Go Back   Team-BHP > Buckle Up > Motor-Sports > Int'l Motorsport


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 30th June 2005, 10:57   #16
Team-BHP Support
 
manson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,496
Thanked: 1,821 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shan2nu
U think thats easy? U think Villeneuve or Kimi would listen to such crap? No way, they'd rather go into the wall than slow down.

Slowing down in a race is unacceptable and most of the drivers wouldn't have agreed to it.

Shan2nu
If they are dumb enough to do that then maybe they do deserve to go straight into the wall . A driver should know his machinery well enough , if its not going to last then don't push the car too much .
"with power comes great resposibility"

And shan i'm sure most of us remember kimi trying to preserve his machinery till the last lap of a certain grand prix , and err err did they take any measures then to slow down all the other cars as it was't fair for kimi ?

manson .
manson .
manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 11:09   #17
Team-BHP Support
 
manson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,496
Thanked: 1,821 Times
Lightbulb simple example

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shan2nu

So, it's better we stick to the one that caused it all ............"Michelin".

Shan2nu
well according to me it was the teams running on michelins as they chose the wrong tyre manafacturer . Ofcourse michelin are liable , but not to F1 in any way , the are liable to the teams they supply tyres to for not bringing the right tyres and nobody other than that .

dude its as simple as this . you go to a restaurant , ask for something to eat . now unfortunately there s something that makes you come to a conclusion that there s some bland raw material used , who do you catch hold of ? would you as a customer of the restaurant pull up the restaurant authorities or the company wo supplies raw material to the restaurant .

manson .

p.s. i completely understand that F1 and a restaurant are poles apart , so don't bother posting and tellin me that . Its the logic behind the example to be concentrated on rather than the "real terms" , so lets look at the bigger picture .

Last edited by manson : 30th June 2005 at 11:12.
manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 11:13   #18
Senior - BHPian
 
ported_head's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Mumbai, India
Posts: 2,391
Thanked: 7 Times
Default

Today's TOI states that the FIA has found the teams guilty on counts of two offences:
1. Failing to ensure suitable tyres for race
2. Wrongfully refusing to allow their cars to start.

The FIA would now announce punishments for the teams on September 14 ranging from a reprimand to a life ban.

So this would obviously include Renault, McLaren Mercedes, BAR-Honda and Toyota, the front runners, along with Sauber and Red Bull Racing. Though life ban sounds a little extreme expect the teams to be a relieved of a few constructor's points or a couple of race bans. All in all a nice strategy to see Ferrari on the top again.

I'd really like to know, what's Bernie been smoking?

Last edited by ported_head : 30th June 2005 at 11:14.
ported_head is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 11:19   #19
Senior - BHPian
 
Shan2nu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hubli - Karnata
Posts: 5,525
Thanked: 81 Times
Default

Quote:
"with power comes great resposibility"
And not racing was a responsible move. They knew people would comment and accuse them of spoiling the sport but, they did what was best for their drivers.

Quote:
And shan i'm sure most of us remember kimi trying to preserve his machinery till the last lap of a certain grand prix , and err err did they take any measures then to slow down all the other cars as it was't fair for kimi ?
That wasn't the fault of the tyre. The thing is that Kimi kept locking his wheels and once you get a flat spot, the tyre keeps locking up in the same place eveytime you go hard on the brakes. This caused the car to vibrate to a point where the suspension gave way.

If it was a tyre problem then how come Alonso was catching Kimi at 1.5 secs a lap?

Like i said, Kimi is not the kind who'l slow down the car. If he had to slow down, he'd have settled for a 2nd place finish but he wanted to win no matter what. And didn't most of yo'll say he was right in doing so? Then how can yo'll expect them to slow down now?

That is the reason why team managers didn't let them race. Race drivers will be race drivers. They weren't going to slow down unless a chicane was put up and they couldn't drive at race pace due to the tyre problem, so what were they supposed to do?

If Bernie and Flabio think putting up a show is more important than driver safety, next time something like this happens, let them get into the cars and race for the fans.

Aren't WRC events cancelled due to over crowding? Why dont they just let the cars run and say "The people wanted it, so here it is". It's not just F1, it happens everywhere.

Shan2nu
Shan2nu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 11:22   #20
Senior - BHPian
 
Shan2nu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hubli - Karnata
Posts: 5,525
Thanked: 81 Times
Default

Quote:
I'd really like to know, what's Bernie been smoking?
Let the A1 GP start this September. Bernie is gonna get smoked.

During the Damon Hill interview on TG, they mentioned that there were talks about most teams moving away from F1 and starting their own GP (hope that happens).

Shan2nu
Shan2nu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 11:43   #21
Team-BHP Support
 
manson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 3,496
Thanked: 1,821 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shan2nu
And not racing was a responsible move. They knew people would comment and accuse them of spoiling the sport but, they did what was best for their drivers.



That wasn't the fault of the tyre. The thing is that Kimi kept locking his wheels and once you get a flat spot, the tyre keeps locking up in the same place eveytime you go hard on the brakes. This caused the car to vibrate to a point where the suspension gave way.

Shan2nu
i totally agree on the safety issues, it is a subjective decision , some might not want to race , some might prefer to slow down . . . but why on planet earth blame ferrari for the blunder ? was i their fault to bring the right tyres this time around . even thinking of blaming ferrari for the same is a crime as they did not need to forego their advantage .

and the imp. point is that kimi did slow dow when he realised that it might juts not be possible to make it to the finsih line .

manson .
manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 12:02   #22
Senior - BHPian
 
Shan2nu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hubli - Karnata
Posts: 5,525
Thanked: 81 Times
Default

Quote:
i totally agree on the safety issues, it is a subjective decision , some might not want to race , some might prefer to slow down . . . but why on planet earth blame ferrari for the blunder ?
Bcoz people wanted to see the cars race even if it meant putting up a chicane. Obvuiosly they were frustrated when Ferrari refused.

Ferrari wasn't wrong.

Quote:
and the imp. point is that kimi did slow dow when he realised that it might juts not be possible to make it to the finsih line .
He didn't slow the car down, the car slowed him down. You can't drive a car at race pace when it's vibrating, even if you want to. Kimi slowing down when Alonso was just 1.5 secs behind? Hah!!

Didn't you notice the speed he was doing when he crashed? The car went all the way across the gravel trap.

Shan2nu
Shan2nu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 14:00   #23
Senior - BHPian
 
merve_extreme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,360
Thanked: 12 Times
Default

that kimi story is not relavent here.i woul put the blame on 75-michelin and 25-on the teams for not bothering to see what michelin was upto.no blame on FIA,Ferrari,Max and Bernie..

secondly what the manufacturers are trying to start is Gran Prix world championship(GWPC) and i dont think it is goint to be a great success because there are already many differences between the member companies.also F1 started as a individual owned teams and not company owned teams like we see today.so it will be back to the begining for f1.
merve_extreme is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 17:59   #24
BHPian
 
Minardi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 408
Thanked: 13 Times
Default

Not strictly on-topic, but didn't want to start a new thread...

I am hearing it for the first time that Ferrari asked Rubino to lower his engine revs midway through the US Grand Prix after an early fight with Schumacher. Isn't this a sly form of enforcing team orders.

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=33288

M
Minardi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 18:16   #25
Senior - BHPian
 
merve_extreme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,360
Thanked: 12 Times
Default

it has to be seen wether they asked him to preserve his machinery or to stay behine Michael.because i think(those radio chatters on tv) they also told MS to drop his revs and he replied if rubens does then he will do so.
merve_extreme is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 19:04   #26
Senior - BHPian
 
shuvc's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 2,895
Thanked: 282 Times
Default

rubinho is rumoured to be leaving Ferrari for BAR .. guess he has every right to be disgruntled ..

he should write an autobiography someday with some juicy revelations of the 'Ferrari F1 way' ..
shuvc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th June 2005, 19:16   #27
Senior - BHPian
 
shuvc's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 2,895
Thanked: 282 Times
Question Bernie strategy ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ported_head
The FIA would now announce punishments for the teams on September 14 ranging from a reprimand to a life ban.
Yes, saw this .. but wonder why it will take them so long ..

strategically speaking, it might be a nice time .. there are just 3 races after Sep 14 .. and the 'degree of punishment' might just influence the course of the championship
shuvc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st July 2005, 12:40   #28
BHPian
 
turbo_v12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Thane
Posts: 457
Thanked: Once
Default

Guys you gotta give Michelin a break. Everyone has the right to get it wrong occassionally. I think Max Mosley and Bernie Ecclestone are acting hopeless by blaming the teams for what happened. It is the FIA's fault...would they take the blame if the teams raced and someone died in a crash? If Ferrari had not played spoiltsport, we would have had a good GP. As it is, we all know that the big guns are looking to back out of F1 and looking for alteranative racing options. What would the FIA do then? Who would watch F1 then? I think Max and Bernie should somehow be overhauled from their positions and some people more efficient and ungreedy should take their place. U blame Michelin and the teams for this tragedy? What sort of common sense is that?
turbo_v12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st July 2005, 12:55   #29
Senior - BHPian
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: pune
Posts: 2,088
Thanked: 48 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo_v12
U blame Michelin and the teams for this tragedy? What sort of common sense is that?
If you are referring to US GP as "tragedy", you can refer to
this thread (2005 US Grand Prix) to understand what sort of common sense is that.
RX135 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st July 2005, 13:16   #30
Senior - BHPian
 
Shan2nu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Hubli - Karnata
Posts: 5,525
Thanked: 81 Times
Default

The fact that Michelin is the first one to come forward and refund the spectators, further strenghtens the fact that they played the biggest role in this and have realised it too.

If Michelin had nothing to do with it, they wouldn't have even bothered.

Shan2nu

Last edited by Shan2nu : 1st July 2005 at 13:24.
Shan2nu is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Michelin Tyre Woes: Fact or Fiction? (Michelin users please vote) greenhorn Tyre & Alloy wheel Section 163 12th September 2014 19:53
Advise on Laura tyres - Michelin Vs Pirelli Vs Michelin Ravveendrra Tyre & Alloy wheel Section 13 6th March 2010 13:30
Court hauls up GM India - Orders refund of Chevy Forester himanshugoswami The Indian Car Scene 4 12th June 2006 11:46


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 06:43.

Copyright 2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks