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Old 14th May 2012, 08:25   #76
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Default Re: 2012 F1 - Spanish Grand Prix

What a disgrace from the Senna family!? It was Michael's mistake and he should have been careful while trying to pass the limping Senna. Its always the mistake of the following car in case of a rear end crash. However, the disgrace moved more than once in the braking zone making it even trickier for the old man.

Great job by Pastor, he did push at the right time and kept a safe distance from Alonso. Alonso getting stuck behind Pic before his 2nd stop made sure Alonso never got too close to Pastor!

Kamikaze Koba, man what a way to embarrass Mr.Smooth on tires

Something I am unable to understand in F1 2012...

Australia: Mclaren looked like they have the best car and looked so bloody quick while the whole field was nowhere close.

Malaysia: Mclaren was on pole, but there was a flying Sauber which was faster than anyone on that weekend. Mclaren was no where close...

China: The Mercedes was very quick where everyone was expecting them to suffer from degradation.

Bahrain: The Redbull was bloody quick, the Renaults were flying faster than anyone on the field.

Spain: A Williams comes out of nowhere and dominates the race while the others struggle.

None of the smaller teams have been able to repeat their performance and we have the 5th different winner of the season now! I am confused, why there is this pattern!? I would definitely watch for the Williams in Monaco.
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Old 14th May 2012, 08:51   #77
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After seeing the videos of the crash i believe schumi was definitely at fault rear ending a slow moving car, whether senna moved twice or not you can't just crash into anybody like that and say that the other guy is an idiot. I think schumi has lost it this year, see how many times he is involved in crashes. Sad but true.
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Old 14th May 2012, 09:57   #78
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Default Re: 2012 F1 - Spanish Grand Prix

Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
What a disgrace from the Senna family!? It was Michael's mistake and he should have been careful while trying to pass the limping Senna. Its always the mistake of the following car in case of a rear end crash. However, the disgrace moved more than once in the braking zone making it even trickier for the old man.
You cannot call Bruno a 'disgrace'. He is fortunate and unfortuate to have 'Senna' as his last name and that has got nothing to do with his driving skills.
He's made it to F1 and that shows that he knows how to drive really well. I believe it is not fair to compare him with the other 'Senna'

Last edited by Rehaan : 15th May 2012 at 10:57. Reason: Fixing quote
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Old 14th May 2012, 10:11   #79
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Default Re: 2012 F1 - Spanish Grand Prix

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Originally Posted by anachronix View Post

Something I am unable to understand in F1 2012...

Australia: Mclaren looked like they have the best car and looked so bloody quick while the whole field was nowhere close.

Malaysia: Mclaren was on pole, but there was a flying Sauber which was faster than anyone on that weekend. Mclaren was no where close...

China: The Mercedes was very quick where everyone was expecting them to suffer from degradation.

Bahrain: The Redbull was bloody quick, the Renaults were flying faster than anyone on the field.

Spain: A Williams comes out of nowhere and dominates the race while the others struggle.

None of the smaller teams have been able to repeat their performance and we have the 5th different winner of the season now! I am confused, why there is this pattern!? I would definitely watch for the Williams in Monaco.
my two cents, it is the stupid pirellis ( as ordered by Bernie).
Earlier, depending on downforce levels, some circuits suited some teams. Today, with the Pirellis, it is a matter of chance. Wouldn't be surprised to see a Caterham on podium or better, this season, unless they change the Pirellis.
May be there is a move afoot for that. Pl see Pirelli comments in
Formula 1

I quote the relevant words
Quote:
The tyres contributed to an extremely entertaining and tense race, but as official supplier we will always follow the wishes of the teams and the promoter and our future development direction will be dictated by what they want.
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Old 14th May 2012, 10:24   #80
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Grrr!!!!!! Thanks to BESCOM, puwer cut just when the lights turned green. Back around the 20th and then out again with 4 laps remaining. So very frustrating.

So, Congratulations to Maldonado. What an amazing turn of events. If the bits that I saw on tv, he did extremely well, but for the Ferrari straightline speeds, I dotn think Alonso would be that close to him.

As someone said somewhere above, the way races are ending this season thus far, I wouldnt be too surprised if we see SFI on pole and winning it!! Paul seems capable enough!! If that happens in Delhi if not earlier would be the bestest best ever!!!!
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Old 14th May 2012, 10:42   #81
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Originally Posted by akshay380 View Post
Congrats to Paster and Sir Frank.

For me driver of the day is either Paster or Lewis. Wonderful drive by LH today. Finishing 8th starting from 24th and in just 2 stops while everyone else went for 3/4 stops. He did 30 laps on the hard compound. Respect! Luckily McLarens did not screw(relatively) his pitstops this time.

Lewis had a great race IMO, one more lap and he was challenging the 7th position on tyres which were over due. He did have a moment at the pits but luckily no damage done. McLaren has lost the plot this season sometimes Button outperforms LH and sometimes LH out performs Button.

More than the driver, car, circuit, weather the results are more dependent on tyres. One single element should not be allowed to control the results which is a big big let down this season.
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Old 14th May 2012, 10:43   #82
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On a funny note: Kobayashi should conduct overtaking classes for the rest of the field. That guy pulls off amazing maneuvers.
Terror of Kobayashi. You need to decide, you want some points or no points and DNF against your name. That was really good when he overtook Mercedes - Roseberg.
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Old 14th May 2012, 10:47   #83
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Default Re: 2012 F1 - Spanish Grand Prix

Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
What a disgrace from the Senna family!? It was Michael's mistake and he should have been careful while trying to pass the limping Senna. Its always the mistake of the following car in case of a rear end crash. However, the disgrace moved more than once in the braking zone making it even trickier for the old man.
What's so disgraceful about him? Aryton Senna wasn't the only Senna in the world. If his uncle was a far superior driver that doesn't mean he shouldn't try as he lacks that kind of talent. I remember reading somewhere that after his uncle's death, his family took him out of racing and he returned to it after a gap of almost 10 years. Bruno Senna - F1 Fanatic



and here's a video I found on youtube of the crash. I couldn't find when Senna moved more than once. Can you help? What I see is MS switching from outside to inside and rear-ending him.

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my two cents, it is the stupid pirellis ( as ordered by Bernie).
Earlier, depending on downforce levels, some circuits suited some teams. Today, with the Pirellis, it is a matter of chance. Wouldn't be surprised to see a Caterham on podium or better, this season, unless they change the Pirellis.
May be there is a move afoot for that. Pl see Pirelli comments in
Formula 1
Credit where credits due. There are many teams who have done a good job this year (pessimistically put - lack of understanding of tyres is hurting the big teams more than the smaller ones. Optimistically put - smaller teams have understood them better). As much as everyone likes to blame Pirellis, this is still not a lottery. HRT is still 4-6 seconds behind, then is Marrusia and then Caterham. Mclaren has won once and could have been in hunt on 2 more occasions had it not been for their pit stop blunders (Jension in China, Lewis in qualifying on Sat). Besides China, Mercedes has never been close to the top. Same for RBR (Bahrain blip). Teams (till Force India) are very close this year and a slightly off day for someone means they go hurtling back.
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Old 14th May 2012, 10:57   #84
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Default Re: 2012 F1 - Spanish Grand Prix

Quote:
Originally Posted by mgh View Post
my two cents, it is the stupid pirellis ( as ordered by Bernie).
Earlier, depending on downforce levels, some circuits suited some teams. Today, with the Pirellis, it is a matter of chance. Wouldn't be surprised to see a Caterham on podium or better, this season, unless they change the Pirellis.
May be there is a move afoot for that. Pl see Pirelli comments in
Formula 1

I quote the relevant words
Lets not get carried away. Teams are understanding the Pirelli's a little more with every race. Give it some time for things to settle down. Let me assure you, will not see a Caterham/Marussia/HRT on the podium this season, Webber will not beat Vettel and Massa will not beat Alonso.

You should just sit back and enjoy the racing.
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Old 14th May 2012, 12:06   #85
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Originally Posted by Hatari View Post
Lets not get carried away. Teams are understanding the Pirelli's a little more with every race. Give it some time for things to settle down. Let me assure you, will not see a Caterham/Marussia/HRT on the podium this season, Webber will not beat Vettel and Massa will not beat Alonso.

You should just sit back and enjoy the racing.
After yesterdays race I think the same too. That falling off the cliff did not happen though Kimi was on verge of it before his first stop.
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Old 14th May 2012, 12:25   #86
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Default Re: 2012 F1 - Spanish Grand Prix

Senna's car has been burnt completely. See attached pic.
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Old 14th May 2012, 13:06   #87
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Default Re: 2012 F1 - Spanish Grand Prix

Great video and its sad that you want to miss the obvious! I am very lazy at editing videos trying to prove things. I will do it once and only once mate just to state the obvious

PS: Use the pit line as reference to judge Senna's car position!

Senna moving to the inside line trying to defend

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Michael trying to get in Senna's slipstream

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Senna has moved well to the inside line trying to avoid Michael getting into his slipstream

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Michael trying to take the outside line as Senna goes to the inside line of defence

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Senna comes back to the racing line

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Coming closer now...

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Michael trying to go back to the inside line, but Senna brakes early because of his shot off tires. Seconds to impact now...

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Boom....

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See it, if you can really see it mate! Its tricky to judge that kind of movement into a braking zone and he did move around confusing the old man forcing him into a mistake. I would still blame Michael for being too aggressive to get past Senna and he should have been aware of how stupid he can get. He did already in Brazil 2011 and now again!

I am going to try and call him Bruno from now, he is only doing more damage to that big name in F1. When a Williams was capable of winning, here was another kid in his 3rd year in F1 spinning off into the gravel in Qualifying and does things nothing short of stupid in the race!

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What's so disgraceful about him? Aryton Senna wasn't the only Senna in the world. If his uncle was a far superior driver that doesn't mean he shouldn't try as he lacks that kind of talent. I remember reading somewhere that after his uncle's death, his family took him out of racing and he returned to it after a gap of almost 10 years. Bruno Senna - F1 Fanatic

Last edited by anachronix : 14th May 2012 at 13:08.
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Old 14th May 2012, 13:22   #88
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See it, if you can really see it mate!
My closing argument, if you really see it mate, he made that "move" when MS was a long way behind him. Basically he took the middle line early long before MS was within 5-10 car lengths behind him, so technically he made only one move which was just before the braking zone. That unsettled MS into crashing into him. I think with the kind of defense tactics MS has used over the years, he should have been used to this by now. It wasn't nearly as bad as MS defending from RB at Hungary 2010.

Fortunately, stewards agree with me.
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Old 14th May 2012, 13:23   #89
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Senna did two moves, both legal as per the rules, so I don't understand how he could be at fault here.
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Old 14th May 2012, 13:26   #90
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My closing argument, if you really see it mate, he made that "move" when MS was a long way behind him. Basically he took the middle line early long before MS was within 5-10 car lengths behind him, so technically he made only one move which was just before the braking zone. That unsettled MS into crashing into him. I think with the kind of defense tactics MS has used over the years, he should have been used to this by now. It wasn't nearly as bad as MS defending from RB at Hungary 2010.
Racing line -> Inside line -> Racing line is not technically moving once!

Quote:
Fortunately, stewards agree with me.
I have even agreed that its a mistake from Michael, its not only the stewards that agree with you
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