Go Back   Team-BHP > Buckle Up > Motor-Sports > Int'l Motorsport


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 8th November 2010, 22:24   #46
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: NAMMA BENGALURU
Posts: 5,613
Thanked: 2,454 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by amrisharm View Post
Please refrain from making such comments that serve no purpose what so ever but to start an argument. Constructive, informative posts are preferred.

Chill out buddy, everyone has their rights to voice out their opinion, thats the reasons threads are made for

Krf1 has a point, If Redbull would have done a Ferrari, in that case Alonso would have had a tough time being tied for points with Webber.

Last race will tell all, i am all but excited.
PAVAN KADAM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th November 2010, 22:31   #47
Senior - BHPian
 
Desmosedici's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 1,381
Thanked: 405 Times
Default

Agree with Pavan, Lets see what redbull has up their sleeve. I am still feeling that redbull team bosses will not intervene in the drivers cship and let their drivers drive the way they want to unlike a Ferrari. Although i am a huge fan of SF, i didnt like their team order stuff.

I am hoping for Webber to be crowned this season. Cool Guy and an amazing driver.
Desmosedici is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 8th November 2010, 23:13   #48
BHPian
 
amrisharm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: siliguri/Darj
Posts: 504
Thanked: 298 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PAVAN KADAM View Post
Chill out buddy, everyone has their rights to voice out their opinion, thats the reasons threads are made for

Krf1 has a point, If Redbull would have done a Ferrari, in that case Alonso would have had a tough time being tied for points with Webber.

Last race will tell all, i am all but excited.
Help ferrari fans, i am being attacked by RB supporters!

Lets see RB sticking to their principals if we see vettel leading in Abu Dhabi with webber in 2nd and Alonso in 3rd and the drivers championship at stake.

Like it or not Alonso is in a fighting chance of the drivers championship because of what ferrari did over the season with regards to supporting one driver over another. Also the form of massa in 2010 season in the end justified ferrari supporting alonso over him.

After all you are talking about a team (ferrari) that has won countless drivers championships including 5 straight ones (2000-2004) so i guess they know better than us mere mortals how championships are won.

Had RB put their weight of support behind webber a few races ago, then they would be celebrating the constructors + Drivers championship in brazil and not just the former.

To us f1 supporters whats the loss if our team does not win? a few hours of sadness and then we start to look forward to next race, next season.

Now think of what the teams gain and lose in terms of sponsorships, tv money, advertising, budgets, etc etc. So its easy for us sitting on our couches to take the moral high ground and criticize one team over another for bending the rules. But deep down inside we all know this is the biggest Motorsports event on the planet with hundreds of billions at stake here. So why are u all surprised to see a team doing what ever it possibly can get away with in order to win?

Had ferrari not bent the rules, this championship would have been a 2 horse race with the two redbull drivers fighting each other out with the rest out of contention after singapore. And where is the fun in that .
amrisharm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 00:10   #49
BHPian
 
yogi1771's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: mumbai
Posts: 631
Thanked: 14 Times
Default

Saw a ticker on Headlines today saying Vettel to help Webber in the next race.Here is a news link from an another site Vettel may help Webber - Motorsport - Sportal Australia
yogi1771 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 11:43   #50
Senior - BHPian
 
anachronix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Madras
Posts: 3,233
Thanked: 1,221 Times
Default

The team orders thing was a dirty thing to do by Ferrari.

But what would you call this?

1. Turkey 2010 - Incident between Jenson & Lewis
2. Turkey 2010 - Incident between Vettel & Webber
3. Silverstone 2010 - Vettel gets wings from Webber's car

1 & 2 are same where the former drivers were doing flying laps while the later was busy saving fuel only to be attacked by his teamate as a surprise. Horner & Whitmarsh dont deserve to even talk about team orders. And yeah, when its Ferrari it sounds all dirty & nasty.

@yogi1771, Horner has already hinted at something like its for the drivers to decide on track about who wants to help. I am sure they wont make it look obvious like what Ferrari did. But if there is a chance, Redbull will use team orders to make either of their drivers win.
anachronix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 12:03   #51
BHPian
 
2theMax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chennai
Posts: 337
Thanked: Once
Default

Being a Tifosi, still feel Webber must win the championship and exit gracefully. Pole is the key and hope Hamilton dosen't mess up the calculations.

And regarding Team orders..anyone remembers Timo Glock's contribution to WC in 2008 ? He wasn't on the same team was he ?
2theMax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 14:06   #52
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 189
Thanked: 6 Times
Default

It'll be naive to imagine team orders are not be issued at one point or the other. Allowing one driver to have the edge is not very different from team orders. They can be applied in many ways. Pit stops, fuel save, favouritism, new parts, etc.

Heard people mentioning Ferrari have mastered the art of team orders. I see it differently. Ferrari needs to learn from others how its done without making it so obvious. Others seems to have perfected it .

Now as things stands. The way I see it, RB seems to be in a dilemma. On one hand Webber has the better chance at the championship. On other hand, RB's future is with Vettel so they may not be very keen on pissing off Vettel by ordering him to make way for Webber. Again, if Vettel realizes during course of race that he has no chance of winning the championship and decides to move over on his own accord to allow Webber to pass, How many would buy that the championship was not manufactured?

Best deal for RB will be to let Webber take pole in qualifying. and hope Vettel can keep Alonso behind.

But if Hamilton takes pole, I think Ferrari would be most happy..for once.

I want Alonso to win, but then I want Webber to win as much. He often seems to be getting the short end of the stick. Besides I like him and he's towards the end of his prime. Btw, I kind of like Vettel too, despite his often kiddish behaviour, but then he's still growing up.. so.... and besides he can drive yeah.
kaynmantis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 14:42   #53
CPH
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: London
Posts: 577
Thanked: 33 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by anachronix View Post
The team orders thing was a dirty thing to do by Ferrari.

But what would you call this?

1. Turkey 2010 - Incident between Jenson & Lewis
2. Turkey 2010 - Incident between Vettel & Webber
3. Silverstone 2010 - Vettel gets wings from Webber's car

1 & 2 are same where the former drivers were doing flying laps while the later was busy saving fuel only to be attacked by his teamate as a surprise. Horner & Whitmarsh dont deserve to even talk about team orders. And yeah, when its Ferrari it sounds all dirty & nasty.

@yogi1771, Horner has already hinted at something like its for the drivers to decide on track about who wants to help. I am sure they wont make it look obvious like what Ferrari did. But if there is a chance, Redbull will use team orders to make either of their drivers win.
It was neither a surprise nor an attack. Vettel was always better on saving fuel than Webber and often being faster at the same time. Webber was not able to hold position for much longer. Therefore he was asked to let Vettel past as the saw Hamilton being a thread to both RB drivers, which would most likely kept both drivers finishing first and second.
CPH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 15:38   #54
Senior - BHPian
 
Hatari's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Calcutta
Posts: 1,568
Thanked: 364 Times
Default

The only reason Red Bulll are not stressing on equality is Webber is ahead of Vettel (their blue eyed boy)
He is also quicker than Webber, but is behind due to sheer bad luck

Vettel is their long term investment. Webber is about to retire.
Thats the reason they do not want to pressurize Vettel into anything

Though F1 is a team game. The team want the WDC more than the constructors.
Nobody remembers the constructors title only the WDC.

(This is also what a former team principal has been quoted saying)

Though the FIA awards the winning constructor in order of finishing (and not the drivers for their position)
the WDC is far more prestigious and valuable from a branding point of view

Last edited by Hatari : 9th November 2010 at 15:42.
Hatari is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 15:52   #55
Senior - BHPian
 
anachronix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Madras
Posts: 3,233
Thanked: 1,221 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CPH View Post
It was neither a surprise nor an attack. Vettel was always better on saving fuel than Webber and often being faster at the same time. Webber was not able to hold position for much longer. Therefore he was asked to let Vettel past as the saw Hamilton being a thread to both RB drivers, which would most likely kept both drivers finishing first and second.
Webber was not informed of anything according to Marko during that incident. As much as I have read, it was Webber who was running on fuel conserve mode and Vettel could easily catch up. The Mclarens catching up Vettel was simply cooked up by the Redbull team in their defence for the strategy.

If it was for real then, Webber would have been informed!

A quote by Marko about the Mclarens catching up and how they missed to inform Webber about this.

Quote:
“Webber was slower and Vettel had immense pressure from Hamilton,” Marko said on German television RTL. “Unfortunately, Mark was not told about the situation accurately by his race engineer,” he explained.
anachronix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 16:00   #56
Senior - BHPian
 
nitrous's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UAE/Lon/Madras
Posts: 6,965
Thanked: 266 Times
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatari
Vettel is also quicker than Webber, but is behind due to sheer bad luck
Bad luck, yeah, right.
He can't defend his position nor can he overtake if he's at any position other than at the front.

The total number of points he lost due to retirements this season is 96.
nitrous is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 16:06   #57
Senior - BHPian
 
anachronix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Madras
Posts: 3,233
Thanked: 1,221 Times
Default

^^ And Redbull would have sealed the Constructor Championship by the end of Europen round if they had good drivers!

Vettel needs more experience in a team like STR, while Webber should do a Coulthard
anachronix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 16:06   #58
BHPian
 
SilentEngine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Mangalore-Bangalore
Posts: 916
Thanked: 108 Times
Default

I am 100% sure that if in Abu Dhabi in the last few laps, if the running order is VET/WEB/ALO, Vettel will move over and let Webber win the WDC. This will be in best interests of the team, which will ensure that RBR get the No.1 on their car for next season.

Realistically, Vettel can be WDC only if Alonso has a DNF. I don't think Hamilton/Button/Kubica etc will have the cars to can finish ahead of Alonso. Alonso knows how to up his game, so he is almost sure of getting P3.
SilentEngine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 16:19   #59
Senior - BHPian
 
nitrous's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: UAE/Lon/Madras
Posts: 6,965
Thanked: 266 Times
Default

If Webber's at P1 and Alonso's not in P2, Alonso's going go BERSERK on the track.
He's probably going to carry a 9mm semi-automatic in his race suit.
He's just not going to be conservative in the last race which is the championship decider.
nitrous is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 9th November 2010, 16:30   #60
BHPian
 
SilentEngine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Mangalore-Bangalore
Posts: 916
Thanked: 108 Times
Default

It all depends if he can keep up with RBR's pace. As long as RBRs maintain some decent gap to him, he can't do much, expect praying for safety car.
I actually think there will be some anti climax where one or two title contenders crash into each other and making it easy for the third one. How would that be
SilentEngine is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2014 Brazilian GP - Autódromo José Carlos Pace (Interlagos) - Race Thread deetjohn Int'l Motorsport 24 12th November 2014 17:52
2013 Brazilian Grand Prix anachronix Int'l Motorsport 22 27th November 2013 16:13
Sao Paulo- Brazilian F1 Grand Prix EDIT: Jenson Button WDC, Brawn GP WCC PAVAN KADAM Int'l Motorsport 57 29th October 2009 18:55
Preidiction : Brazilian Grand Prix shailu Int'l Motorsport 125 27th October 2007 17:21
Meet: Brazilian Grand Prix at Czar Intercontinental 22nd Oct 06 Dippy The Team-BHP Meet Section 10 24th October 2006 03:01


All times are GMT +5.5. The time now is 01:22.

Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks