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Old 25th July 2010, 22:08   #46
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And while people slate Ferrari. Just see this video. A perfect example of how it should be done within the team. Perfect execution from Kovi. I think this got him the drive for 2009 with McLaren.
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Old 25th July 2010, 22:19   #47
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I think a good decision for a start.

If Ferrari go unpunished after today's farce, there is really no point in having that rule which bans team orders. What's most disgusting is the way Ferrari trying to cover up their act, while the whole world knows the truth.
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Old 25th July 2010, 22:37   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentEngine View Post
I think a good decision for a start.

If Ferrari go unpunished after today's farce, there is really no point in having that rule which bans team orders. What's most disgusting is the way Ferrari trying to cover up their act, while the whole world knows the truth.
I loved the race, but got a bit boring mid-way.

What a disgusting win for Ferrari's Alonso, Well done Massa.

Sad day for Force India.

So finally Red-Bulls were split and beaten.

Kubica is proving to be silent performer, what a good race he had.

While Schumi drove a great race, I did not like the way his Pit-stop was managed, What was the need to get Nico ahead of him Both the drivers are not going for the championship points anyways. Again for Mercedes GP, the only MUCH HYPED team, that are not going any further since they started this year, So its clear, we will not see Schumi on Podium this year.
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Old 25th July 2010, 22:45   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post
I loved the race, but got a bit boring mid-way.

What a disgusting win for Ferrari's Alonso, Well done Massa.
Mate, I am a Schumi Fan but I would admit he wasn't all clean and saintly. He was involved in a similar incident in Austria in 2002 and that was when the championship race wasn't this close. Look at the results that year, Ferrari demolished the field that season. Still they wanted Schumi to win that race.

But come to this year, a win is worth 25 points and it is very tight in the WDC race. What will a team-manager do? He must maximize the chance of his lead driver winning the championship. The team-mate is also required to co-operate for their team to win.
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Old 25th July 2010, 22:59   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post
I loved the race, but got a bit boring mid-way.

What a disgusting win for Ferrari's Alonso, Well done Massa.

Sad day for Force India.

So finally Red-Bulls were split and beaten.

Kubica is proving to be silent performer, what a good race he had.
Force India had one of their worst races today. They are reprimanded for their pitstop mistake.
autosport.com - F1 News: Force India reprimanded for tyre swap

Overall i think McLaren are the real winners of this race, with both Hamilton and Button maximizing their chances by finishing ahead of Webber. Button was again good with his tyre management in early part of the race, stretching his soft tyres to their limit and jumping webber in the process.
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Old 26th July 2010, 00:18   #51
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Having a driver who cannot defend properly does not allow you to use blatant team orders does it?
No it doesn't. But having a driver who doesn't understand that he is slower and dangerously shut down the corner on his teammate possibly creating a situation that would take both of them out warrants that.

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I don't know if you are watching same race. Massa did defend his position earlier. It was Alonso who couldn't overtake him, so had to get help from team order. Massa was forced to give up his place to let the real cry baby win. This is the most blatant team order one can get.
Yes. It is a team order. i never denied that. But Alonso clearly had the inside line on that curve. Massa cut sharply in front of Alonso's front wing. There also something called racing room. Why didn't Massa give that to Alonso and see who came up in front? Alonso has gone up barging against the side pods of other cars in similar situations.

And as Alex Yung commented at the end of the race - it is FIA that landed itself in the whole pickle by banning team orders in the first place. I don't see the logic there at all. F1 is still a team sport. Ferrari also has a policy of 1 and 2 drivers. And i am sure all team have such indirect ways of getting team orders across. How is FIA gonna distinguish what a team order sounds like??

Drive on,
Shibu

Last edited by shibujp : 26th July 2010 at 00:21.
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Old 26th July 2010, 00:40   #52
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So Massa did a Barrichello today...albeit unwillingly like his predecessor, all for his team Ferrari, the one which stuck with him through thick and thin. So what does it tell us.... that the team is bigger than the driver? Going by that same logic the sport itself is bigger than a team...isn't it ? Did we not see a mockery of the sport and its traditions again today ? On one hand FIA want to make overtaking easier and more exciting and on the other they let team orders decide who wins the race. Truly Farcical !

I think one true racing driver died out there at Hockenhiem, in the name of professionalism !
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Old 26th July 2010, 00:43   #53
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While it is understandable that in such a cut-throat sport with high stakes, teams would do what it takes to win both constructors and drivers championships - from an audience point of view I fully subscribe to @navpreet's view.

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I am a ferrari fan but i want to see exciting races.I'm not in there for seeing ferrari win the championship just by making team orders.I want to see racing.thats why i pay for the cable channel and that why i spend those 3 hours on a sunday for.RACING!
We wait eagerly for an exciting race, even if it be between team-mates. Not for, as Alex Yoong put it, 'manufactured' results.
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Old 26th July 2010, 00:44   #54
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A stormy press conference followed the race. If you thought the TV interviewer was asking pointed questions, wait till you hear what the press journalists were asking.

I usually go through the post-race transcripts of an interesting race. The transcript for German GP 2010 can be found on the Formula1 website here
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Old 26th July 2010, 09:22   #55
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Originally Posted by gomzi View Post
A stormy press conference followed the race. If you thought the TV interviewer was asking pointed questions, wait till you hear what the press journalists were asking.

I usually go through the post-race transcripts of an interesting race. The transcript for German GP 2010 can be found on the Formula1 website here
haha... thanks for the link mate ! the news reporters, they just ripped into Alonso, he was just lost for words. All this just makes him look stupid as well despite the fact that he is one of the most highly rated drivers in the paddock. Its just plan stupid, they keep harping about 42 points which Ferrari has garnered from the race.

check out the link below:

http://en.espnf1.com/ferrari/motorsp...ory/24408.html

So all in all, they concede that it was team orders. The FIA fines them for 100,000 USD. Its only getting worse, from a tampered race it now seems as if Ferrari bought out those 42 points(especially 25 in favor or Fernando Alonso) for 100,000 USD. FYI...they are not appealing against the claim made and are expecting FIA to be lenient.

Last edited by better4worse : 26th July 2010 at 09:28.
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Old 26th July 2010, 09:57   #56
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But something that is noteworthy about the top 3 teams.

Ferrari . Red-Bull and Mclarens, they all won a lap ahead of others

Their pace is never challenged by any teams so far.

DRIVER STANDINGS
01 Lewis Hamilton ---- 157
02 Jenson Button --- 143
03 Mark Webber --- 136
04 Sebastian Vettel -- 136
05 Fernando Alonso -- 123
06 Nico Rosberg --- 94
07 Robert Kubica ---- 89
08 Felipe Massa --- 85
09 Michael Schumacher -- 38
10 Adrian Sutil --- 35


CONSTRUCTOR STANDINGS
01 McLaren-Mercedes --- 300
02 RBR-Renault --- 272
03 Ferrari --- 208
04 Mercedes GP --- 132
05 Renault --- 96
06 Force India-Mercedes -- 47
07 Williams-Cosworth --- 31
08 BMW Sauber-Ferrari -- 15
09 STR-Ferrari --- 10
10 Lotus-Cosworth --- 0
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Old 26th July 2010, 09:59   #57
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It is especially funny coming after the Valencia race where Alonso whined about the race being "Manipulated" . I can understand team orders but I have never seen a team order being deployed after the driver who tried to overtake complained to the team.
Loved the question in the press conference where Alonso was asked if this win ranks up with Singapore .

Ferrari and Alonso are a match made in heaven by the way. Both are whiners and sore losers. This coming from a former Ferrari fan.
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Old 26th July 2010, 10:49   #58
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Originally Posted by shibujp View Post
Yes. It is a team order. i never denied that. But Alonso clearly had the inside line on that curve. Massa cut sharply in front of Alonso's front wing. There also something called racing room. Why didn't Massa give that to Alonso and see who came up in front? Alonso has gone up barging against the side pods of other cars in similar situations.

And as Alex Yung commented at the end of the race - it is FIA that landed itself in the whole pickle by banning team orders in the first place. I don't see the logic there at all. F1 is still a team sport. Ferrari also has a policy of 1 and 2 drivers. And i am sure all team have such indirect ways of getting team orders across. How is FIA gonna distinguish what a team order sounds like??

Drive on,
Shibu
I think Massa was quite fair in his driving yesterday. In the corner you are talking about, he was ahead of Alonso, so he had the right to that corner. Alonso got desperate and started whining like he always does.

About team orders, there is a rule put in place for a reason, to force teams not to make it so blatant. Teams orders have always been there, will be there in future too. But it's about a team wants to handle it.
If they wanted Alonso to win so desperately, they could have handled it little differently, like a delayed pit stop or asking Massa to go off the track somewhere. There was no need for the mockery of sport and insult to the intelligence of the viewers. As F1 fans we certainly need better from a team that consider themselves above the sport.

I also think that in the heat of the moment, Massa and Rob Smedly made their frustration clear with their actions and radio comments, which they might be ruing now.
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Old 26th July 2010, 11:39   #59
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"Good lad. Just stick with it now. Sorry. is what Massa's race engineer said to him in the closing stages of the race. This was also relayed on Television during the race telecast. I for one am disgusted and have lost whatever little respect I had for Ferrari.

No matter how many championships Alonso wins, fact is, he is a sore LOSER!

For the remainder of the season, I now back Hamilton and McLaren unconditionally. Go Hami Go!!
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Old 26th July 2010, 12:19   #60
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I just read the post race interview transcripts. I have yet to see such an explosive post race conference. Some of the questions were so pointed, Alonso had to duck for cover. LOL!!

This is a must read.

Note to mods: Missed the 20 min deadline so had to make a new post.
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