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Old 13th September 2013, 15:43   #31
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

My few thoughts on the ongoing progress of 2014. Kimi and alonso will form a formidable team, where neither is going to relent to the other no matter what the circumstances are. Although, kimi seems more like the person who would withdraw before alonso does, as alonso will fight till the end. My opinion. With the new regulations in place and the turbocharged engines and aerodynamics revised per the new specifications, its gonna be a clean slate for everyone.

Although, i feel redbull will still carry the momentum forward but they might lack the initial success with the new regulations.

Ferrari, Alonso and kimi will pose a challenge right from day one, with the mercedes of lewis also springing a few surprises here and there. Ricciardo, although graduate from the sister team doesnt really show the same intensity or spark as vettel does. He has been pushed into the senior team more like an obligation to their program. People forget vettel won in a toro rosso before his success at redbull. He will probably be an also ran till he finds his footing in the new car.

Lotus does not have a chance without kimi, and with their finanicial woes it may quite be likely they would settle as a midfield team or may not even see the whole year. If mclaren is serious about posing a challenge to anyone for the WDC or WCC, they should get rid of both their drivers asap. They dont have an alpha male typa guy to run the show. With lewis gone, button is just a fish out of water. He got lucky with his championship in 2009 where brawn exploited a fine print rule. Although, his second half of the championship season was dismal after redbull posed a serious challenge for the championships. Maybe Hulkenburg to Mclaren isnt such a bad idea. For the rest of the guys its gonna be normal running as usual. Felipe could find a vacant seat in Sauber, as he has strong ties to the team, also ferrari could put in a word for him.
Just a few thoughts. ...
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Old 13th September 2013, 17:18   #32
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

Completely agree..

Raikkonen will lift Alonso - Webber
http://en.espnf1.com/ferrari/motorsp...ry/124999.html
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Old 13th September 2013, 17:58   #33
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

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Originally Posted by sanjbmw2001 View Post
My two cents...

I see a majority of the folks are excited about the Kimi move.

I for one have a different view point.

Kimi should have stayed at Lotus (provided he had assurances of development and finance).

From a neutral standpoint it would make the sport more interesting. Having to view 3/4 teams dicing for the championship.

As it stands now the chances are that next year the fight would be between RB and Ferrai.

I would rather have top drivers in different teams to keep the sport entertaining and interesting.
I for one disagree with my two cents on this, the reasons Kimi opted out of Lotus are multifold:
  1. His salary was not paid out on time, only the management knows the details but he was on a retainer that was incentive based. No one, least of all Eric Bouiller, expected him to score that many points on his return from WRC. Why would Kimi (or anyone else) drive the socks of a car and not be paid for doing it? Easy reason there for me.
  2. The highly rated James Allison quit for Ferrari Mid season, see any connection to their recent slump in form in the last races?
  3. With the new engine regulations in 2014, Mercedes and Ferrari are best placed with engine development and its implications on the design of the new car. Customer teams such as Redbull, Mclaren and Lotus are expected to work doubly harder to keep up (but again depends on your design team). This is the very reason why Kimi, during contract negotiations, pushed for an increased investment in Lotus from Renault. I was impressed that Kimi cared enough to push for such an engagement, it shows that he (or his management) are thinking ahead.

And in light of these very reasons, I don't see why Kimi staying back at Lotus would have given us 3-4 teams fighting for the championship. If anything Kimi up against Alonso will garner way more attention from the media. Nothing like pitting your top dogs against each other, Bernie Ecclestone will be rubbing his palms in glee.
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Old 13th September 2013, 18:32   #34
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

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Originally Posted by TNiranjanT View Post
I for one disagree with my two cents on this, the reasons Kimi opted out of Lotus are multifold:
  1. His salary was not paid out on time, only the management knows the details but he was on a retainer that was incentive based. No one, least of all Eric Bouiller, expected him to score that many points on his return from WRC. Why would Kimi (or anyone else) drive the socks of a car and not be paid for doing it? Easy reason there for me.
  2. The highly rated James Allison quit for Ferrari Mid season, see any connection to their recent slump in form in the last races?
  3. With the new engine regulations in 2014, Mercedes and Ferrari are best placed with engine development and its implications on the design of the new car. Customer teams such as Redbull, Mclaren and Lotus are expected to work doubly harder to keep up (but again depends on your design team). This is the very reason why Kimi, during contract negotiations, pushed for an increased investment in Lotus from Renault. I was impressed that Kimi cared enough to push for such an engagement, it shows that he (or his management) are thinking ahead.

And in light of these very reasons, I don't see why Kimi staying back at Lotus would have given us 3-4 teams fighting for the championship. If anything Kimi up against Alonso will garner way more attention from the media. Nothing like pitting your top dogs against each other, Bernie Ecclestone will be rubbing his palms in glee.
The points mentioned are valid and it is understandable why Kimi moved. However as a spectator sport it may become boring, similar thing happened when MSC was winning in his sleep. The viewership dropped. I fear the same may happen again if only two teams are on the podium every time.

We'll know soon enough.
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Old 13th September 2013, 19:57   #35
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

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Originally Posted by sanjbmw2001 View Post
The points mentioned are valid and it is understandable why Kimi moved. However as a spectator sport it may become boring, similar thing happened when MSC was winning in his sleep. The viewership dropped. I fear the same may happen again if only two teams are on the podium every time.

We'll know soon enough.
Agreed my friend, but 2 different teams on the podium IMHO is better that having finger boy on the top step
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Old 13th September 2013, 23:41   #36
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

This may well turn out to be like the legandary Prost and Senna rivalry when they were paired in McLaren. Both Alonso and Kimi will hold nothing back for a win. Kimi will not play second fiddle to Alonso, Ferrari might have got the indication with Kimi's "Just leave me alone, I know what I'm doing!" message in Abu Dhabi.

It will surely make the race weekend exciting for F1 fans. One can only hope that their personal relation doesn't deteriorate like Prost and Senna's
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Old 15th September 2013, 23:18   #37
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

This is a much anticipated and much required move for both Raikkonen and Ferrari.

Raikkonen has proven since his return that he has not lost his blinding speed and also has gained maturity to know the finishing races in points is more important than just pushing hard (2005 season comes to mind). However, the biggest drawback of Lotus in last 2 years has been their lack of financial muscle. They started the seasons strongly (a win this year), but simply couldn't do much when the big boys caught up by throwing money towards development.

Ferrari has been sending the right signals lately, first by signing James Allison and Lotus aero-chief (forgot the name). They followed it up by sending Massa packing and hiring Raikkonen. With a big overhaul of engine regulations coming up, they have as good a chance as Red Bull and Mercedes next season. However the biggest challenge remains that of Seb + Newey + brilliant Renault engines.

In a way, it's sad that Rob Smedley is moving to Williams next season. Would have been entertaining to listen the most elaborate race engineer paired with the driver who dislikes the radio communication. What a missed opportunity of more "leave me alone" moments
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Old 15th September 2013, 23:55   #38
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by TNiranjanT View Post
  1. His salary was not paid out on time, only the management knows the details but he was on a retainer that was incentive based. No one, least of all Eric Bouiller, expected him to score that many points on his return from WRC. Why would Kimi (or anyone else) drive the socks of a car and not be paid for doing it? Easy reason there for me.
  2. The highly rated James Allison quit for Ferrari Mid season, see any connection to their recent slump in form in the last races?
  3. With the new engine regulations in 2014, Mercedes and Ferrari are best placed with engine development and its implications on the design of the new car. Customer teams such as Redbull, Mclaren and Lotus are expected to work doubly harder to keep up (but again depends on your design team). This is the very reason why Kimi, during contract negotiations, pushed for an increased investment in Lotus from Renault. I was impressed that Kimi cared enough to push for such an engagement, it shows that he (or his management) are thinking ahead.
Very valid points for Kimi leaving Lotus. I don't think anyone except Kimi thought his comeback would be so strong. For Ferrari to sign-up Kimi partnering Alonso, there are quite a few factors in favour of it
Kimi's their latest WDC champ and he's a known quantity to the current Ferrari management. They know each other well having worked together for 3 yrs.

2 WDC's in the team will push development much faster than the current situation. Kimi's 'don't give a sh**' attitude I think is partly down to the man, and partly down to the image portrayed by the man. You don't get to be one of the highest regarded drivers in this technical era of F1 without caring about what goes in the car - its a bit of smoke and mirrors. Ferrari know that.

What will be interesting to see is how Alonso reacts when Kimi beats him in a few races next year. They're evenly matched, so either one will have the upper hand in a few weekends next year. Historically it hasn't bothered Kimi much when his teammate finishes ahead of him, but Alonso has on multiple occasions shown his character by throwing tantrums when things dont go his way - the latest episode with LDM is a good example. I don't think that part of him has aged gracefully and it will become evident next year.

I think i'll get back to regularly watching F1 on sunday evenings just to see how things pan out next year. It looks to be a fire cracker season!
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Old 16th September 2013, 18:07   #39
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

Kimi is a guy who just loves to race.period.A true professional who gets the job done which is to bring home his machinery as high up the order as possible.He is not bothered about his team mate's position. His commitment to getting the job done is legendary as indicated below.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A58531610
This was after he was dropped by ferrari for the 2010 season. How much he contributes to the development of a car is debatable. But you can rest assured that he will drive the wheels of that ferrari come 2014.
NOw where does that leave fernando is the big question.Fernando Alonso like schumacher wants the car developed around him and out of sheer personal necessity contributes significantly to making the car competitive as the season progresses. I am pretty sure that Alonso will feel offended if Raikkonen finishes better than him, as it is Alonso who contributes more towards development and should hence reap the rewards.Interesting times ahead.
One thing about this transfer is certain. Kimi is hungry for a competitive car to take the challenge to the opposition.The ferrari drive was his for the taking. His primary objective was a drive at RBR. Ferrari was just a second choice.
ON an emotional level,I would have loved to see Raikkonen remain at lotus, two misfits in such a competitively charged environment just having a good time.
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Old 18th September 2013, 14:10   #40
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

The news of Kimi joining Alonso at Ferrari for the 2014 season sounds like great news for the fans. However, I do have a feeling that there are some ruptures in the Ferrari camp.

Alonso would not have been totally ok given the choice of hiring Kimi. He is a straight racer no doubt, but there has to be questions in his mind as to if he is the only golden boy in the team now that Kimi is coming next year. Alonso can have a 'fit' and we all know what happened at Mclaren in 2007. Lets hope he has grown up a bit.

Kimi is awesome if the car and him come together on the day of the GP. He isnt known a lot for driver feedback to the tech team. James Allison has worked close with him for a season and a half and reckons he has improved a lot. One of the positives is that, Kimi and Alonso have similar driving style. They are outright on the limit all the time. They dont have a gentle side like jenson button for example. That should help develop the car towards one direction through the season unlike Massa who loves a under-steering vehicle.

Nevertheless, Kimi and Alonso will give stability in scoring points and we shouldnt be seeing those days when it seems like Ferrari is only shielding one car for the race.

Ferrari have everything in place to go back to winning championships. Here's hoping they can be back on top.
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Old 18th September 2013, 15:09   #41
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

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Nevertheless, Kimi and Alonso will give stability in scoring points and we shouldnt be seeing those days when it seems like Ferrari is only shielding one car for the race.
I completely agree with you on the fielding 2 cars part. It is a real shame that Redbull gets away favouring one driver just because their competitors are doing the same.
Worst Case Scenario : Imagine the situation continues as it is now - meaning Vettel running away with race wins - but Alonso-Kimi snare 2nd and 3rd positions consistently.
The constructors championship standings will surely be led by Ferrari, so Redbull may be forced to opt for a frontline driver instead of recruiting from STR to counteract this.
Although hypothetical, this points towards gripping races which is what we all want.

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Originally Posted by Fullrevs View Post
Ferrari have everything in place to go back to winning championships. Here's hoping they can be back on top.
They dont have everything they need yet.
Aren't we all overlooking the car itself ?
We dont have a clue which one of the engines will shine and already we are excited purely by the driver selection.
This is what was missing in the past few seasons. Feels good.

Resources-wise Ferrari have put together a formidable team
It remains to be seen if Adrian Newey and team outwit the rest of the field again in the development race.
I hope the car is good and ferrari get back to winning chamionships.
Actually, the wish should be that Ferrari, Redbull and Mercedes should have great cars and races should be fought, won or lost on the track.
It would still be a shame if one of them won it from the factory itself.
If that happens, then I hope its Ferrari

Quote:
Originally Posted by gomzi View Post
I think i'll get back to regularly watching F1 on sunday evenings just to see how things pan out next year. It looks to be a fire cracker season!
Bernie will be rubbing his palms with glee when he reads reactions like yours.
Mission Accomplished. Thank you Ferrari!
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Old 19th September 2013, 10:03   #42
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

I think it is a superb-yet-incredibly-risky move by both Ferrari and KR's management. After a long time, we will now have two teams (Merc & Ferrari) with drivers who can match each other, than play second fiddle, in the same team. It can all easily go terribly wrong, so I hope Ferrari have thought this through quite well. Though, I have to say, Kimi is more pragmatic than Lewis in his early days, so the drama is likely to be close to none form him.

For FA, it is indeed a downer. He was to have brought home at least the WDC and/or the WCC to Ferrari. That simply has not happened and it will remain the missing part that would have made him legendary when he finally hangs up his racing boots.

But the move does make a lot of sense. F1 in the Pirelli-only era has become more of a team sport than it has ever been before. Unless weather/accidents become a factor, you need a strong driver, strong car and strong strategy to win races and the WDC/WCC. RBR's wins have been a combination of Newey, the race management and some spectacular driving by Vettel (no, I'm not a fan of his, but he is far better than what most of his critics would like to give him credit for). Something like that happens only once-in-a-decade, like the Brawn/Bryne/Schumacher combination.

We are no longer in the era where you put a great driver in a decent car and he'll just rip through the field. The top-ten drivers are all fairly matched up to 80% in both equipment and talent.

It is also an era where DNFs and low-scoring races make you pay a price that is hard to recover from, unless you can win regularly. You simply canot offset the downsides of not finishing/finishing lower than the competition without race wins.

And winning regularly is not the same as being in the front-running pack. Being in the pack, keeps you in touch with the leader at ~20-30 points, but the moment you have a DNF, you're out of the reckoning, unless you can conjure up a win. This is the problem that KR has with Lotus and not money, from what I understand. They can't win much, if any at all and all that KR wants to do is to race for wins.

As the current and past seasons have shown, you will have a DNF or two in a season. A 30+ unbroken points-scoring stint is not something you can keep pulling off regularly and it certainly won't win you a WDC if you can't have a smattering of wins in those finishes.

Lotus is the best compromise package in the current field. It does a lot of things quite well, but it does not do a single thing absolutely well. The car used to have a small advantage earlier in how it used up the tyres, but even that has been decimated in recent times. The only place on the grid that guarantees wins consistently with the Lotus package is the pole position and the car is not good enough to be there regularly.

Then there is the strategy. The best strategies maximize your strengths and minimizes your weaknesses. Lotus simply has not been able to manage that with both their drivers and their cars. It is not that they have a bad car, or a bad team, or a bad driver. They just have a bad combination or all three. Their package makes them pay a price for mistakes that is much greater than what the other teams pay and they keep making those at regular intervals.

In short, Lotus has a tiny operating window to be on the offensive and at every other instance they have been and will be on the defensive, unless 2014 turns up a bit of a miracle, which is unlikely looking at the current evidence.

For Ferrari, short of abducting Newey and keeping him hostage at Maranello (should he refuse to join Ferrari), the best route to get a combination that can take on the might of the RBR dream team is to have two good drivers at the front setting the agenda than responding to the agenda set by RBR and Merc. To do that you need a driver, alongside Nando, who is not a prima donna and KR fits that role quite well.

If, come end of 2014, both the WCC and WDC trophies wind up at Maranello, LdM could not care less who won the WDC. It will end the post Kimi-era drought, which is crucial for all parties involved.

Strangely, the next two years will seal the legacies for so many people: Fernando, Kimi, LdM and Stefano Domenicali. This will be an epic year, we are spoilt for riches in terms of the talent on the field. If you thought even small mistakes were costly this year, wait till 2014 starts. It will be a season that demands perfection, unless the V6 turbos start randomly blowing up, which is also a strong possibility.

P.S: What do I have to do to get the Robertsons managing me?

Last edited by codelust : 19th September 2013 at 10:09.
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Old 19th September 2013, 11:02   #43
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

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P.S: What do I have to do to get the Robertsons managing me?
OT
Be a Finn, drive a car really fast, dont talk too much and yeah the final qualification drink champagne on the podium only because you are thirsty.
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Old 19th September 2013, 17:07   #44
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

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This is the problem that KR has with Lotus and not money, from what I understand. They can't win much, if any at all and all that KR wants to do is to race for wins.
Darn, that little astute observation of mine didn't last too long.

From Andrew Benson, via Twitter:

Raikkonen straight to the point on Lotus: "The reasons why I left are purely on the money side & I havenít got my salary. Itís unfortunate".
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Old 19th September 2013, 18:28   #45
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Default Re: Raikkonen to partner Alonso at Ferrari in 2014

Alonso voted for Kimi to join him..

Kimi was Ferrari's best option - Alonso
http://en.espnf1.com/ferrari/motorsp...ry/125569.html
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