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Old 18th April 2012, 14:40   #61
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Default Re: Manza at 55k km's

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Originally Posted by amit1234singla View Post
I believe their margins on Selenia oil is very less and hence they don't encourage customers to use the same. Initially I was also told the same but then I could get it finally. If they also service Fiat cars, they will have it in stock. Ask them to show you the oil which they fill in Linea/ Punto diesel and you'll see that it's Petronas Selenia WR 5W40.

If you want to, you can easily source Manza OE oil filter outside. Just ask for Tata Quadrajet oil filter from a reputed spares shop. BTW, filter is same for Manza and Vista Quadrajet, Linea/ Punto diesel as well as swift diesel. So even if you can get Maruti Swift Diesel OE filter it should be okay. Just make sure it's OE filter (cost ~rs.375) and not the Purolater or Elofic one (which costs only ~rs.125).

AC in manza is reasonably good. It's not bone chilling but does the job perfectly fine I think. If you are very concerned about the cooling effectiveness in your car, check another manza and finally if required, get the AC system checked in next service.

Hope this helps.
Thanks Amit once again. Yes thats my whole point. Instead of making oil changes affordable to customers, they are bothered about margins and not selling something like Selenia. The whole process of hiding the oil inside their store and not offering it on even being asked is something to worry about as a trend from Tata Motors and their TASS
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Old 5th June 2012, 13:38   #62
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Default Re: Manza at 60k km's

Manza completed 60k kmís yesterday and is scheduled for the 60k km service on Friday, 8th June. Apart from usual service checks and fuel filter change, a couple of issues need to be looked into:
  1. AC condenser fan is not working. Manza has double fan set-up to cool radiator and AC condenser. As of now, one fan is doing overtime job as the other (lower one) is not working. Car is not overheating and I am keeping an eye on temp needle while in slow moving traffic.
  2. Engine mounts need to be checked as the car is jerking while accelerating or de- accelerating or when clutch is pressed or released. I think most likely, one or more engine mounts are gone
  3. Minor dashboard rattles coming from the area behind or on top of odometer console
  4. Front left side suspension is making a not so nice clunk type sound while going on uneven roads. Could be a loose suspension part or may need a part replacement (most likely ball joint?).
Any suggestions on the above? Iíll update the thread after service. Expecting a bill of around 4k or so assuming fan change will be in warranty.
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Old 9th June 2012, 14:29   #63
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Default Re: Manza at 60k km's

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Originally Posted by amit1234singla View Post
Manza completed 60k kmís yesterday and is scheduled for the 60k km service on Friday, 8th June. Apart from usual service checks and fuel filter change, a couple of issues need to be looked into:
  1. AC condenser fan is not working. Manza has double fan set-up to cool radiator and AC condenser. As of now, one fan is doing overtime job as the other (lower one) is not working. Car is not overheating and I am keeping an eye on temp needle while in slow moving traffic.
  2. Engine mounts need to be checked as the car is jerking while accelerating or de- accelerating or when clutch is pressed or released. I think most likely, one or more engine mounts are gone
  3. Minor dashboard rattles coming from the area behind or on top of odometer console
  4. Front left side suspension is making a not so nice clunk type sound while going on uneven roads. Could be a loose suspension part or may need a part replacement (most likely ball joint?).
Any suggestions on the above? Iíll update the thread after service. Expecting a bill of around 4k or so assuming fan change will be in warranty.
Got the 60k km service done yesterday. Cost rs.3,900 which is mainly for service charge, air and fuel filter change. Ac fan #2 was changed under EW (cost part + labor = rs.2,906). Other issues like suspension, engine mounts were either tightened or I was told they are okay. I need to to drive a bit more to see what issues remain in the car if any.

So now with the car at 60k km's, below is the summary of expenses I incurred on maintaining it.
  • Maintenance upto 50k km's - rs.30,000 (details in post #51)
  • 55k km Oil + Filter change - rs.2,600 (At TASS, Selenia WR 5W40)
  • 60k km paid service, fuel filter + air filter change - rs.3,900 (At TASS)
That's about rs.37k for 60k km's. Next service will be at 70k km's.

I have not had many warranty replacements so far in the car upto 60k km's. So far TATA had replaced parts below in warranty:

1. Right indicator stalk under SW - was working but creating mild tuk tuk sound when turning the steering left or right - cost around rs.600
2. AC Fan # 2 under SW - was working but creating vibrations when running - cost around rs.2,900
3. Vaccum modulater under SW - stopped working - cost around rs.3,000
4. AC Fan # 2 again replaced, this time under EW - stopped working - cost around rs.2,900. The new one had a cover at the end to keep dust out which was not there in earlier fan and I was told this is a design improvement.

So total of about rs.10k of warranty replacements so far which I think is not bad at all.

Latest FE is about ~17.5kmpl for a 50/50 mix of local and highway drives with 100% AC.

Got this service done at Oberoi Cars, Noida. ASC was pretty crowded with cars due Sterling Auto closing down TATA Fiat dealership in Noida. I was told they are servicing around 60 cars a day on weekdays and upto 75 on weekends. Pretty much eager to get cars out of the workshop. Only good thing about them is that they don't push for stuff like engine decarb, flush, injector cleaning etc. Infact, they don't even mentioned these.

Thank you for reading.
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Old 29th June 2012, 11:28   #64
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Default Re: Manza at 61k km's - Fan problem

I am not sure if I can call this the beginning of issues in my Manza as yet, but I have got a problem. As I mentioned above, AC/ Radiator Fan # 2 (lower one) was replaced under EW at 60k km's service.

Within 2 weeks of service, at 61k km's I noticed that now AC/ Radiator Fan # 1 (upper one) is not working. So as a result, in peak summers, with AC on, one fan has to do double time work to keep the car and engine cool enough. And I am always worried of overheating while driving, so watching the temp needle all the time.

I have been driving like this for last few days and need to find time to go to TASC. Simple solution will be to replace this fan as well, however I am worried if fans are conking off due to an electrical problem? The reason I am thinking of an electrical problem is because both upper and lower fans are powered by connecting to two power sockets which are next to each other. Last time when the fan was replaced, I asked the technician on how he ensured right power socket is connected to right fan he said it does not matter as both fans are same size and any one of them can work as primary and secondary fan. Seemed like a reasonable explanation. So if there is indeed an electrical issue in one socket (like fluctuating voltage), there is a possibility that earlier that socket was connected to lower fan, conked it off, then got connected to upper fan, conking it off as well.

hmmm.. may be I am thinking too much into the reasons for this happening. Please let me know what you guys think?

I am going to get the fan replaced in EW again, as soon as I find time for it. Hoping it really is fan giving away, because it will be nightmare to get an electrical issue sorted out properly at a TASC.

My bigger concern is that fans are not supposed to fail like this as they are critical parts failure of which can lead to engine damage. Never had similar concerns in 215k km's done in my two santros. What if Manza had only single fan set-up and I was not a bhpian?

Last edited by amit1234singla : 29th June 2012 at 11:49.
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Old 7th July 2012, 16:26   #65
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Got the AC fan replaced today. This was the upper fan which has been replaced for the first time. Lower one has been replaced twice.

Coolant auxilliary tank was found leaking as well. Was a minor leak so I did not notice earlier. Tank was also replaced. Both covered under EW. Cost parts+labor for both = rs.3,800. There was a monsoon check-up going on, so a free 15 point check up was also done.

With these replacements, I have already recovered EW price I paid with interest. And car is covered for another 1.5 years.

No issues in the car as of now. Hope it stays like this.

Ditched my usual Noida dealer for them being overcrowded and not able to meet my expectations in last two visits. Went to Him motors in patparganj for this work and had a much better experience. Will visit them in future for next services. Apparantly this dealership is managed by Concorde, a TATA subsidiary.

Many thanks to bhpian architect for sharing references at Him motors. It was really helpful architect. Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by architect View Post
...
EDIT - car is at 62.5k km's now.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 7th July 2012 at 16:27.
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Old 10th July 2012, 23:14   #66
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Quote:
Originally Posted by amit1234singla View Post
Many thanks to bhpian architect for sharing references at Him motors. It was really helpful architect.
My pleasure, Amit. One of the primary purposes of this forum is to have people help each other in maintaining their cars.
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Old 6th August 2012, 19:27   #67
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Default Re: Manza at 65k km's

2.5 years and 65k km's completed on Manza. So far so good. With two Punjab trips planned in August, Manza will probably cross 67k km's in August. Next service is at 70k km's which will require:

1. Oil/ filter change
2. Front brake pad replacement (1st change of brake pads)
3. Minor dashboard rattle fix

Front suspension is not in perfect shape but not in bad either as of now. I will probably push the suspension overhaul and do it outside of TASS (at my usual trusted FNG) at about 80-85k km's just before the tires are also going to be due for replacement.

Clutch is in good shape, probably will last over 100k km's. Battery is also going good (it's stock OE Exide).

Latest FE is 17.5 kmpl with a mix of 50-50 highway/ city driving with AC on 90% of time.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Wify's santro is going strong at 87.5k km's. It's a completely fill it, run it kind of car. I only drive this car once in a month or so to see if there are any issues and usually go to a mechanic for anything once in 6-7 months. Wife drives it almost 4 days in a week and monthly running is about 700-800 kms.
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Old 1st September 2012, 19:27   #68
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Default Re: Manza at 67.5k km's

Battery in my manza decided to go bad.

Everything was fine till about 2 weeks back. Then one fine day car decided not to start. Cranking was happening but at a lower speed and car was stopped for ~10 minutes after being driven for ~20km's. Even after 2-3 cranks car did not start. This was just outside Deeps office so I called asking him to come over for help. He has kind enough to see me (thanks Deepak) and in the mean time I disconnected and reconnected the negative terminal of the battery. So we tried once more and now the car started. Went to office and thought it to be a one off issue. After this car worked fine for a few days but cranking time was longer and starter motor seemed stressed at every crank. Also at every crank inside light started to flicker, including MID, fuel guage will dip to bottom and come back. All signs of weak battery. So decided to change the battery at next possible opportunity. This battery lasted 31 months and 67.5k km's, lowest life of all batteries I used till date.

I strongly feel the pro rata warranty in batteries is a sham so I decided to pick up a VFM battery with max replacement only warranty. Picked up Aamron Black 65ah battery today for rs.3,600 in exchange of old one. This has 18 months full replacement warranty. Fitted and the difference was visible in first crank itself. All electricals also worked as they should. OE battery was 60ah and I think 65 would do fine as well (infact better).

Also got the brake pads changed at my FNG about 10 days back. TVS brake pads for Vista and Manza diesel are same size and I got them for rs.850 (mrp rs.1,113). Also got a few small bit done like suspension bolts tightening, a dislodged bumper fixing etc. Along with this wheel alignment and wiper blade change. All of this included costed about rs.1,900. At last service TASS quoted rs.2,500 only for brake pad change. And the new pads are exactly same (even make) as old removed from the car.

So now with the car at 67.5k km's, below is the summary of expenses I incurred on maintaining it.
  • Maintenance upto 50k km's - rs.30,000 (details in post #51)
  • 55k km Oil + Filter change - rs.2,600 (At TASS, Selenia WR 5W40)
  • 60k km paid service, fuel filter + air filter change - rs.3,900 (At TASS)
  • 67.5k km Battery, brake pads, wiper blades, alignment etc - rs.5,500
That's about rs.42k for 67.5k km's. Next service will be at 70k km's and is expected to cost about rs.3.5k I think.

Thank you for reading.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 1st September 2012 at 19:30.
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Old 20th September 2012, 21:38   #69
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Default Re: Manza at 70k km's

Manza went in for 70k km service today. Not much of problems reported, except for a dashboard rattle behind the instrument cluster which I have been complaining for last 2 services. Other than this usual engine oil, oil filter, air filter replacement was required.

Dashboard rattle could not be fixed as they needed 2 days to rip the dashboard apart and fix back with some packing in between. Cost quoted was also high. I did not think there was a need to dismantle entire dashboard and was not sure how many new rattles it will result in. So decided to live with it for now.

Selenia WR 5W40 engine oil was filled at my request. Along with oil filter, air filter and service charge costed rs.3,750.

So now with the car at 70k km's, below is the summary of expenses I incurred on maintaining it.
  • Maintenance upto 50k km's - rs.30,000 (details in post #51)
  • 55k km Oil + Filter change - rs.2,600 (At TASS, Selenia WR 5W40)
  • 60k km paid service, fuel filter + air filter change - rs.3,900 (At TASS)
  • 67.5k km Battery, brake pads, wiper blades, alignment etc - rs.5,500
  • 70k km paid service, Oil + oil and air filter change - rs.3,750 (At TASS, Selenia WR 5W40)
That's about rs.46k for 70k km's. Next service will be at 80k km's and is expected to cost about high, about rs.8k I think, due to additional change of fuel filter, gear oil, brake fluid and coolant. Tires will need replacement by 85k km's.

Thank you for reading.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 20th September 2012 at 21:39.
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Old 6th November 2012, 06:47   #70
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Default Re: Manza at 73k km's

I usually interchange the used and spare key of my cars every year or so. This helps to ensure even wear on keys and brings out any issues in the spare remote lock if any.

So this weekend I picked up spare key for manza and put back the one which was being used earlier. Found out that the remote on spare was not working. Assuming a dead battery in remote lock, I opened it up at a friendly neighbourhood mobile shop and found out that it requires CR2016 battery but two of them. Got the batteries from another shop for rs.60 and replaced with earlier one's. Remote works as earlier.

2xCR2016's are in series (i.e. one on top of another), so making it a total of rated 6v batteries. So there is probably a risk in putting one CR2032 battery.

Changing the remote battery is a simple DIY job if one has a really small 4 corner screw driver and a precise hand.

Just thought of documenting the remote lock battery type. I guess it would be same for Vista as well.

Car is doing good otherwise. 73k km's as of now. Suspension overhaul and tyre change is nearby. Current set of 4 tyres is 48k km's old. Mileage for last 5k km's averages out to 18.3 kmpl.

Last edited by amit1234singla : 6th November 2012 at 06:54.
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Old 6th November 2012, 12:48   #71
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

Very nice thread. Impressed with the detailing. I am also now thinking of keeping record of all the payments/services etc of my Manza. It is just about 7+ months and I have already done 20k with all free service coupons exhausted.
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Old 23rd November 2012, 14:50   #72
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

having problem with manza engine after third free service. tata tasc filled 3.7 lit. oil. problem loss of power now drained extra oil with 20 ml. syringe. now the power getting better. the other problem now is engine temp. remaining very low that is 1/4 of temp. gauge. here in punjab now day temp. is 24 Celsius. both the fans are on when gauge shoes near red without ac on. please help.
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Old 26th November 2012, 18:54   #73
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

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Originally Posted by zmint View Post
having problem with manza engine after third free service. tata tasc filled 3.7 lit. oil. problem loss of power now drained extra oil with 20 ml. syringe. now the power getting better. the other problem now is engine temp. remaining very low that is 1/4 of temp. gauge. here in punjab now day temp. is 24 Celsius. both the fans are on when gauge shoes near red without ac on. please help.
Do you have the invoice with 3.7L oil billed? If so please raise it with Tata as this is sheer ignorance on dealer's part (and your's as well). Logging a compliant with Tata might also help if you have any serious engine or turbo issues in near future. Hoping the excess oil did not result in any serious damage, I would at the minimum have TASS open and clean intercooler as well as turbo to intercooler to air intake pipes. Most likely excess oil should have gone into intercooler. Finally I'd drain the oil completely in a clean pan and refill after measuring 3.2L.

For the temp guage, 1/4 mark is the normal for manza. During extended idling/ stop and go traffic, needle does go upto 1/2 mark but never above as fans kicks in to cool off the heat. This I understand is normal in Manza. Is it different in your car?
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Old 27th November 2012, 15:08   #74
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Default re: A story of 3 workhorses: 2 Santro's and a Manza, Edit: Santro sold, Manza at 100k+

thanks amit i have the invoice i will do the needful. temp. problem was due to cracked coolant reservoir cap solved by replacing it. will get the intercooler and intake pipes cleaned soon. will report back. thanks again.
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Old 21st January 2013, 11:52   #75
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Default Re: General update

So Manza is 200kmís short of 80k km mark and 10 days short of completing 3 years. Some major expenses are required on this car this month, but all of these are pretty normal so all is well.

These major expenses are:
1. Change of tires. Current set of 4 tires did 55k kmís
2. Major 80k km service. All fluids and filters are changed in this service (estimate ~rs.8k)
3. Suspension overhaul, 80k km done on original suspension; (estimate ~rs.10k)
4. Insurance renewal (estimate ~rs.6.5k with 50% NCB)

This weekend I did the tire change. OE size is 185/60/15 and I was running on 195/60/15. Due to Tata OE alloys being 5.5J wide, I was feeling there is excessive sidewall flex with 195ís. So this time I decided to stick to OE size. Spare was a 185/60/15 Bridgestone B250 used for only about 100 kmís but three year old. So I picked up my favorite Apollo Acelere four 185/60/15 tires @3,325 each. Exchanged back bridgestone spare at rs.3,800. Also gave back 3 worn out tires for rs.300. One of the good running tire was put as spare. I am okay with this as I use spare tire sparingly (did only 100 kmís in last 3 years). So now I have 4 new running tires and a used but good condition spare at a total cost of just rs.9,200. I think this is pretty cheap for tire change in a 15Ē size.

Surprisingly, Bridgestone B250 in this stock spec retails for a whopping rs.4,500 per tire so I was able to get rs.3,800 for old tire. Thanks to a friendly tire shop in Patiala, I am able to get new tires (and give old tires) at very good prices.

80k kmís service and suspension overhaul is scheduled for coming weekend. Will update as itís taken care of.

Just for the record, I am extremely happy with the reliability of this car. Some of the Tata veterans will find it surprising that I have never ever seen engine check light in my car for last 3 years and 80k kmís. This is despite of the fact that my car is from one of the initial lots of Manzas from Tata (Jan 2010 make). I think car is aging nicely and will be in very good condition after 80k km service and suspension work. Sedate driving, timely/ proper maintenance and ~2/3 of highway usage is also contributing to all of this.

BTW I am getting some awesome mileage on this car. Overall mileage during north winters w/o AC and 2/3rd of highway running is about 20.7 kmpl. With mostly 2-3 occupants and minimal luggage. Ainít this some mileage or should I be worried of engine running leaner than normal?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Wifeís reliable santro is doing the duty pretty well after 89k kmís and 6.5 years. Last month exhaust was found rusted and was leaking. This was promptly replaced (muffler/ middle part) at a nominal cost of rs.750. Rs.650 for muffler part; aftermarket but I found it to be pretty good quality / well coated and rs.100 for labor. Read somewhere that HASS charges some rs.3k total for the same work. Considering the nominal labor charge I left the old/ rusted piece with mechanic and he was happy.

Last oil change for this car was at 85k kmís in Jul 12 so the next oil change will be at 93k kmís or Jul 13 whichever is earlier. Pretty much a fill it, run it type of car.

Thank you for reading.
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