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View Poll Results: Constructor's Championshop Prediction
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Old 30th May 2006, 21:56   #676
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sujaylahiri
Schumacher might have managed 5th place from 22nd, but he was aided by 4 top place retirements and 2 drive through penalties. ...
If you have watched the race, you would also have watched Schumi zipping past and overtaking other cars at least couple of times. I guess, that clears doubts about if he can overtake or if he is just a jerk trying to win races through cheating.

About Schumi controversy, as JPM said in post race interviews, it was just an incident. Schumi thought he didn't intentionally stall the car, stewards thought otherwise. (Looks like the driver is a machine, which should never make any mistake). Nothing more than that!
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Old 30th May 2006, 22:20   #677
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The arguement can go on and on and there is no end to it. Every thread here turns into a pro Schumi vs anti Schumi arguement. What has happened has happened. Plus we really cannot argur about Schumi's ruthlessness because thats what real race drivers are made up of. If everyone remembers the "GOD" Ayrton Senna was also as ruthless as ever like knocking his team mate out of the race for the championship even if he had to go out of the race with him. For a champion winning is everything

I am a self confessed Schumi fan but I just read the threads nowadays and refrain from commenting because the discussion just continues

To each is own let us all just support the team and driver we like. Period

So Monaco is over and lets focus on Silverstone.
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Old 31st May 2006, 14:14   #678
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Default Schumi steward: We were right

Schumi steward: We were right

One of the three FIA stewards who concluded that Michael Schumacher was guilty of parking his car deliberately during qualifying for the Monaco Grand Prix, Joaquin Verdegay, says he was proud of the job they did on Saturday.

Verdegay said that while the decision to put Schumacher to the back of the grid had been a difficult one to come to, he and co-stewards Christian Calmes and Tony Scott Andrews had no choice.

“It was a difficult decision because we couldn’t afford to make a mistake when the reputation of a driver is at stake,” Verdigay told Italian newspaper Gazzetta dello Sport.

“We do not know if the whole manoeuvre was deliberate but it is certain that at that point of the track he had never done anything of that sort all weekend.”

The Spanish steward added that all the evidence suggested Schumacher could have avoided the incident, which saw his Ferrari stop at the exit of Rascasse in the dying moments of qualifying.

The German maintained his innocence throughout, claiming it was a driving error and that he did not know who was still on qualifying attempts.

Both Fernando Alonso and Giancarlo Fisichella had laps ruined in the incident.

“He braked 50% harder than he had on the other laps and made a counter-steer movement which was absolutely not necessary, which lasted for five metres, to the point at which it was no longer possible for him to correctly turn the corner,” said Verdigay.

“He lost control of the car when he was travelling at 10mph, which is absolutely unjustifiable and the engine stalled because he wanted it to, losing the time necessary for engaging the clutch.”

Verdigay admitted however that had Schumacher crashed his car, rather than simply parking it, the FIA would probably have never investigated the incident.

“It’s true that if he had damaged the car we would probably have put the case done to a simple error,” he said.

“Instead parking it in this manner can only be done intentionally so we applied Srticle 166 of the sporting regulations which is that if a driver prejudices the performance of others he can lose all his times."

“We are here to judge mistakes, we did what we needed to do."

“We have studied the case and for that it took many hours. We are proud of the job we did.”
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Source - http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=36109
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Old 31st May 2006, 20:53   #679
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Its a bit late...anyways
Was a pretty nice race..Again Fonsi crusing to victory. McLaren and Williams again blowing their engines...But i was expecting a lot more crashes, but most of them went out due to mechanical probs..Was shocked to see DC on the podium, and it'll be the last time he'll be there. Its just pur luck for him..

And Ferrari/MS hates, they must have cheated, but still got BOTH their cars which started LAST on the grid into the TOP 10. Any other team/driver doin that..i doubt so. And MS was so damn agressive that he made up 4places on the first 4corners of the race itself, and if he just had another half a lap left, he could have finished fourth cuz on the last corner he was almost alongside RB. And getting to 5th by starting in the pits needs a lot of skill than just cheating or whatevah.

Anyways, MS apologied to Fonsi for preventing him from gettin the pole position. So lets just put that story behind.

And another thing is, if u've watched RaceDay..they showed Flavio swearing and callin MS all sorts of things. That too on worldwide TV. Boy how classless is that..Desperately crying to get on pole. This is not directed to Fonsi or Renault, but just to Flavio.

And title chase ain't over yet, its still very much on. And it should be between MS and Fonsi, one DNF of him and things will look really different.

As for Kimi, looks like its over for him unless he gets a good car and manages to get on the podium for most of the races ahead.
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Old 31st May 2006, 21:01   #680
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sujaylahiri
Schumacher might have managed 5th place from 22nd, but he was aided by 4 top place retirements and 2 drive through penalties. Also Button's Honda had some kind of problem which they couldn't fix overnight.
Did u even watch the race, and do u remember what happened!? "HE STARTED FROM THE PITS AND STILL CAME 5th"
If u take things like that...Fonsi won cuz he started from pole..watcha gotta say abt that!??

Guys..atleast give him credit for the brilliant driver that he is. Any human with a lil bit of sense knows what he did was indeed a difficult and a pretty much impossible thing to do, especially on a tight track like Monaco where overtaking is impossible.

Hating a person is fine...but talkin cr@p is so sick..

Last edited by karthik247 : 31st May 2006 at 21:03.
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Old 1st June 2006, 10:24   #681
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Karthik, chill buddy, your MS bias is shining strongly through....... ; you are getting all het up because someone says MS was aided to 5th spot yet in the same breath you say you were shocked to see DC on the podium & that it'll be the last time and that he was pure lucky!! DC happens to be a very good driver too, just that he does not possess the ruthlessness of MS; he set very good quailfying times through the weekend, knows Monaco like the back of his hand and started from 7th place so what was so shocking about it....??

Lets move on to Silverstone......Cheers
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Old 1st June 2006, 13:25   #682
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suman
Karthik, chill buddy, your MS bias is shining strongly through....... ; you are getting all het up because someone says MS was aided to 5th spot yet in the same breath you say you were shocked to see DC on the podium & that it'll be the last time and that he was pure lucky!! DC happens to be a very good driver too, just that he does not possess the ruthlessness of MS; he set very good quailfying times through the weekend, knows Monaco like the back of his hand and started from 7th place so what was so shocking about it....??

Lets move on to Silverstone......Cheers
First abt DC...When was the last time he was on the podium?? Or when did he last finish a race on top??? He was a really good driver when he was with McLaren, no doubt. But now, he might be good, but isn't as good or aggressive as he was earlier. The team and the car ur driving matters a lot. Look at RB, when he was with Ferrari he used to win races, but in this season he's struggling.

And yes, i'm am getting heated up cuz some people talk stuff as if MS is a total joke and like getting from 22nd to 5th is so easy, aww common!!
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Old 1st June 2006, 14:44   #683
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karthik247
The team and the car ur driving matters a lot.
You have answered your own question I think......and DC has done wonders for Red Bull last year as well considering the car was nothing to write home about. Aggression etc follows naturally when you know the car you are driving is a winner else you will end up with the Jacques V tag - will not give way!

I'm not a schumi fan because I could never stand his ruthlessness but I don't hate his guts either. However, starting from the back of the pack and coming up even to podium - is it MS alone who's done it in recent times? What about Kimi, what about Montoya.......so its not that its a unique feat or something.

Besides, lets not forget about different pit stop strategies, the fact his car was FULL to the brim at the start, the fact that a safety car situation changes a lot of things and look at the overall picture.......let us also not forget that he just couldn't find a way past Button for an interminably long time so its not that he did a scorcher like Kimi has done on many an occasion, having had to start at the end of the pack due to blown engines etc
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Old 1st June 2006, 15:12   #684
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suman
I'm not a schumi fan because I could never stand his ruthlessness but I don't hate his guts either. However, starting from the back of the pack and coming up even to podium - is it MS alone who's done it in recent times? What about Kimi, what about Montoya.......so its not that its a unique feat or something.
Well, if Kimi and JPM have done it, they are brilliant drivers. How does it make MS cheat or bad driver winning at mercy of others, as being portrayed here.

Quote:
Besides, lets not forget about different pit stop strategies, the fact his car was FULL to the brim at the start, the fact that a safety car situation changes a lot of things and look at the overall picture.......let us also not forget that he just couldn't find a way past Button for an interminably long time so its not that he did a scorcher like Kimi has done on many an occasion, having had to start at the end of the pack due to blown engines etc
Point 1: He DID overtake couple of times. Single pit stop strategy doesn't help for that. If at all, you fry the tyres badly with single pitstop rather than anything else.
Point 2: This was Monaco track where overtaking is next to impossible. Your "scorching" Kimi could not find a way past Alonso in faster car on same track same day. Well, I have nothing against Kimi or Alonso either.

BTW, I may be wrong, but blown engine means 10 places down, not 21 places down as was the case with MS JPM did that last year and finished 4th. He is a stupid killer racer and I love that!

Last edited by RX135 : 1st June 2006 at 15:14.
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Old 1st June 2006, 15:29   #685
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RX135
Well, if Kimi and JPM have done it, they are brilliant drivers. How does it make MS cheat or bad driver winning at mercy of others, as being portrayed here.
MS is being called a cheat for other reasons...the point being debated here is whether 22nd to 5th is something exceptional. Please don't mix up different points of discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by RX135
Point 1: He DID overtake couple of times.
My point exactly - just a couple of times and not 17 cars (to make up from 22nd to 5th); the rest of it happened due to other reasons mentioned
Quote:
Originally Posted by RX135
Single pit stop strategy doesn't help for that. If at all, you fry the tyres badly with single pitstop rather than anything else.
Not sure what you mean.....You would make a second stop if it affected your tyres badly, wouldn't you? And not make it if you didn't fry them......

Quote:
Originally Posted by RX135
BTW, I may be wrong, but blown engine means 10 places down, not 21 places down as was the case with MS JPM did that last year and finished 4th. He is a stupid killer racer and I love that!
Tail end of the pack sound better? Kimi has done a few of those as well. As you are aware, failing to set a qualifying time would also relegate you to the last position & a qualifying time of 10th and then an engine change would get you pretty close to the end..........
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Old 1st June 2006, 15:57   #686
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WOW .. Amazing discussion happening here and I've been resisting for a while but now sorry can't resist it . IMO MS maybe a gud driver but then he's too ruthless to be a gud sport ... and yes his actions do get classified as cheating in one way or the other . Luckily he has somehow gotten away with most of them but this time he wasn't that lucky ... he deserved worse I feel . What makes him think that he has the right to do what and as he feels just coz he's a hot driver .... BULL CRAP !!

And pls don't asking me as to what instances and why wwas he wrong coz I'm not gonna go into detail !!! Just rack ur memories a lil bit and u will remember the side swiping, the rear ending , the god knows what all he has done to win .

His flight from 22nd to close to the top shows that hes a gud driver no doubt ...but if hes that hot why does he need to create situations where he gets tagged as a ***** ?? He just hates to lose .. no problems with that but then hes a sore loser .. period .

Cheers
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Old 1st June 2006, 16:20   #687
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@Suman..
He was on heavy fuel load for sure..but then do u expect someone to start from the pits with an empty tank?? And if u noticed he started from the pits and made up 4places in the first 4corners of the race despite having started from way back and have a heavier car...Driving fast is one thing, and saving ur tyres at the same time is another.

Then again, how many cars did JPM overtake?? He was fourth, didn't make up even one place. That's skill, i don't think so. He might have done it on other tracks, but not here, atleast not this time...

And the sport is 'racing' where everyone has to be aggressive, and have the b**** to make some daring overtaking moves. And okey he must have braked to hard at the corner n all, but in a split seconds time...u can't just think about turning, or braking slowly and all..The one thing in ur mind would be to stop ur car before it crashes. You watch Nascar, u'll see a lot of banging and all around, so are they all cheats? Same happens sometime in MotoGP too...

And i wonder how many racing drivers like or don't mind losing...NONE!

And people call him 'cheat' for that one incident, why don't u call him 'great' for winning the title 7times over!??

Last edited by karthik247 : 1st June 2006 at 16:24.
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Old 1st June 2006, 17:09   #688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karthik247
And people call him 'cheat' for that one incident, why don't u call him 'great' for winning the title 7times over!??
Karthik, that was some years back & we did appreciate it at that time.....he is being called a cheat now for cheating, that's all. And, you are mixing up track incidents during a race with something that was done DELIBERATELY to screw up someone else's faster lap - well, to me that's unacceptable. If MS & Alonso had banged wheels going into a corner during the race, I don't think anyone would have spoken about it as "cheating" (mind you, they may have said he was crazy as they did for his RB or RS incidents earlier).

Also, cars at the lower end are (in most cases), slower cars, lower rung teams, most drivers would have seen a Ferrari and PULLED OVER, I don't think MS would have had to exert himself at all! He had to really start exerting himself with Jenson Button and didn't get anywhere ....JPM was racing with the top three for christ sake, besides, his car wasn't handling anywhere as well you must have heard the commentators talking about it & seen for yourself as well?

And, I wasn't expecting him to start with an empty tank, merely pointing out that that enabled him to stay out much longer before coming in for refuelling - isn't that an advantage as well?
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Old 1st June 2006, 17:14   #689
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khaadu75
His flight from 22nd to close to the top shows that hes a gud driver no doubt ...but if hes that hot why does he need to create situations where he gets tagged as a ***** ?? He just hates to lose .. no problems with that but then hes a sore loser .. period .

Cheers
, spot on....I mean it was so senseless, at the most, Alonso would have taken pole and he would have been second...and who knows what may have happened during the race. And what does he do? He just does something inexplicable and because of what you've said he is......
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Old 1st June 2006, 17:19   #690
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suman
Also, cars at the lower end are (in most cases), slower cars, lower rung teams, most drivers would have seen a Ferrari and PULLED OVER, I don't think MS would have had to exert himself at all
Do u know what ur sayin!??? Why would any driver in the world 'PULL OVER' to let someone else pass...

And why would the drivers help MS get thru to make up a position!??

Really bro, just think about it and then post..No offence, but its SO not true.
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