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Old 16th September 2007, 08:24   #136
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McLaren was punished and rightly so. But the punishment was given not because they used Ferrari data, but because they were in possession of Ferrari data. The FIA couldn’t find any Ferrari bits on McLaren and that’s a given fact.
Good posts McLaren1885, you saved me a lot of work :-)
Its fans like you I admire the most, and its just goes to show that McLaren fans are not fair-weather fans. We stick it out with our team, no matter what!
Go Macaaaaaaaaaaa
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Old 16th September 2007, 09:49   #137
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Yes and another thing:
Alonso is a sore loser and wins by cheating.

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Gordon, I apologize for not knowing as much as you do on this subject. Unless you can come up with detailed facts (on when the info was passed about pitstops) or numbers on how much of an advantage Mclaren gained by this espionage I suggest you learn to respect others opinions. All this speculation of yours is equally nonsensical unless and until proved.
The emails and messages suggested that Stepney had fed Coughlan real-time information on Ferrari’s pit stop strategy in this year’s Australian Grand Prix.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mclaren
You seem to be knowing what I do not. So, who according to you approached who to start this espionage? Nigel convinced Mike or was it the other way round? Both stood nothing to loose, since both were looking at job opportunities with other teams.
Does it matter who approached whom?! It was a conspiracy!
In its judgement, the Council cites evidence of ongoing communications between Coughlan and Stepney, as well as between Coughlan and McLaren test driver Pedro de la Rosa, who the FIA claim “requested and received secret Ferrari information from a source which he knew to be illegitimate” and shared that information with world champion Fernando Alonso.

__________________________________________________ _____

That was you. You were the one who made these lame statements:

Quote:
is it possible that Ferrari MIGHT have intentionally leaked such misinterpreted (or false technical figures) info to Mclaren? Could Ferrari have set this whole event up?
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This Ferrari V/s Mclaren case is a classic example of a teenage couple having unprotected sex and in the near future the girl gets pregnant. Whom will the society conveniently blame? The girl of course. What people don't understand is that the fault is borne by both EQUALLY. If the guy could control his fly and not let it out of his pants, the pregnancy would not have occurred at all. Here the boy being Ferrari and the girl being Mclaren.
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From what I know members of any team be it rogue or not are a PART of the team.
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Yes, found guilty alright. But to what extent?
Hmmmm.....Yes the accused did stab the victim, but to what extent?! Did the knife penetrate an inch deep or more?!

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Gordon, I don't know if you were there when this happened or to what extent who was involved. They were GIVEN the dossier by a Ferrari man.
Emails between Coughlan, de la Rosa and Alonso formed part of the new evidence that prompted Thursday’s second hearing into the affair. July’s original hearing had found McLaren in breach of the International Sporting Code, but had not sanctioned the team due to lack of evidence.

The emails covered topics such as the weight distribution and braking system of Ferrari’s car, a flexible rear wing design and a gas used by the Italian team to inflate its tyres. They also suggested that Stepney had fed Coughlan real-time information on Ferrari’s pit stop strategy in this year’s Australian Grand Prix.

Quote:
Now, if I were to call you over the phone or text you and mention the words "Ferrari weight distribution is 68-32%" How would you pretend not to have gained illegal info?
ARE YOU MAD??!?! THERE WERE 300 MESSAGES BETWEEN COUGHLAN AND STEPNEY AND EVEN BETWEEN!!

Yes, and how can we forget:
Alonso is a sore loser and wins by cheating.

TO SUM IT UP:
  • I don't "HATE" McLaren.
  • I am happy with the decision from the FIA to ban McLaren because they obviously went against the rules.
  • I HATE ALONSO.
  • I wish they threw him out for any damned reason.
  • I wish McLaren fans understand that when top officials of a team gain ongoing information from a rival teams official, it is called "ESPIONAGE" and accounts as cheating. Ron is a good guy, I pity him for what his employees dragged him into.

Yes and another thing:
Alonso is a sore loser and wins by cheating.
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Old 16th September 2007, 11:11   #138
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Gordon, I have read every bit of the WMSC decision pdf file, so stop make it look like you are the only person who can read. There are a lot of technical things you/me will not understand. I have also learnt that the construction of the Mclaren is a lot different when compared to the Ferrari. And making such technical changes to suit Ferrari's needs might not give an added advantage or may not have been possible at all. And how are you so SURE that my lame statements MIGHT not be true? Or is your final word that MATTERS and none elses?

Quote:
I HATE ALONSO
Quote:
I wish they threw him out for any damned reason.
Quote:
Alonso is a sore loser and wins by cheating.
Your views are quite clear and one sided and obvious. Everyone makes mistakes, yes that includes you. It takes great men to forgive them and give them another chance. But, I am sure that we all are so full of ourselves that we ENJOY pointing fingers at others, pin pointing their mistakes. Such is our mentality. A sad one at that, if I may add.

So anything I say, will not make sense to you. Though I shall warn you not to call people names. Next time you call my views nonsensical, lame or mad I can tell you I wont take it so light heartedly. To gain respect, you need to learn to give some. Stick to a clean discussion and prove your point. If not refrain from it.

To sum it up:

1. Can you prove how much of the stolen info was USED on the mclaren?
2. Can you prove how much of an advantage was gained from this leak on the track?
3. Are you telling me that even after the ferrari traitor got sacked, mclaren still continues to win because they are still receiving pit stop strategies from somone inside the team?
4. Are you telling me that mclaren are reliable only because they possess ferraris info?
5. Are you telling me that even if mclaren go onto win the WDC it will ONLY be because of the stolen info?
6. Or are you telling me that calling an ENTIRE team cheaters when 3 rotten apples spoil the rapport is fair? If so why is it not fair to call Ferrari sore loosers? Ever considered the hard, honest work some many others have put up?
7. Or is it just that Ferrari is doing so bad that this is nice lame excuse one can use for the miserable perfomances?

Last edited by mclaren1885 : 16th September 2007 at 11:28.
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Old 16th September 2007, 11:38   #139
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8. Knowing Ferrari's caliber don't you think they would have been even stronger and come out of the initial glitches and the bad run they seem to have? What if mclaren had by themselves built a better car? What would your stance be then? Would Ferrari not have made improvements and come out stronger? Why are they not doing that now and beating mclaren (cheaters if you may call) on their own merit?

9. Or has Ferrari realized that they cannot match up to the cheaters, so lets use this excuse and prove we are a better team with dignity? I wonder if anyone AT FERRARI are even using this as an excuse for mclaren to do better than them (or is it ONLY we sore loosing fans using this excuse?). I bet they are all shocked that such a breach happened. But they must be working super hard to better their car and not sit down and point out saying that mclaren is not fast on their own accord, its because of our info. So let us just sit back and run the same car while mclaren are ousted out of the WCC and even if they win the WDC we will still be the WINNERS by good virtue.

Last edited by mclaren1885 : 16th September 2007 at 11:39.
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Old 16th September 2007, 15:24   #140
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McLaren/Gordon - There is no point going on & on about this. FACT is that McLaren were found guilty of wrongdoing & punished. That's the end of that.

We can float all kinds of consipracy theories all year long but that doesn't change any FACTS. Please quit this squabbling.

I think this topic has outlived his purpose. Can the mods close this please.

Last edited by iraghava : 16th September 2007 at 15:27.
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Old 16th September 2007, 15:51   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iraghava
Can the mods close this please.
I agree. Lock topic.
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Old 16th September 2007, 17:08   #142
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Talking Ishaan does it again!

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Originally Posted by iraghava View Post

I think this topic has outlived his purpose. Can the mods close this please.
Whose???

You're drunk for sure!
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Old 16th September 2007, 17:15   #143
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Originally Posted by speedzak View Post
You're drunk for sure!
On a Sunday morning? Nahin yaar, the situation's not that bad yet!
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Old 16th September 2007, 19:21   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mclaren1885 View Post
1. Can you prove how much of the stolen info was USED on the mclaren?
2. Can you prove how much of an advantage was gained from this leak on the track?
the question here is not if mclaren used the info but HOW they got it.

END OF TOPIC.

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