a superb move on Kobayashi and Michael infact overtook Hamilton in the same curve where Hamilton pulled a stupid move on Massa. I dont want to sit on the edge of my seat wondering who's next to be taken out by Hamilton.
Going by your post, it seems every car which Hamilton passed, he passed it only after crashing into it.
Michaels pass on Hamilton was immaculate, and so was Webbers, but thats not to say that they are good at making passes than Hamilton.
What other drivers are paid is none of my business, but when I am watching a race I like to see some excitement (note, "just" plain overtaking is not my idea of excitement). Hamiltonís driving provides me with that, and sometimes disappointment too, but heck I'd be disappointed to see him end up in barriers for a botched up overtaking than see him driving around in circles and getting his and the others cars around him swanky clean back to the pits after the race.
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Old 3rd June 2011, 17:07   #70
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

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Originally Posted by RacingForIndia View Post
Going by your post, it seems every car which Hamilton passed, he passed it only after crashing into it.
Atleast in Monaco, he did!

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Michaels pass on Hamilton was immaculate, and so was Webbers, but thats not to say that they are good at making passes than Hamilton.
That doesnt mean, he is good at making passes! If he was, then what happened in Monaco? And please dont compare him to Michael.

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What other drivers are paid is none of my business, but when I am watching a race I like to see some excitement (note, "just" plain overtaking is not my idea of excitement). Hamiltonís driving provides me with that, and sometimes disappointment too, but heck I'd be disappointed to see him end up in barriers for a botched up overtaking than see him driving around in circles and getting his and the others cars around him swanky clean back to the pits after the race.
Driving around in circles? I hope you are not talking about 2011 season, there are not many races where drivers were going around in circles.

All I need is fair racing and I am not too old to fancy cars going around in circles with no fun!
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Old 3rd June 2011, 17:51   #71
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Arrow Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

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Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
Atleast in Monaco, he did!
We must be watcing different races then.

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Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
That doesnt mean, he is good at making passes! If he was, then what happened in Monaco? And please dont compare him to Michael.
Woah another Michael fan? I rest my case, as experience tells me that its hard to break ice with the Tifosi.

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Driving around in circles? I hope you are not talking about 2011 season, there are not many races where drivers were going around in circles.
Well, I was referring to racing in general. Dont they all drive around in circles at circuits? Jokes apart, I think you missed the point there.

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All I need is fair racing and I am not too old to fancy cars going around in circles with no fun!
I am all for fair racing, and to be frank, Monaco is hardly a place where you can race. So if someone tries to race, give him credit. Accidents are part of racing anyways.
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Old 3rd June 2011, 18:14   #72
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

@racingforindia and anachronix- The discussion between the two of you is as interesting as the race itself if not more.

About Hamilton, I like the guy for his shear talent. I hate him for the way he behaves when he is not behaving. He did pull a stonkingly awesome overtaking maneuver down the pit straight but other than that I don't know what he was thinking when trying to overatke massa and maldonado. Getting your front wheel alongside the car-in-fronts back wheel doesn't mean you are alongside him!

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Old 3rd June 2011, 18:27   #73
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

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Originally Posted by RacingForIndia View Post
We must be watcing different races then.
I was watching Formula1 race in Monaco, BTW! What were you watching?

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Woah another Michael fan? I rest my case, as experience tells me that its hard to break ice with the Tifosi.
So what?

Quote:
Well, I was referring to racing in general. Dont they all drive around in circles at circuits? Jokes apart, I think you missed the point there.
Dude, dont read too much into my words. I was saying that overtaking has been made easy with DRS and KERS this season. And in Monaco we saw some good overtaking too.

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I am all for fair racing, and to be frank, Monaco is hardly a place where you can race. So if someone tries to race, give him credit. Accidents are part of racing anyways.
Accidents are part of racing when it happens while you are on the limit of racing or when a driver is on the limits with his stupidity. Which one are you talking about?
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Old 3rd June 2011, 18:38   #74
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Arrow Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

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Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
I was watching Formula1 race in Monaco, BTW! What were you watching?
Different channels then?

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Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
So what?
Well I have some well documented posts on team-bhp and some other f1 forums where I have debated on the legitimacy of Michael Schumacher, as a racing driver. But thatís a topic for another day.
Besides I did say that MS overtook LH well during the race, so I dont know what you were trying to get at?


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Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
Dude, dont read too much into my words. I was saying that overtaking has been made easy with DRS and KERS this season. And in Monaco we saw some good overtaking too.
Overtaking comes at a cost even on the normal roads on which we drive every day. On a racing cirsuit, the cost is exponential, in case of an accident.

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Accidents are part of racing when it happens while you are on the limit of racing or when a driver is on the limits with his stupidity. Which one are you talking about?
If someone has the racing line then he has a right to stick to his line in my opinion. LM on Massa was optimistic, but he was well on the inside for Maldonado. Neither of the drivers gave up. A crash was imminent.
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Old 3rd June 2011, 18:42   #75
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Default Re: F1 2011 -Grand Prix De Monaco

@scuderiamania
The only reason why I support Hamilton is because of the way he drives on track. He gets involved in the action, and action can have accident as a possible out come.
He may be wrong, I dont have the luxury of multiple cameras and telementry to judge, but I support his driving style.
His off track antics are, childish at best.
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