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View Poll Results: Who will win the 2015 MotoGP championship?
Marc Marquez 21 15.22%
Jorge Lorenzo 27 19.57%
Dani Pedrosa 1 0.72%
Valentino Rossi 89 64.49%
Others 0 0%
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Old 17th April 2015, 00:17   #46
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Default Re: The 2015 MotoGP Thread

Hey Parth. Admittedly, I am a much more recent entrant to the Moto GP fan brigade. So I respect and appreciate that you would probably have more insight into the whats what of the sport. But still, there are a few things yoou have mentioned that I feel are fundamentally flawed

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I'm one of the "Rossi & no one else" brigade.
I for one have a lot of respect for every rider on the grid. They are basically performing at one of the biggest stages in motorsport and have more riding talent in their fingernail than I have in my entire body. Is Rossi awesome .... sure is. Rest are not bad either and some of them are actually giving the flourescent doctor a run for his money

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If and when Marquez can re-invent himself over almost two decades, win on different machinery, compete and win with a huge age bracket of riders, deal with changing bike technologies and riding styles, and keep himself motivated and fit after 9 world titles, he'll earn my respect, even though I've not got anything against him
In a few key strokes, you have undermined everything theyoung rookie has fought so hard for. The level at which these guys perform and win, I for one do not have the gall to make small of their achievements as I sip my coke and munch on some nachos. Marquez has nothing to prove to anyone. He is a bonafide champ.... Period!

[quote=Parth46;3686727]Max Biaggi was always a whiner and a moaner and he himself moved to WSBK since he simply could not beat Rossi once Rossi started dominating races. Biaggi never liked Rossi's growing popularity and became a very sore loser, no one forced him to move to other racing series, he did it himself simply because he couldn't win at all

Not everyone is cut from the same cloth. Sometimes, people may just want to focus on doing what they love (in this case, race motorcycles) and not get bothered with name calling and rivalries and whatever other baggage

Biaggi moved to a platform that he felt was more suited for him and I dont think he did poorly there. So a good, intelligent, career move on his part. Smart & realistic guy

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Post that, there were epic battles with Sete Gibernau which Rossi mostly came out on top of, and the more recent rivalry with Casey "Moaner". Again, you simply don't quit the top rung of your sport just because your rival is more popular than you, that's just being childish. In every sport, there are passionate fans who only want their demi-god to win and no-one else, but that's just their own passion and no-body's fault really.
Again, Stoner felt Rossi's conduct was not per "norms" (you surely recollect Leguna Seca 2008) and he voiced his concern. Makes him a moaner? What about Rossi cursing and moaning at the Ducati for "bad performance" while Stoner won a championship with that team?

My passion is for the sport. One man alone would mean nothing here. Still, its actually OK to idolize someone. But should that mean berating all others? This I dont get!!

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All my opinions are my own, and not intended to hurt anyone at all. I just consider Valentino Rossi to be the GREATEST OF ALL TIME, and this is not just going with the tide, but a result of watching him race, struggle and win everything he came across, since I started watching bike racing from 2000-2001.

Peace and love,
Parth
Peace and love indeed!

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I'd love to put Marquez on the Yamaha and see if still dominates the way he has. Or for that matter, if Rossi had never parted ways with Honda, we can't even begin to imagine the kind of domination and one-sided racing we would've seen in such a scenario.
Actually, lets put Rossi on a Ducati again and see what happens
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Old 17th April 2015, 00:45   #47
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Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad View Post
But still, there are a few things yoou have mentioned that I feel are fundamentally flawed
Hey Urban_Nomad - I guess you're a night owl just like me.

A few thoughts to begin with:

I have total and utter respect for everyone who competes at this level
Even I don't claim to possess even a small fraction of the talent, courage and skill these guys have
I have nothing against Marquez or any other rider who has competed with/beaten by/beaten Rossi. They're all supremely great athletes who have my complete respect.

Having said that, I'd like to point out that I still stand by my comments towards Marquez and others. The claim on some of the previous posts seemed to signify that just because MM93 is currently winning everything in sight, he's already as good as or better than Rossi. I would respectfully like to point out what I mentioned earlier and I repeat - If and when Marquez can re-invent himself over almost two decades, win on different machinery, compete and win with a huge age bracket of riders, deal with changing bike technologies and riding styles, and keep himself motivated and fit after 9 world titles, he'll earn my respect. Even he himself would not like to claim that he is better than Rossi at an overall career level - he has a long way to go.

On the rookie front, we all know how Honda "bent" the rookie rule to their advantage in their bid to ensure that they get Marquez on their main factory bike in MotoGP class as soon as possible.

Biaggi - Please google and you'll find tons of articles and interviews of people that'll show that Biaggi had indeed become a sore loser and had really resented Rossi's rise to stardom. Before Rossi, he considered himself to be the greatest Italian racer, a title that was quickly given to Rossi on his arrival at the main stage.

Stoner - My feelings towards him are not because of what happened at Laguna Seca and yes I surely recollect every bit of that race. My point is, you win and people jeer you and still support your rival, you feel bad but you can't hold it against Rossi himself. He never asked his fans to target other riders or boo them.

Rossi on Ducati again - Well, even though the Yamaha has become very competitive, it still doesn't have the explosive power of Ducati or the wizardry of Honda. Doesn't that show that Rossi is still the best when it comes to adapting and re-inventing himself?

To conclude, I'd still stay that I admire them all, just that no one can easily claim to be better than him based on his results and what he's done for the sport, and no-one can claim that they were forced off the grid cos of him or his fans.

All the guy's really done is be insanely great and successful at his chosen sport, but somewhere along the way he's been elevated to demi-god status and is clearly attracting fans who have no interest in anyone other than their messiah. Is it again his fault? A big and emphatic NO.

Also, I don't want to hijack this thread and make it a Rossi-Marquez flame war, this is about the 2015 season.

Much love and peace again.

Cheers,
Parth

Last edited by Parth46 : 17th April 2015 at 00:52. Reason: added a few points, fixed typos
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Old 20th April 2015, 10:06   #48
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Default Re: The 2015 MotoGP Thread

Shucks. Will ignore the previous post and carry on.

Argentina MotoGP turned out to be a good, solid ride by Rossi but IMHO, it was just a race between 2 tyres - the Hard one and the Extra hard option. Sad for Marquez though ending up without any points.
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Old 20th April 2015, 14:52   #49
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Default Re: The 2015 MotoGP Thread

Argentina MotoGP was a breath taking stuff.
Rossi started from less than ideal 8th position and was 2nd in short time. There was seemingly impossible to catch 4 sec gap between first and second place. What followed was stuff of legends.
Rossi chipped off 4 seconds lap by lap. He put immense pressure on Marquez who finally made one mistake in second last lap on turn 5 after being overtaken by Rossi.

Workd class stuff! Hats off!!!
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Old 20th April 2015, 15:22   #50
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Default Re: The 2015 MotoGP Thread

Papa is back in town.

All hail papa.

This was NOT a race that was won on tyre choice alone. This was a race won on raw speed, race craft, and simply put, doing a Rossi on the hot racer in town - i.e. Marquez.

Doing a Rossi = getting inside the head of a racer and messing it up.

Rossi has officially gotten into Marquez's head after this crash. Everyone knows it but will not say it (yet).

Can't wait for the season to unfold!

I see a Gibernau Part Deux coming up .....

P.S. You could detect the homes of Rossi-or-nothing fans around the world last night by the loud screams of ecstasy exploding from within the walls after contact. My son and youngest daughter came running into the hall most concerned ..... and then amused to see dada standing up in front of the TV, fists pumping the air!

P.P.S. Due apologies to all neutral appreciators of good racers here. But Rossi truly is the last surviving legend on my list of sporting heros, the others all having retired now. When he finally hangs up his gloves, for me personally Moto GP will never be the same again.

Last edited by mobike008 : 20th April 2015 at 22:36. Reason: Calling other Motogp riders puppies aint too nice...is it? After all they too have some skills :)...Edited it out...Cheers
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Old 20th April 2015, 16:58   #51
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Default Re: The 2015 MotoGP Thread

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Originally Posted by Parth46 View Post

Rossi on Ducati again - Well, even though the Yamaha has become very competitive, it still doesn't have the explosive power of Ducati or the wizardry of Honda. Doesn't that show that Rossi is still the best when it comes to adapting and re-inventing himself?
When was Yamaha not competitive? I have been following the sport for close to 8 years now and I never felt like Yamaha is inferior. Atleast NOT to a Ducati!

Also, since you talk about Ducati's top-speed and Honda's witchcraft, why not put Yamaha's unmatched corner speeds into equation? And the fact that its electronics are kinder on tyres than the other two? You simply would not, 'cause you're a Rossi fan. And everytime he wins, it's only because of his 'godly' riding skills and not the bike. It's Rossi what makes the difference, right?

Last edited by Shivank : 20th April 2015 at 17:04. Reason: Typo
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Old 21st April 2015, 10:35   #52
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Wow, what a great Argentine GP ! The Doctor is back and will see you now!!

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When was Yamaha not competitive? I have been following the sport for close to 8 years now and I never felt like Yamaha is inferior. Atleast NOT to a Ducati!

Also, since you talk about Ducati's top-speed and Honda's witchcraft, why not put Yamaha's unmatched corner speeds into equation? And the fact that its electronics are kinder on tyres than the other two? You simply would not, 'cause you're a Rossi fan. And everytime he wins, it's only because of his 'godly' riding skills and not the bike. It's Rossi what makes the difference, right?
Mate, with all due respect, 8 years probably don't go as far back as 2003-04 when Rossi quit Honda over their claims that Machine rules MotoGP and not man and that Rossi's domination can be largely explained by their superior RCV. Rossi famously quit Honda due to this and a few other reasons and went directly to Yamaha who were very weak at that point and hadn't won a premier race in a long time. He developed that bike almost on his own with unimaginable help from Yamaha's engineers of course and converted it into a race winning machine, while still being marginally behind Honda.

Moving ahead, when Rossi came back to Yamaha after a disaster with Ducati, by then Lorenzo had convinced Yamaha that he's their main star and they'd accordingly modified the bike a lot to suit Lorenzo's driving style. When Rossi came back, he adjusted a lot to the new bike, altered his driving style to match the new guys and the result is for all to see.

Flashback to the very recent Qatar GP, we all saw how Ducati was easily overtaking the Yamaha on the straights as if it was standing still. Rossi had to muster the last ounce of his skill to take that breathtaking victory.

I never said that Yamaha was inferior to Ducati, at this level the differences are very marginal. These few examples show that while every factory has its strengths, its the rider that ultimately makes the difference and leads the machine to victory.

Coming to Marquez again, my respect for him is diminishing by every race, I'm sorry to admit. Being completely reckless when you're trying to bulldoze your way thru the field is dangerous and uncalled for and "legends" don't do that. We all saw how MM93 just bullied his way thru in Qatar,even taking out an Aprilia and no-one batted an eyelid, and the "racing incident" in Argentina was promptly reviewed. Rossi has close to two decades of experience in just simply running thru the field and the number of such "incidents" he's had are very few and far between. And MM is clearly developing a reputation for being an "all-or-nothing" rider as Rossi said after the race.

Again, lots of love and peace. I'm ready to hold on to my opinions, just like everyone is surely entitled to theirs. Like Ebonho said, for me as well, he's just one of the last, long-standing sliver of tradition, skill, and legend all in one and one of my all-time greatest heroes, and I base this on my last 16-odd years of worshiping motoGP, not just going with the tide of supporting a famous guy.

For me, when he's gone, MotoGP will never be the same again.

Cheers again and here's to a great rest of the season.

Parth

Last edited by Parth46 : 21st April 2015 at 10:40.
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Old 21st April 2015, 10:51   #53
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Quite simply, to put things into perspective, take a look at what age Rossi is today.

Then compare it to the guys he is racing against at the sharp end of the pack.

And if you think age makes no difference to speed and lap times at the pinnacle of motorsport, look around you and compare where you are on the road today versus what you were as a rider 10 years ago.

They say as a rule of thumb, a racer drops nearly a second a lap for every 10 years of his life. Or some (not jokingly) say the same for every kds born.

Well, Rossi has no kids. But he's been at it for 20 years now.

Do the math and then place your bets on a 20 year old Rossi versus a 20 year old Marquez.

In the spirit of things here, peace and love to all.

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Old 21st April 2015, 11:03   #54
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Quite simply, to put things into perspective, take a look at what age Rossi is today.


In the spirit of things here, peace and love to all.
That's exactly my point here - I fully admit MM's achievements, but to be in a hurry to write off Rossi and hail MM as the new all-time legend is ceratainly misdirected folly.

My only point with these long comments is to drive home the point that he's been at it long enough, excelled at it long enough, struggled at it long enough, seen a lot of sweeping changes, seen the grids change over and over again, and still has it in him at 36 to beat the "traction control" generation. His words, not mine so please don't beat me up.

As I said a few posts ago. if anyone can do what he has done over two decades, beaten a huge age bracket of riders, adapted to bikes and racing styles, and still is fit enough and winning enough to give the new guys sleepless nights, there's no shame in hailing the great man. And all this can easily be done by giving due credit to MM and all the other great riders, who also have the full respect of the MotoGP community.

Ebonho, I have you beat on the noise quotient. During the Qatar GP, since it was close to midnight here, my shouting and cheering actually woke up a couple of neighbors who came over looking and ultimately stayed up with me watching the last few laps. Same thing happened during the Argentine GP, and my 3-yr old nephew is now a "Lossi" fan.
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Old 21st April 2015, 11:16   #55
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"traction control" generation.
This quite simply puts it out there.

Rossi is the last of the breed which actually raced the 500 cc 2 stroke GP machines. Also probably why the old legends still are jst that little fonder of him than the rest of the pack - and it shows in the presentations and the off season interviews. They see him as "their own."

Traction control? There are still videos on You Tube out there which make Moto GP cornering look like oval track racing.

Not saying that the new kids would not have eventually been able to tame those beasts were they still around today or these kids were born 20 years earlier.

But would you bet that all the "names" of the TC generation would have come through?

I have my reservations.

P.S. Parth, at Quatar I was delirious. But Argentina made me a believer.

Last edited by ebonho : 21st April 2015 at 11:19.
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Old 21st April 2015, 11:27   #56
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500 cc 2 stroke GP machines.

But would you bet that all the "names" of the TC generation would have come through?

I have my reservations.

P.S. Parth, at Quatar I was delirious. But Argentina made me a believer.
Ah man, the big-bang NSRs bring back a flood of memories! Yes, it would be crazy to imagine the current brigade on those beasts, and I also do agree that all these talented guys would probably have mastered them, but it surely wouldn't be easy.

Forget the other dynamics, just that a guy who raced and won everything THEN is STILL racing and winning on today's machines inspires awe and a level of passion that's tough to replicate.

Ebonho, you just can't believe how much I want this 10th championship to happen, and how many times I've come this close to redeeming my mutual fund portfolio to go to some relatively nearby track like Qatar etc to watch one race live in my lifetime, but damned if I would be able to.

Here's to the legend man! Truly one of the last few gems of sport bridging the old-new divide across generations.
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Old 21st April 2015, 11:34   #57
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I cannot understand really what has happened suddenly to Lorenzo. Why has he dropped off?

I mean, Rossi has the bike he wants finally. Does that mean Lorenzo does not? Or do factories only folow a single template, and one rider gets the short end of the stick?
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Old 21st April 2015, 11:42   #58
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I cannot understand really what has happened suddenly to Lorenzo. Why has he dropped off?

I mean, Rossi has the bike he wants finally. Does that mean Lorenzo does not? Or do factories only folow a single template, and one rider gets the short end of the stick?
Well the official story is helmet foam coming off in Qatar, blocking vision a bit in the final laps, bronchitis in CoTA, and tyre trouble in Argentina. I don't think he would be able to make a serious 2015 title threat now. His 2014 also began bad and he had to play catch-up till the end.

I'm not sure if the factory is supporting Rossi fully now, I won't be surprised if it's true as well.
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Old 21st April 2015, 11:54   #59
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This one is going to be Marquez and Rossi all the way, with Dovi close on the heals. Dovi is a tough guy to overtake but somehow does not look as aggressive once he's behind. Or maybe its his mental "papa" block against Rossi (I do believe he has one - in the traditional Indian respect for elders type of way lol).
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Old 23rd April 2015, 11:23   #60
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Dovi has the machine this time to claim the title. He doesn't need to be too aggressive, precession is the key. All he needs is to stick to 2nd position in every race. Who knows, he might become champion without even winning a race
Marquez is 30 points adrift and Rossi has brought his A game. We can't count out Lorenzo and the Ducati is super quick. It won't be easy for Marquez. It's going to be a pretty interesting season. It's too early to say if its going to be Rossi vs Marquez battle, It can become 4 way battle.
Honda will lose their title to Yamaha for sure.

Last edited by fz_rider : 23rd April 2015 at 11:25.
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